Nov 6, 2017, 3:33 am
Last edit by: irishguy28
Introduction
As you have been following the past thread, the Flying Blue programme will change as of 1 April 2018. In order to split the discussion from the earlier thread, we have created a new thread.
On 6 November Flying Blue has organised a press conference to inform the public about the changes to the programme. In addition, a mailing will be sent out to all members on the 6th and 7th of November and more information can be found on the designated website (link: https://explorefurther.flyingblue.com).
As an introduction, please find a summary of the changes below.
Please note that at the current time there is no difference expected to the benefits of the current tier.
Change 1: no more level miles, no more segments, but Experience Points
As of 1 April 2018 you will no longer earn level miles and segments per flight, but you will earn Experience Points (XP). The number of XP earned per flight depends on your cabin (multiplier times 2 for Premium Economy, 3 for business, 5 for La Premiere) and the type of flight (distinction between domestic, medium haul, long-haul 1/2/3).
For flights between 1 January – 31 March 2018 all earned level miles and segments will be converted into XP (1 segment = 7 XP; 1,000 level miles = 5 XP for members outside France). Please note that the highest conversion applies (it is not cumulative).
The number of XP required per tiers is:
- 100 for Silver;
- 180 for Gold;
- 300 for Platinum;
- 1,800 for Platinum Ultimate (in 2 years).
Please note that for current flyers who qualify on segments based on only intra-EU flights this could see an increase in the number of flights required. However, if you fly a mix if intra-EU and intercontinental (but qualify on segments), this will most likely see a reduction in the number of flights required to qualify.
For elite members, there is a roll-over of all XP above your tier threshold.
The rules for soft-landing have been extended. It is now no longer required to make at least 1 qualifying flight and in case you do not meet your threshold you will only drop one tier.
Change 2: number of miles earned dependent on fare paid (including fuel surcharge)
The number of award miles (for AF/KL/A5) earned is now depending on the fare paid (including fuel surcharge). Ivory members earn 4 miles per Euro, Silver 6, Gold 7 and Platinum 8.
Also earn award miles on AF/KL purchases (relating to seats, baggage and meals) according to the above schedule.
Earnings on partners remains as-is (based on fare class and distance flown).
Change 3: dynamic pricing of award tickets (on AF/KL/HV)
Another change will be that award tickets will have dynamic pricing, e.g. an award AMS-JFK could be more expensive than an award DUS-AMS-JFK. This is also in line with change 2, as flights from AMS are also more expensive than flights from DUS (you also earn more miles).
This also implies that we will see a difference in the number of miles required per flight. For example, an award from continental Europe to continental USA will currently set you back 25,000 miles for a one-way in economy. It does not matter if you fly to LAX or NYC, the number of miles is currently fixed. Under the new proposition, this will change. The cheaper flight (in this example: NYC) will see a slight reduction in the number of miles required, whilst LAX will see a slight increase in the number of miles required.
Furthermore, there will be a standard base level for the number of miles required per destination. As the standard revenue price increases, so does the number of award miles.
Change 4: status valid for 12 months (+ 3 months), personal membership year
FB will be moving away from membership year = calendar year (in case of upgrade of tier). Instead, FB will have an individual membership year. This means that after obtaining the higher tier, you will have 12 months to requalify. Benefit of this is that members are not bound by the calendar year (e.g. members who earn 20,000 level miles in a December of a given year and 20,000 level miles in January of the next year, do not have any benefit of their flights in case limited flights before/after).
I know some will feel that this is a significant downgrade compared to the current – at maximum – 27 months. Please note that based on FB information the majority of members (re)qualify in the last quarter of the year.
In addition, please note that for an Ivory member would like to go obtain Platinum in one year, as it will become more difficult, as (s)he will have to earn each threshold (so not 300 XP in the first year, but (100 + 180 + 300 = 580 XP).This is only applicable in the first year.
Change 5: changes to the co-branded American Express credit cards (FR/NL)
Currently you earn segments and level miles (on AF/KL purchases for Gold and Platinum card holders). This will change that you will receive additional XP when reaching your membership anniversary each year.
As you have been following the past thread, the Flying Blue programme will change as of 1 April 2018. In order to split the discussion from the earlier thread, we have created a new thread.
