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Old Nov 6, 2017, 3:33 am
FlyerTalk Forums Expert How-Tos and Guides
Last edit by: irishguy28
Introduction

As you have been following the past thread, the Flying Blue programme will change as of 1 April 2018. In order to split the discussion from the earlier thread, we have created a new thread.

On 6 November Flying Blue has organised a press conference to inform the public about the changes to the programme. In addition, a mailing will be sent out to all members on the 6th and 7th of November and more information can be found on the designated website (link: https://explorefurther.flyingblue.com).

As an introduction, please find a summary of the changes below.

Please note that at the current time there is no difference expected to the benefits of the current tier.

Change 1: no more level miles, no more segments, but Experience Points

As of 1 April 2018 you will no longer earn level miles and segments per flight, but you will earn Experience Points (XP). The number of XP earned per flight depends on your cabin (multiplier times 2 for Premium Economy, 3 for business, 5 for La Premiere) and the type of flight (distinction between domestic, medium haul, long-haul 1/2/3).

For flights between 1 January – 31 March 2018 all earned level miles and segments will be converted into XP (1 segment = 7 XP; 1,000 level miles = 5 XP for members outside France). Please note that the highest conversion applies (it is not cumulative).

The number of XP required per tiers is:
- 100 for Silver;
- 180 for Gold;
- 300 for Platinum;
- 1,800 for Platinum Ultimate (in 2 years).

Please note that for current flyers who qualify on segments based on only intra-EU flights this could see an increase in the number of flights required. However, if you fly a mix if intra-EU and intercontinental (but qualify on segments), this will most likely see a reduction in the number of flights required to qualify.
For elite members, there is a roll-over of all XP above your tier threshold.

The rules for soft-landing have been extended. It is now no longer required to make at least 1 qualifying flight and in case you do not meet your threshold you will only drop one tier.

Change 2: number of miles earned dependent on fare paid (including fuel surcharge)

The number of award miles (for AF/KL/A5) earned is now depending on the fare paid (including fuel surcharge). Ivory members earn 4 miles per Euro, Silver 6, Gold 7 and Platinum 8.

Also earn award miles on AF/KL purchases (relating to seats, baggage and meals) according to the above schedule.

Earnings on partners remains as-is (based on fare class and distance flown).

Change 3: dynamic pricing of award tickets (on AF/KL/HV)

Another change will be that award tickets will have dynamic pricing, e.g. an award AMS-JFK could be more expensive than an award DUS-AMS-JFK. This is also in line with change 2, as flights from AMS are also more expensive than flights from DUS (you also earn more miles).

This also implies that we will see a difference in the number of miles required per flight. For example, an award from continental Europe to continental USA will currently set you back 25,000 miles for a one-way in economy. It does not matter if you fly to LAX or NYC, the number of miles is currently fixed. Under the new proposition, this will change. The cheaper flight (in this example: NYC) will see a slight reduction in the number of miles required, whilst LAX will see a slight increase in the number of miles required.

Furthermore, there will be a standard base level for the number of miles required per destination. As the standard revenue price increases, so does the number of award miles.

Change 4: status valid for 12 months (+ 3 months), personal membership year

FB will be moving away from membership year = calendar year (in case of upgrade of tier). Instead, FB will have an individual membership year. This means that after obtaining the higher tier, you will have 12 months to requalify. Benefit of this is that members are not bound by the calendar year (e.g. members who earn 20,000 level miles in a December of a given year and 20,000 level miles in January of the next year, do not have any benefit of their flights in case limited flights before/after).

I know some will feel that this is a significant downgrade compared to the current – at maximum – 27 months. Please note that based on FB information the majority of members (re)qualify in the last quarter of the year.

In addition, please note that for an Ivory member would like to go obtain Platinum in one year, as it will become more difficult, as (s)he will have to earn each threshold (so not 300 XP in the first year, but (100 + 180 + 300 = 580 XP). This is only applicable in the first year.

Change 5: changes to the co-branded American Express credit cards (FR/NL)

Currently you earn segments and level miles (on AF/KL purchases for Gold and Platinum card holders). This will change that you will receive additional XP when reaching your membership anniversary each year.
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Old May 21, 2018, 9:53 am
  #1606  
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Originally Posted by Keter
Actually I recalculated now and i got almost 100% of miles which are due for the 2nd fare component (EUR 377.5) for my PAR-HEL flight. Slightly more. So something is absolutely wrong here, maybe this autoadjusts later when i get the miles for other segments posted. We will see...

