Last edit by: irishguy28
Introduction
As you have been following the past thread, the Flying Blue programme will change as of 1 April 2018. In order to split the discussion from the earlier thread, we have created a new thread.
On 6 November Flying Blue has organised a press conference to inform the public about the changes to the programme. In addition, a mailing will be sent out to all members on the 6th and 7th of November and more information can be found on the designated website (link: https://explorefurther.flyingblue.com).
As an introduction, please find a summary of the changes below.
Please note that at the current time there is no difference expected to the benefits of the current tier.
Change 1: no more level miles, no more segments, but Experience Points
As of 1 April 2018 you will no longer earn level miles and segments per flight, but you will earn Experience Points (XP). The number of XP earned per flight depends on your cabin (multiplier times 2 for Premium Economy, 3 for business, 5 for La Premiere) and the type of flight (distinction between domestic, medium haul, long-haul 1/2/3).
For flights between 1 January – 31 March 2018 all earned level miles and segments will be converted into XP (1 segment = 7 XP; 1,000 level miles = 5 XP for members outside France). Please note that the highest conversion applies (it is not cumulative).
The number of XP required per tiers is:
- 100 for Silver;
- 180 for Gold;
- 300 for Platinum;
- 1,800 for Platinum Ultimate (in 2 years).
Please note that for current flyers who qualify on segments based on only intra-EU flights this could see an increase in the number of flights required. However, if you fly a mix if intra-EU and intercontinental (but qualify on segments), this will most likely see a reduction in the number of flights required to qualify.
For elite members, there is a roll-over of all XP above your tier threshold.
The rules for soft-landing have been extended. It is now no longer required to make at least 1 qualifying flight and in case you do not meet your threshold you will only drop one tier.
Change 2: number of miles earned dependent on fare paid (including fuel surcharge)
The number of award miles (for AF/KL/A5) earned is now depending on the fare paid (including fuel surcharge). Ivory members earn 4 miles per Euro, Silver 6, Gold 7 and Platinum 8.
Also earn award miles on AF/KL purchases (relating to seats, baggage and meals) according to the above schedule.
Earnings on partners remains as-is (based on fare class and distance flown).
Change 3: dynamic pricing of award tickets (on AF/KL/HV)
Another change will be that award tickets will have dynamic pricing, e.g. an award AMS-JFK could be more expensive than an award DUS-AMS-JFK. This is also in line with change 2, as flights from AMS are also more expensive than flights from DUS (you also earn more miles).
This also implies that we will see a difference in the number of miles required per flight. For example, an award from continental Europe to continental USA will currently set you back 25,000 miles for a one-way in economy. It does not matter if you fly to LAX or NYC, the number of miles is currently fixed. Under the new proposition, this will change. The cheaper flight (in this example: NYC) will see a slight reduction in the number of miles required, whilst LAX will see a slight increase in the number of miles required.
Furthermore, there will be a standard base level for the number of miles required per destination. As the standard revenue price increases, so does the number of award miles.
Change 4: status valid for 12 months (+ 3 months), personal membership year
FB will be moving away from membership year = calendar year (in case of upgrade of tier). Instead, FB will have an individual membership year. This means that after obtaining the higher tier, you will have 12 months to requalify. Benefit of this is that members are not bound by the calendar year (e.g. members who earn 20,000 level miles in a December of a given year and 20,000 level miles in January of the next year, do not have any benefit of their flights in case limited flights before/after).
I know some will feel that this is a significant downgrade compared to the current – at maximum – 27 months. Please note that based on FB information the majority of members (re)qualify in the last quarter of the year.
In addition, please note that for an Ivory member would like to go obtain Platinum in one year, as it will become more difficult, as (s)he will have to earn each threshold (so not 300 XP in the first year, but (100 + 180 + 300 = 580 XP).This is only applicable in the first year.
Change 5: changes to the co-branded American Express credit cards (FR/NL)
Currently you earn segments and level miles (on AF/KL purchases for Gold and Platinum card holders). This will change that you will receive additional XP when reaching your membership anniversary each year.
As you have been following the past thread, the Flying Blue programme will change as of 1 April 2018. In order to split the discussion from the earlier thread, we have created a new thread.
On 6 November Flying Blue has organised a press conference to inform the public about the changes to the programme. In addition, a mailing will be sent out to all members on the 6th and 7th of November and more information can be found on the designated website (link: https://explorefurther.flyingblue.com).
As an introduction, please find a summary of the changes below.
Please note that at the current time there is no difference expected to the benefits of the current tier.
