DanTravels

Nairobi may be safer at times than Cape Town, Johannesburg, Port Moresby... I've stayed at the Utalii training hotel, right by Mathare slums on Thiika Road, and had no trouble (aside from the student housekeepers apparently thinking that the number of towels I got each day should vary randomly between 0 and 2)... but I say this as someone who was born somewhere that leads my country's small cities in manslaughter, robbery, assault and car theft, and went to college somewhere that's one of the top four large cities for manslaughter, robbery and car theft... so my view of things might be skewed.

Kampala feels a lot safer to me, at least. Even smaller towns in Kenya, like Eldoret and Karatina. And "Nairobbery" is in the vocabulary of East Africans, not just tourists.

Austinrunner

As if murders and car jackings do not occur outside Africa. Many homes outside Africa have similar security systems.

johan rebel

I must correct myself: you are far more likely to be relieved of your wallet before the ambulance arrives.

I know a Kenyan who was involved in a serious RTA near Meru. The only reason he survived is because a close friend perchance happened upon the scene. Otherwise the locals would have left him to die after relieving him of all his belongings.

An uncle of mine was driving in Ethiopia when he was overtaken by a car. The occupants were two young Italian girls of his acquaintance. When he came round a bend minutes later, he found the car in a cloud of dust and on its roof, the wheels still spinning. The girls had been thrown from the vehicle, and the locals were already helping themselves freely to whatever they could lay their hands on even before the casualties had time to die of their injuries, which both did.

Johan

Austinrunner

I highly doubt that's what happened in either case. Apocraphyl stories are always entertaining, especially the 50th time they're told and "enhanced".

Canuck2012

I'm pretty sure having your own electrified fence is illegal in most countries.

Anyway, I loved living in Kenya. But I really don't see why you insist on whitewashing the situation. It's a dangerous city, and only becoming more so- as the Airport fire perfectly demonstrates.

I'm living in Cairo, it was peaceful last week, now there are street wars happening just a few blocks from my apartment on a daily basis. As johan said, one can only rely on themselves, as this is Africa. Anything can happen.

Austinrunner

You can rely on your African friends and family. It's offensive to say that "one can rely only on one's self" when in Africa. There are tons of good people there who will befriend and help you if you'll let them.

There's simply no objective proof that Nairobi is any more dangerous than other big African cities or that Nairobi is becoming more dangerous. An apocraphyl sensationalistic story or two, hearsay on hearsay, proves nothing.

DanTravels

Yes, I am quite sure I can rely on my friends and family who hail from, and in most cases still live in, various countries across Africa. But...

...I don't think Nairobi is representative of all of Africa, or even all of Kenya.

While you're completely correct to point out that hearsay / anecdotal / "apocryphal" stories prove nothing, surely the same is true of what you say in your passionate defense of Nairobi?

Austinrunner

I'm not defending Nairobi, passionately or otherwise. I'm simply asking for the reliable evidence that it's soooooo dangerous as has been alleged here. A "I heard from a friend" story doesn't cut it. Nor does "rich people's houses have sophisticated security systems" prove anything. Exaggerations like "you'll definitely be robbed in the ambulance on the way to the hospital" are worthless. These come from the same people who blame all Vietnamese for poaching or who want to shoot alleged poachers on sight without due process.

DanTravels

FT is a fairly small sample, and I'm relatively certain no current posters have been killed in Nairobi, and no more than a few would have been victims of crime. In my personal experience (Nairobi in 2005, 2006 and 2010; Kampala in 2005, 2006, 2007, 2009 and 2010; Eldoret in 2005; Karatina in 2006) I've yet to be killed or successfully victimized. That said, I don't tend to go anywhere dodgy, and I have no involvement with alcohol, tobacco, drugs or other such "risk factors."

The first time I flew into Nairobi, my driver was pulled over before he could even leave the airport grounds, and detained for a couple hours by cops trying to shake us down for a bribe on some made-up grounds. I've also seen police raiding (tear-gassing, beating, whatever) street vendors, and I've found vendors at a Maasai market to be extremely high-pressure salesmen, verging on con men... but since I don't get there often, my impression is largely based on what I read in the major newspapers from Nairobi and Kenya, which I read almost every day.

I have always felt safer in Karatina, Eldoret and Kampala than in Nairobi. I concede that's a qualitative statement, but it is at least first-person from someone who's been there.

Alpha Golf

by definition

johan rebel

Doubt what you like, makes no difference to me. The stories are not "apocraphyl" (what does that mean anyway? Is it related to chlorophyl?). The Kenyan guy had scars to show (but no longer any wallet), the other accident was witnessed by my uncle, my aunt, and two cousins. Very simple story: the car rolled, the girls died, the locals took everything. Not much to embellish there.