On 6 November Flying Blue has organised a press conference to inform the public about the changes to the programme. In addition, a mailing will be sent out to all members on the 6th and 7th of November and more information can be found on the designated website (link: https://explorefurther.flyingblue.com).
As an introduction, please find a summary of the changes below.
Please note that at the current time there is no difference expected to the benefits of the current tier.
Change 1: no more level miles, no more segments, but Experience Points
As of 1 April 2018 you will no longer earn level miles and segments per flight, but you will earn Experience Points (XP). The number of XP earned per flight depends on your cabin (multiplier times 2 for Premium Economy, 3 for business, 5 for La Premiere) and the type of flight (distinction between domestic, medium haul, long-haul 1/2/3).
For flights between 1 January – 31 March 2018 all earned level miles and segments will be converted into XP (1 segment = 7 XP; 1,000 level miles = 5 XP for members outside France). Please note that the highest conversion applies (it is not cumulative).
The number of XP required per tiers is:
- 100 for Silver;
- 180 for Gold;
- 300 for Platinum;
- 1,800 for Platinum Ultimate (in 2 years).
Please note that for current flyers who qualify on segments based on only intra-EU flights this could see an increase in the number of flights required. However, if you fly a mix if intra-EU and intercontinental (but qualify on segments), this will most likely see a reduction in the number of flights required to qualify.
For elite members, there is a roll-over of all XP above your tier threshold.
The rules for soft-landing have been extended. It is now no longer required to make at least 1 qualifying flight and in case you do not meet your threshold you will only drop one tier.
Change 2: number of miles earned dependent on fare paid (including fuel surcharge)
The number of award miles (for AF/KL/A5) earned is now depending on the fare paid (including fuel surcharge). Ivory members earn 4 miles per Euro, Silver 6, Gold 7 and Platinum 8.
Also earn award miles on AF/KL purchases (relating to seats, baggage and meals) according to the above schedule.
Earnings on partners remains as-is (based on fare class and distance flown).
Change 3: dynamic pricing of award tickets (on AF/KL/HV)
Another change will be that award tickets will have dynamic pricing, e.g. an award AMS-JFK could be more expensive than an award DUS-AMS-JFK. This is also in line with change 2, as flights from AMS are also more expensive than flights from DUS (you also earn more miles).
This also implies that we will see a difference in the number of miles required per flight. For example, an award from continental Europe to continental USA will currently set you back 25,000 miles for a one-way in economy. It does not matter if you fly to LAX or NYC, the number of miles is currently fixed. Under the new proposition, this will change. The cheaper flight (in this example: NYC) will see a slight reduction in the number of miles required, whilst LAX will see a slight increase in the number of miles required.
Furthermore, there will be a standard base level for the number of miles required per destination. As the standard revenue price increases, so does the number of award miles.
Change 4: status valid for 12 months (+ 3 months), personal membership year
FB will be moving away from membership year = calendar year (in case of upgrade of tier). Instead, FB will have an individual membership year. This means that after obtaining the higher tier, you will have 12 months to requalify. Benefit of this is that members are not bound by the calendar year (e.g. members who earn 20,000 level miles in a December of a given year and 20,000 level miles in January of the next year, do not have any benefit of their flights in case limited flights before/after).
I know some will feel that this is a significant downgrade compared to the current – at maximum – 27 months. Please note that based on FB information the majority of members (re)qualify in the last quarter of the year.
In addition, please note that for an Ivory member would like to go obtain Platinum in one year, as it will become more difficult, as (s)he will have to earn each threshold (so not 300 XP in the first year, but (100 + 180 + 300 = 580 XP).
Change 5: changes to the co-branded American Express credit cards (FR/NL)
Currently you earn segments and level miles (on AF/KL purchases for Gold and Platinum card holders). This will change that you will receive additional XP when reaching your membership anniversary each year.
Upcoming changes to Flying Blue in 2018
Dec 14, 2017, 9:19 am
#811
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: CPT,AMS
Posts: 4,412
You say the "ticket price" is €1687; your choice of terminology indicates that all charges, fees, and taxes - including YQ - are included.
Can you indicate the explicit breakdown of the ticket price from the website, like this?
(As I have no longhaul KL bookings, and therefore no separate YQ surcharges, I cannot verify your claim based on my bookings)
Can you indicate the explicit breakdown of the ticket price from the website, like this?