And yes, PAR-HEL distance was around 16% of the 2nd fare component distance.
This is clearly an abnormal situation overall so I doubt that any conclusion can be drawn from this of wider significance beyond your very own individual case.
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Old May 21, 2018, 10:10 am
  #1607  
siw
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
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Originally Posted by Macaron54

From the sublime to the ridiculous (was it ever sublime? ). The FB program in its revamped version has become a complete tomfoolery. I just checked my FB account and realized that I gain more miles on short, domestic flights on DL than on long-haul, transatlantic flights on AF or KL. Case in point, a flight from Chicago to Boston in W yields over 2,500 miles, whereas a flight from Boston to Paris in W gives me 2,200 miles. What a sad joke! Of course, the XPs gained with the former won't help towards the Ultimate status, while the latter does, but at this point, do I really care?

Macaron54

Don't you very high mileage/valued frequent flyers (FB Ultimate etc.) get invited to meet/question FB management at presentations/functions etc.? It would be interesting for the experts here to quiz the FB higher-ups on these points and their resaons without the middle management layer of worthless (incorrect sometimes) marketing nonsense/propaganda: e.g. I've had on the PSL "on feedback from our customers the program has been improved and simplified" and other such rubbish.
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Old May 21, 2018, 12:14 pm
  #1608  
 
Join Date: Feb 2018
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Getting 3700 miles in Y travelling BGO-AMS-PTY-AMS-BGO doesn't seem very much. It has to be about 1/4 of the actual miles flown.....!
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Old May 21, 2018, 1:07 pm
  #1609  
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
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Originally Posted by beachmouse
As someone who does 4-5 domestic round trip Delta flights sans status, I'm actually wondering if it's worth it to start crediting relatively inexpensive W fares to FB instead if I'm going to get more miles that way than by Sky Miles proper.
Well, I would stick with the Sky Miles program on two grounds. First, you do get more miles per US$ spent (definitely a more generous miles accrual scheme at DL). Second, on domestic flights, regardless of your Sky Miles status, you will get far better recognition than an FB Ultimate. This morning, on a flight to LGA, I was ranking last on the upgrade list and never cleared. I still had a lot of people in front of me, and the last upgraded PAX was Sky Miles silver medallion (so much for feeling special as an Ultimate wherever you fly ). Amusingly enough, the DL ground staff still gives you the excuse of a reciprocity measure (DL favors its own people, whilst AFKL does the same for its customers). Really? Since when does AFKL have a systematic courtesy-upgrade policy? On any flight, AFKL never offers complimentary upgrades to its PAXs, including its most loyal ones, unless the flight is oversold. Just not part of its culture.

Macaron54

Last edited by Macaron54; May 21, 2018 at 1:40 pm
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Old May 21, 2018, 1:07 pm
  #1610  
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Old May 21, 2018, 1:18 pm
  #1611  
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Originally Posted by Keter
Actually I recalculated now and i got almost 100% of miles which are due for the 2nd fare component (EUR 377.5) for my PAR-HEL flight. Slightly more. So something is absolutely wrong here, maybe this autoadjusts later when i get the miles for other segments posted. We will see...
Sorry, but it is still impossible to understand your story and whether there is something abnormal in. Please tell us (if you wish of course), your routing, price (before tax + YQ), if you were booked under AF/KL code or another one, etc etc

Originally Posted by Keter
And yes, PAR-HEL distance was around 16% of the 2nd fare component distance.
The distance is irrelevant for the new FB rules. Each component of a multi leg trip posts as per its fare component in the total fare paid. You can see an example of this I have posted for a CDG-AMS-BKK and return trip on page 106 of this thread.
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Old May 21, 2018, 6:02 pm
  #1612  
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Originally Posted by Goldorak
Sorry, but it is still impossible to understand your story and whether there is something abnormal in. Please tell us (if you wish of course), your routing, price (before tax + YQ), if you were booked under AF/KL code or another one, etc etc
I don't think that I would post that info publicly and attract attention to it if I were the OP as it sounds like he might have been attributed more miles than he should have received. The distance is relevant in the sense that, if I got it right, what the OP is saying is that he has an itinerary like AAA-BBB-CCC-DDD which has cost him €ZZZ and where he has only done the AAA-BBB segment which represents a small fraction of the whole itinerary and has nonetheless received miles corresponding to the the total €ZZZ cost as if he had flown the whole AAA-BBB-CCC-DDD.