Johan

Canuck2012

Anecdotal;
This happened 2 days ago:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-23838766
Police in Kenya are investigating the murder of a former British army colonel who was killed by an armed gang at his home near Nanyuki, Laikipia.

--killed for a few dollars and a bottle of wine.

Austinrunner

Senseless killings happen everywhere, even in Cairo....

elf618

Personal experience on Thursday in NBO-arrived around 9pm late from Kigali. Arrivals processes still completed in tents on the Tarmac but efficiently. (Watch that there are not more lines than tellers so that you don't end up in a herd vying for attention.)

There were not any working ATMs in arrivals but several banks for forex.

Departure on Saturday was easy. One escalator out of service but otherwise no issues or sign of problems on that side. (Other than a chapel tent near departure drop off)

I stayed at the crowne plaza on points before visiting a friend out of town in Kijabe. Used a wonderful taxi company for the 1-2hr trip each way as well as 3am airport pickup our last morning. Each of the 4 drivers we arranged was early, good driver, good seatbelts and vehicles. Happy to give company name/contact if anyone needs.

roadwarrier

I recently transited through NBO en route to Kigali. I arrived from JNB, and had a few hours’ layover before my flight to Kigali, so had plenty of time for people watching.
The current situation at JKIA is that only gates 4, 4A and 5 are operational. If you know the airport layout, that will be the left side of the building if facing it from the apron. You are bussed to a tented area, and if you are International Transit, you enter the building through the gate 3 area and go upstairs.
Unfortunately, both the Kenya Airways lounge and Flying Blue lounge are out of action, so, you need to go to a transfer desk near the Government lounge and collect a KSH 700 voucher that you use at the small kiosk near gate 4. This was enough for two warmish Tusker beers and two nuked samosas.
Due to the volume of people in that small area, seating was at a prime, so I decided to go back to gate 3 to catch some fresh air and a bit of peace. Unfortunately, I was asked to leave since BA was getting ready to set up their boarding area.
Another lounge that is out of action is the one opposite the Government lounge (no loss there, that lounge was a shocker).
The maintenance crew obviously had their hands full and the walls have all been treated to a fresh coat of lemon coloured paint with an orange trim………
The ground staff are doing their best to deal with the situation, and really, they seem to be doing a fine job. Although we managed to “lose” three pax on our flight which meant their luggage had to be off-loaded and we left about 40 minutes late.
Once you get to your assigned gate, you pass through security, then go downstairs (well in my case I had to) and go and sit in the one tent. They then call out various destinations and bus you to your aircraft.

On Thursday evening, I had to overnight in Nairobi so this necessitated a trip through Immigration. This was done in two tents which are set up back to back so one has a long, narrow area. Queues are separated with one for those who need visas, Diplomatic passports, normal passports, East African countries, and Kenyans. This seemed to be a bit of a bun fight though, with a bit of a free-for-all, in other words, all queues were filled. But, giving them credit, we did move along so a bit of patience is needed. Exiting the tent, there is a Barcleys ATM (the only one you can access) and you then make your way down a garden path (no really), to another tented facility where A4 sized pieces of paper identify which baggage is where. Once you leave this tent, you go back down a path where money changers have set up tents to the left. Once you exit the gardens, you get to meet the general chaos which is Nairobi. Traffic is a mess, but my taxi driver got us out of there within minutes. He asked for Ksh 2500 for a ride into Hurlingham, but after my .....ing, showed me a rate card which had it for Ksh 2400. All in all, from touchdown to my hotel room was just on 2 hours which I suppose is par for the course.

On Friday morning I left my hotel at 6:30 to get back to the airport. Besides a few patches of terrible traffic (and some out of this world driving skills), we got to the airport just before 7AM so not too bad. The check in area for Kenya Airways is still the same – yes, including the chaos that goes with it, so dropping my bag off took a while. The lines for Immigration were long, but there was a small “Business Class / Diplomatic” board and only had a few people so that went pretty quickly. Once you exit, there is a staircase and a lift going up to the departure area so that was where I was on Monday night. Although, I asked for my voucher, I was told to simply go to the kiosk. The KA lady was good in managing the situation; she took down my name and called one waitress to get my order sorted. She then made a note of what I asked for wished me a pleasant flight. I must say, the difference between Monday night and Friday morning was noticeable. These folks are taking a pretty dire situation and making the best of it.

So, if you want to fly via JKIA, take a deep breath, pack some extra sense of humour and patience, and you will be fine.

@ elf618 - you must have been on the same flight as me out of Kigali