(As I have no longhaul KL bookings, and therefore no separate YQ surcharges, I cannot verify your claim based on my bookings)
Dec 14, 2017, 11:11 am
#812
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Netherlands
Programs: KL Platinum; A3 Gold
Posts: 28,742
Dec 15, 2017, 2:29 am
#813
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: GOT
Programs: KL Plat
Posts: 484
Just out of interest I priced up a GOT-MAN-GOT itinerary for October 2018 and can't understand the difference in miles earned when choosing Standard and Flex over Light fares. Below is the price calculation and miles earned. For arguments sake, call 10 SEK = 1 EUR.
So the Light fare, total cost 143 EUR, Ticket price 72.5 EUR. 72.5 * 4 gives 290, pretty much in agreement with the 294 miles stated on the Light fare.
So how then, by paying an extra 57.5 EUR which should be equivalent to 230 miles (I'm assuming the cost difference is wholly attributed to the Ticket price), does the Standard fare earn an extra 414 miles? Likewise, paying an extra 89 EUR to go from Standard to Flex earns no extra miles?!
A similar priced ticket for Jan 2018 gives 600 / 826 / 1200 for the three types.
Is this just a bug with the booking tool?
So the Light fare, total cost 143 EUR, Ticket price 72.5 EUR. 72.5 * 4 gives 290, pretty much in agreement with the 294 miles stated on the Light fare.
So how then, by paying an extra 57.5 EUR which should be equivalent to 230 miles (I'm assuming the cost difference is wholly attributed to the Ticket price), does the Standard fare earn an extra 414 miles? Likewise, paying an extra 89 EUR to go from Standard to Flex earns no extra miles?!
A similar priced ticket for Jan 2018 gives 600 / 826 / 1200 for the three types.
Is this just a bug with the booking tool?
Dec 15, 2017, 2:45 am
#815
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Netherlands
Programs: KL Platinum; A3 Gold
Posts: 28,742
The KLM website is not reliable when it comes to showing the mileage. This is a long-running bug.
Once you have actually made a booking - whether with KLM directly, or preferably with a third party offering a cheaper price [the fare will be the same, so this won't impact your XP earning] - the KLM website should correctly report the earning when you look at the reservation on their website.
Once you have actually made a booking - whether with KLM directly, or preferably with a third party offering a cheaper price [the fare will be the same, so this won't impact your XP earning] - the KLM website should correctly report the earning when you look at the reservation on their website.
Last edited by irishguy28; Dec 15, 2017 at 2:52 am
Dec 15, 2017, 2:49 am
#816
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: GOT
Programs: KL Plat
Posts: 484
The KLM website is not reliable when it comes to showing the mileage. This is a long-running bug.
Once you have actually made a booking - whether with KLM directly, or preferably with a third party offering a cheaper price [the fare will be the same, so this won't impact your XP earning] - the KLM website should correctly report the earning when you look at the reservation on their website.
Once you have actually made a booking - whether with KLM directly, or preferably with a third party offering a cheaper price [the fare will be the same, so this won't impact your XP earning] - the KLM website should correctly report the earning when you look at the reservation on their website.
Dec 15, 2017, 3:02 am
#817
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Netherlands
Programs: KL Platinum; A3 Gold
Posts: 28,742
Indeed. I've bought 4 tickets on KL in the last 2 weeks, and have saved €84,10 based on the "totals" reported by KLM.com for each ticket, and the amount actually paid to each travel agent. This also doesn't account for the 4*€10 booking fee also saved; and the fact that the prices offered by KLM, even stripping out the booking fee, were higher than the prices reported back when purchased everywhere. The savings based on blindly booking on KLM.com are therefore well above €130, or far more than I paid for any individual ticket.
After the GDS fee comes in, things will change - but I am still sure that it will be cheaper to shop around.
Perhaps not to the extent of effectively getting 1 of 4 tickets for free...but still, it pays to shop around ;-)
After the GDS fee comes in, things will change - but I am still sure that it will be cheaper to shop around.
Perhaps not to the extent of effectively getting 1 of 4 tickets for free...but still, it pays to shop around ;-)
Dec 15, 2017, 5:19 am
#818
Join Date: Dec 2017
Programs: Flying Blue Platinum
Posts: 223
First time post on here but been reading the forum for a long time. I am a Flying Blue Platinum member and have been for a few years gained through my work in Kazakhstan using Aeroflot / KLM to Orenburg (then taxi ride) via Amsterdam and Moscow. Also do a lot of flights going on holiday with my good lady to North America and various long weekends in Europe. When the system changes on April 1st, I will have 36 flights since January 1st which should be converted to 252 XP points.