The distance is irrelevant for the new FB rules. Each component of a multi leg trip posts as per its fare component in the total fare paid. You can see an example of this I have posted for a CDG-AMS-BKK and return trip on page 106 of this thread.
It is preferable to refer to post numbers rather than page numbers as we do not paginate in the same way. For instance, I have 40 posts per page and therefore only have 41 pages for the whole thread so I would struggle to find a post on page 106.
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Old May 21, 2018, 8:03 pm
  #1613  
 
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Does anyone know how miles are earned on "Bulk" tickets? I have flights that are booked in Z class on Air France flight numbers (but Delta operated) and I don't see anything which talks about how we will earn on these tickets. Will it be based on the "old" earning chart since there is not fare value on the ticket?
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Old May 21, 2018, 9:21 pm
  #1614  
 
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Originally Posted by Goldorak
Sorry, but it is still impossible to understand your story and whether there is something abnormal in. Please tell us (if you wish of course), your routing, price (before tax + YQ), if you were booked under AF/KL code or another one, etc etc.
+1

Also might be useful to understand why the ticket was reissued and recalculated.
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Old May 22, 2018, 12:13 am
  #1615  
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Originally Posted by NickB
I don't think that I would post that info publicly and attract attention to it if I were the OP as it sounds like he might have been attributed more miles than he should have received. The distance is relevant in the sense that, if I got it right, what the OP is saying is that he has an itinerary like AAA-BBB-CCC-DDD which has cost him €ZZZ and where he has only done the AAA-BBB segment which represents a small fraction of the whole itinerary and has nonetheless received miles corresponding to the the total €ZZZ cost as if he had flown the whole AAA-BBB-CCC-DDD.
You're good to have been able to understand this in OP's story ! We heard also about rebooking, ticket reissued, etc...all very confusing.

Originally Posted by NickB
It is preferable to refer to post numbers rather than page numbers as we do not paginate in the same way. For instance, I have 40 posts per page and therefore only have 41 pages for the whole thread so I would struggle to find a post on page 106.
Sorry, didn't know there were several configuration of the site (I have 15 posts per page). The post I was quoting is #1589.
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Old May 22, 2018, 12:13 am
  #1616  
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Originally Posted by PDXbased1K
Does anyone know how miles are earned on "Bulk" tickets? I have flights that are booked in Z class on Air France flight numbers (but Delta operated) and I don't see anything which talks about how we will earn on these tickets. Will it be based on the "old" earning chart since there is not fare value on the ticket?
Pardon my ignorance, but what are "bulk tickets" ? Is that for groups ?
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Old May 22, 2018, 2:07 am
  #1617  
 
Join Date: May 2017
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Either that, or it could be a Flight Bundle (can't find the same link for Air France / Hop flights).
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Old May 22, 2018, 3:30 am
  #1618  
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
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Originally Posted by NickB
I don't think that I would post that info publicly and attract attention to it if I were the OP as it sounds like he might have been attributed more miles than he should have received. The distance is relevant in the sense that, if I got it right, what the OP is saying is that he has an itinerary like AAA-BBB-CCC-DDD which has cost him €ZZZ and where he has only done the AAA-BBB segment which represents a small fraction of the whole itinerary and has nonetheless received miles corresponding to the the total €ZZZ cost as if he had flown the whole AAA-BBB-CCC-DDD.
Right, as the issue does not seem to be common I will keep details to myself. To clafiry after I used several segments i made voluntary changes 2 times and then last segment was posted in a very strage but nice way.

The distance is relevant as this is how the miles per EUR spent are allocated between individual flights.
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Old May 22, 2018, 4:51 am
  #1619  
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Originally Posted by Xandrios
One question regarding award miles on other carriers: Is there still a minimum earning, like in the past? Can't really find anything on this through the (rather minimal) FB website.
Minimum distance is no longer the case. I flew AZ AMS-LIN in D class. The math is:

Actual distance: 517
Cabin bonus: 200%
Elite bonus: 75%
Award miles received: 1419

So this only matches up if: No minimum distance is used (all calculations based on 517 miles), and, the elite bonus only applies on the base distance (not on top of the cabin bonus).

(517 * 2) + (517 * 0.75) = 1422 miles

The minimum distance used to be 750 if I remember correctly. Class bonus seems to have applied on that as well in the past. So if there was still a minimum distance then the calculation should have been:

(750 * 2) + (750 * 0.75) = 2063 miles

That's about 50% more for short flights like these!

Still, I received almost 8K miles for a AMS-LIN-ATH r/t - which is about 5K more than what I would have received if the miles were calculated based on the fare price. But..this is definitely a change, and partner airlines do indeed earn less than they used to.

Last edited by Xandrios; May 22, 2018 at 4:57 am
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Old May 22, 2018, 6:15 am
  #1620  
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Originally Posted by Xandrios
Minimum distance is no longer the case.
According to Example 2 of the "Hoe het werkt" explanation page linked to from every partner page, it does. The only short-haul example is on Tarom, for which they state that there is a 500 miles minimum amount for domestic RO flights. Note that neither the Tarom partner page ( nor Alitalia, nor any other that I can see) mention the existence of minimum miles or what the relevant numbers are, for the partners.

EDIT: In the "old" FB, the minimum distance for AZ was 500miles.
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Last edited by irishguy28; May 22, 2018 at 7:44 am
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