Change 1: no more level miles, no more segments, but Experience Points
As of 1 April 2018 you will no longer earn level miles and segments per flight, but you will earn Experience Points (XP). The number of XP earned per flight depends on your cabin (multiplier times 2 for Premium Economy, 3 for business, 5 for La Premiere) and the type of flight (distinction between domestic, medium haul, long-haul 1/2/3).
For flights between 1 January – 31 March 2018 all earned level miles and segments will be converted into XP (1 segment = 7 XP; 1,000 level miles = 5 XP for members outside France). Please note that the highest conversion applies (it is not cumulative).
The number of XP required per tiers is:
- 100 for Silver;
- 180 for Gold;
- 300 for Platinum;
- 1,800 for Platinum Ultimate (in 2 years).
Please note that for current flyers who qualify on segments based on only intra-EU flights this could see an increase in the number of flights required. However, if you fly a mix if intra-EU and intercontinental (but qualify on segments), this will most likely see a reduction in the number of flights required to qualify.
For elite members, there is a roll-over of all XP above your tier threshold.
The rules for soft-landing have been extended. It is now no longer required to make at least 1 qualifying flight and in case you do not meet your threshold you will only drop one tier.
Change 2: number of miles earned dependent on fare paid (including fuel surcharge)
The number of award miles (for AF/KL/A5) earned is now depending on the fare paid (including fuel surcharge). Ivory members earn 4 miles per Euro, Silver 6, Gold 7 and Platinum 8.
Also earn award miles on AF/KL purchases (relating to seats, baggage and meals) according to the above schedule.
Earnings on partners remains as-is (based on fare class and distance flown).
Change 3: dynamic pricing of award tickets (on AF/KL/HV)
Another change will be that award tickets will have dynamic pricing, e.g. an award AMS-JFK could be more expensive than an award DUS-AMS-JFK. This is also in line with change 2, as flights from AMS are also more expensive than flights from DUS (you also earn more miles).
This also implies that we will see a difference in the number of miles required per flight. For example, an award from continental Europe to continental USA will currently set you back 25,000 miles for a one-way in economy. It does not matter if you fly to LAX or NYC, the number of miles is currently fixed. Under the new proposition, this will change. The cheaper flight (in this example: NYC) will see a slight reduction in the number of miles required, whilst LAX will see a slight increase in the number of miles required.
Furthermore, there will be a standard base level for the number of miles required per destination. As the standard revenue price increases, so does the number of award miles.
Change 4: status valid for 12 months (+ 3 months), personal membership year
FB will be moving away from membership year = calendar year (in case of upgrade of tier). Instead, FB will have an individual membership year. This means that after obtaining the higher tier, you will have 12 months to requalify. Benefit of this is that members are not bound by the calendar year (e.g. members who earn 20,000 level miles in a December of a given year and 20,000 level miles in January of the next year, do not have any benefit of their flights in case limited flights before/after).
I know some will feel that this is a significant downgrade compared to the current – at maximum – 27 months. Please note that based on FB information the majority of members (re)qualify in the last quarter of the year.
In addition, please note that for an Ivory member would like to go obtain Platinum in one year, as it will become more difficult, as (s)he will have to earn each threshold (so not 300 XP in the first year, but (100 + 180 + 300 = 580 XP).
Change 5: changes to the co-branded American Express credit cards (FR/NL)
Currently you earn segments and level miles (on AF/KL purchases for Gold and Platinum card holders). This will change that you will receive additional XP when reaching your membership anniversary each year.
Upcoming changes to Flying Blue in 2018
#1531
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Netherlands
Programs: KL Platinum; A3 Gold
Posts: 28,744
There is no XP earning for AFKL spend. That you exceptionally got these is because the "Level Miles" that were earned prior to 1 April had not been present in your account at the time of the conversion.
#1532
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: AMS
Programs: Flying Blue Platinum | Flying Blue Petroleum | Hilton Gold | Marriott Gold | Shangri-La Jade
Posts: 306
I figured, but part of the AF/KL spend was done after April 1st... Well, at least for now I'm quite happy with some unexpected XP
#1533
#1536
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Paris, France
Programs: AF/KL Flying Blue Platinum for life/Club2000 Ultimate, Accor ALL Diamond
Posts: 21,935
I got 258 miles for a CDG-AMS in J (part of a long-haul itinerary in J via AMS on KL), while it would have been 1875 miles before! It’s hurting
#1539
#1540
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Netherlands
Programs: KL Platinum; A3 Gold
Posts: 28,744
#1541
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: HAG
Programs: Der 5* FTL
Posts: 8,065
#1542
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: NYC
Programs: BA BAEC Gold (oW Emerald), AF/KLM FB Plat (ST E+), *Alliance Nada
Posts: 299
DL Miles & Cash: Impact on FB XP
According to the new "Flight type simulator" any US domestic flight will earn XP according to the domestic column of the XP chart. A US-Canada flight will earn in Medium (JFK-YUL) or Long 1 (JFK-YVR) columns of the XP chart. The logic behind it is solid in a way but in another way earning 2 XP for a 45 minute flight compared to earning 2 XP for a JFK-SFO or other transcontinental flight is not right.