I looked to take advantage of the generous conversation factor of 7 XP points per flight and ensure I have over 300 XP points when the system changes. I have therefore managed to book 8 flights for a total cost of £250. I live in Aberdeenshire and managed to get return flights to Marseille via Amsterdam from Aberdeen, Monday to Thursday and also return flights from Marseille back to Aberdeen same days. This means I can sleep in my own bed every night and not have to splash out on hotel costs.
I think I am correct in assuming that with 308 XP points at the time the new scheme starts, my platinum status should be good through to end of 2019 even with out earning any additional XP points? This would give me lots of time to gain another (at least) 300 XP points before end of 2019 my status should remain Platinum for another year or have I understood things wrongly?
I looked to take advantage of the generous conversation factor of 7 XP points per flight and ensure I have over 300 XP points when the system changes. I have therefore managed to book 8 flights for a total cost of £250. I live in Aberdeenshire and managed to get return flights to Marseille via Amsterdam from Aberdeen, Monday to Thursday and also return flights from Marseille back to Aberdeen same days. This means I can sleep in my own bed every night and not have to splash out on hotel costs.
I think I am correct in assuming that with 308 XP points at the time the new scheme starts, my platinum status should be good through to end of 2019 even with out earning any additional XP points? This would give me lots of time to gain another (at least) 300 XP points before end of 2019 my status should remain Platinum for another year or have I understood things wrongly?
Last edited by Billyfergus; Dec 15, 2017 at 5:56 am
Dec 15, 2017, 6:09 am
#819
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: HAG
Programs: Der 5* FTL
Posts: 8,065
Presuming that your 36 original flights don't end up making more than 1400 miles on average, your calculation seems correct. It's also a great deal you've found, working out at about 35 eur per segment.
So you'll have 44 flights by the time the system changes, 308XP. As I see it, that should be enough for Platinum come next period end (which should be 31.12/1.1 for you), with 8 points rolling over, plus whatever you earn between April and December 2018.
Good luck on moving towards Platinum for Life!
So you'll have 44 flights by the time the system changes, 308XP. As I see it, that should be enough for Platinum come next period end (which should be 31.12/1.1 for you), with 8 points rolling over, plus whatever you earn between April and December 2018.
Good luck on moving towards Platinum for Life!
Dec 15, 2017, 6:33 am
#821
Join Date: Dec 2017
Programs: Flying Blue Platinum
Posts: 223
Dec 15, 2017, 8:49 am
#823
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Netherlands
Programs: KL Platinum; A3 Gold
Posts: 28,742
Dec 15, 2017, 8:53 am
#824
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Netherlands
Programs: KL Platinum; A3 Gold
Posts: 28,742
If you increase in status as a result of the conversion to XPs on 1 April 2018, your membership year is realigned. If you are elevated to Platinum status from any lower status on 1 April 2018 next, your membership year gets changed to 1 April; you have Platinum only for 1 year from that date (until 31 March 2019; plus the "grace period" for which the issued Platinum card is valid for past this date, which we assume will remain as 3 months, so 30 June 2019, but bear in mind that that final 3 months is outside the membership year).
Dec 15, 2017, 9:05 am
#825
Join Date: Dec 2017
Programs: Flying Blue Platinum
Posts: 223
No, this is incorrect.
If you increase in status as a result of the conversion to XPs on 1 April 2018, your membership year is realigned. If you are elevated to Platinum status from any lower status on 1 April 2018 next, your membership year gets changed to 1 April; you have Platinum only for 1 year from that date (until 31 March 2019; plus the "grace period" for which the issued Platinum card is valid for past this date, which we assume will remain as 3 months, so 30 June 2019, but bear in mind that that final 3 months is outside the membership year).
If you increase in status as a result of the conversion to XPs on 1 April 2018, your membership year is realigned. If you are elevated to Platinum status from any lower status on 1 April 2018 next, your membership year gets changed to 1 April; you have Platinum only for 1 year from that date (until 31 March 2019; plus the "grace period" for which the issued Platinum card is valid for past this date, which we assume will remain as 3 months, so 30 June 2019, but bear in mind that that final 3 months is outside the membership year).