The Delta earnings page (for Miles) shows a breakdown of which "category" the specific fares will fall in. You'll note they split it up into Delta International Long Haul and Delta Domestic & Regional International. The takeaway is that Delta First Class will fall into the Business Class segment when earning XP points. For Miles the earning rate is as it was before for "First Class". I've noticed that depending on the way the trip is ticketed, you can have a International Long Haul fare bucket (say, Z bucket) on a Delta Domestic or Regional International flight (ie. one of my upcoming trips has a segment ATL-JFK in the Z bucket instead of one of the "First Class" buckets).
Below bold is my added emphasis.
The Delta earnings page (for Miles) shows a breakdown of which "category" the specific fares will fall in. You'll note they split it up into Delta International Long Haul and Delta Domestic & Regional International. The takeaway is that Delta First Class will fall into the Business Class segment when earning XP points. For Miles the earning rate is as it was before for "First Class". I've noticed that depending on the way the trip is ticketed, you can have a International Long Haul fare bucket (say, Z bucket) on a Delta Domestic or Regional International flight (ie. one of my upcoming trips has a segment ATL-JFK in the Z bucket instead of one of the "First Class" buckets).
Below bold is my added emphasis.
Hello:
To follow-up on this conversation, and under the new FB rules, I devised the following strategy:
- Open a DL SkyMiles account and post all my TransCon DeltaOne (Business Class) flights on it, since there is no point to do it on FB as those flights are treated as domestic and award very minimal XP (6XP). Additionnally, I open an Amex Delta Platinum credit card, and even got a nice 70,000 bonus SkyMiles (subject to minimal spending within the first 90 days). I will use the SkyMiles account patiently on a passive mode, slowly earning miles on my DL Delta One flights as well as the ones earned with the spending on the credit card.
- I noticed an easy way to earn XP are return flights to Canada (Montreal or Toronto for me, as I am based in NYC). If purchased in advance, I can get decent fares return flights on DL in First Class (considered as Business Class) which will bring me 30XP round trip.
- I am thinking however about a trick: I can always use my SkyMiles earned on my TransCon DeltaOne to purchase those Canada round trip tickets on a Cash & Miles basis: to reduce the fare even further, and once purchased, remove my SkyMiles number and put instead my FB to post those flights and earnt he XPs. Can anyone confirm to me (or correct me) whether this would work?
-vinnyc
Last edited by vinnyc; May 10, 2018 at 8:18 am Reason: typos
#1543
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: London, UK and Southern France
Posts: 18,364
#1544
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Paris, France
Programs: AF/KL Flying Blue Platinum for life/Club2000 Ultimate, Accor ALL Diamond
Posts: 21,935
I am thinking however about a trick: I can always use my SkyMiles earned on my TransCon DeltaOne to purchase those Canada round trip tickets on a Cash & Miles basis: to reduce the fare even further, and once purchased, remove my SkyMiles number and put instead my FB to post those flights and earnt he XPs. Can anyone confirm to me (or correct me) whether this would work?Thanks!
#1545
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: NYC
Programs: BA BAEC Gold (oW Emerald), AF/KLM FB Plat (ST E+), *Alliance Nada
Posts: 299
Delta Pay with Miles & Flying Blue XP
Apologies, I made a mistake in the program: this would not be the Delta "Miles + Cash" Program (which allows to reduce the payment in miles on award tickets), but the Delta "Pay with Miles" Program, which is only available to cardholders of the American Express Delta credit cards (Gold, Platinum, Reserve etc...) to pay a revenue tickets with miles, by tranches of 5,000 SkyMiles (you need to have a minimum balance of 5,000 DL miles in order to pay with your miles).
Details are on this link:
https://www.delta.com/content/www/en...ith-miles.html
And apparently, according The Points Guy, tickets paid under the program Pay with Miles are still considered as revenue tickets, which would seem to make my strategy work (and earn XP):
https://thepointsguy.com/2015/04/is-...deal-or-a-dud/
https://thepointsguy.com/2014/12/del...miles-in-2015/
Cheers,
-vinnyc
Last edited by vinnyc; May 10, 2018 at 10:52 am Reason: Addition of a URL link