Are You Thankful That You Fly United And Not Southwest Yet?
Dec 27, 2022, 11:51 am
#32
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Bellingham/Gainesville
Programs: UA-G MM, Priority Club Platinum, Avis First, Hertz 5*, Red Lion
Posts: 2,808
I worked in PMUA reservations in the early 2000s and experienced the other side of many IRROPS, including SFH 2000. Even if the phone lines were flashing red, it was regular practice to pull agents off the calls to work the rebooking queues. We rebooked on UA first (of course), and then OA, even in F, as the last resort. In 2000, when I was staffed on the phone line for non-status passengers and Premiers (whom PMUA treated the same in regard to reservations), I certainly had rebooked many non-status pax in F on another airline as a matter of standard policy. (Before the advent of complimentary upgrades, last-minute F inventory was always plenty.)
Now that airlines have reduced reservations staffing in favor of online booking, I don't know how proactive and to what extent the airlines can be to automatically rebook pax in OA, without needing the pax to call in, during massive IRROPS. But that practice still exists, and it's a differentiator from WN.
Now that airlines have reduced reservations staffing in favor of online booking, I don't know how proactive and to what extent the airlines can be to automatically rebook pax in OA, without needing the pax to call in, during massive IRROPS. But that practice still exists, and it's a differentiator from WN.
Dec 27, 2022, 12:50 pm
#33
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: HNL
Programs: UA GS4MM, MR LT Plat, Hilton Gold
Posts: 6,447
Tuesday: Southwest has cancelled over 2,500+ flights today. The next closest: Spirit with 83. They are on track to have 99% of all airline cancellations on Wednesday (87% Tuesday).
Flipping thru channels - On CNN, caught the Southwest President of the Pilots Association actually make a direct to UA as I paraphrase: United has about the same size operations in Denver as Southwest and they weren't even close to the meltdown Southwest has had.
Anyway - I'll fly other airlines such as AA, HA, DL, etc - but I personally skip Southwest not because of this meltdown - but no F, no E+, no assigned seating, etc are all dealbreakers for me. I've booked friends on Southwest meeting me somewhere because of schedule/price and I don't recall previous issues.
Flipping thru channels - On CNN, caught the Southwest President of the Pilots Association actually make a direct to UA as I paraphrase: United has about the same size operations in Denver as Southwest and they weren't even close to the meltdown Southwest has had.
Anyway - I'll fly other airlines such as AA, HA, DL, etc - but I personally skip Southwest not because of this meltdown - but no F, no E+, no assigned seating, etc are all dealbreakers for me. I've booked friends on Southwest meeting me somewhere because of schedule/price and I don't recall previous issues.
Dec 27, 2022, 1:09 pm
#34
Join Date: Feb 2006
Programs: UA, Starwood, Priority Club, Hertz, Starbucks Gold Card
Posts: 3,952
I can neither agree nor disagree, because perceptions often don't reflect reality. OA protection is a thankless perk offered by the major carriers, and it could happen much more frequently than we presume. Other than here on FT, someone who receives a "PROT OA" probably would not be tweeting to the world, "I'm glad I booked with (*insert your villain airline of the day*), because they protected me on another airline." More likely, you'd get "I'll never fly that villainous airline again; I could have just flown that (*insert your savior airline of the day*) all along."
Dec 27, 2022, 1:17 pm
#35
Moderator, Omni, Omni/PR, Omni/Games, FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Between DCA and IAD
Programs: UA 1K MM; Hilton Diamond
Posts: 67,138
I was thinking another issue compounding recovery is that WN flies only 737s; in the past, when UA has had major disruptions, they've repositioned widebodies to run replacement sections and get people out more quickly. I've been saved on more than one occasion when the A320 or 737 cancelled and the next day UA added 777s to the route to get pax moving.
No ability to do that with WN, and even if they had larger a/c available in their fleet to sub in, their typical aircraft utilization patterns would make it hard to do so effectively.
No ability to do that with WN, and even if they had larger a/c available in their fleet to sub in, their typical aircraft utilization patterns would make it hard to do so effectively.
Dec 27, 2022, 1:26 pm
#36
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: CHI
Programs: UA 1K, MR Titanium, IHG Gold, National Exec
Posts: 3,841
Total meltdown indeed. I am a big Southwest fan and hope this wakes them up to modernizing their backend IT infrastructure. Imagine if United could just improve their ground and inflight customer service to Southwest levels. United would be firmly rooted as the number 1 option. I think it's getting better as more of the older employees retire and are replaced by youth -- but I'm based in CLE and all I get are the very rude dinosaurs. I flew Jet Blue for the first time a bit ago and it made me appreciate how good United actually is.
But I agree with OP - UA has always tried to get me where I need to be, even if it means on AA.
Dec 27, 2022, 1:38 pm
#37
Original Poster
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Denver, Colorado
Programs: IHG Spire, Hilton Honors Gold, Marriott Titanium, Mileage Plus Gold
Posts: 1,736
I was thinking another issue compounding recovery is that WN flies only 737s; in the past, when UA has had major disruptions, they've repositioned widebodies to run replacement sections and get people out more quickly. I've been saved on more than one occasion when the A320 or 737 cancelled and the next day UA added 777s to the route to get pax moving.
No ability to do that with WN, and even if they had larger a/c available in their fleet to sub in, their typical aircraft utilization patterns would make it hard to do so effectively.
No ability to do that with WN, and even if they had larger a/c available in their fleet to sub in, their typical aircraft utilization patterns would make it hard to do so effectively.
Dec 27, 2022, 1:56 pm
#38
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Nashville,TN
Programs: AA Gold Elite
Posts: 601
Well I recently cancelled a refundable AS ticket due to the awful reports from cancelled flights to/from SEA and the only way I could get from BNA is via a connect in SEA.
Booked a "backup" non stop on WN the day before an international flight from LAX but will be looking at the situation mid January! My sister's father in law was a WN captain before retiring a few years ago. WN is never my first choice despite that. I just desperately need to get to LAX on 1/16 before my other flight on 1/17 to OZ!
Hope to see how weather impacts me at my location before I cancel WN and/or rebook. As of now I am on AA on an award ticket from BNA in F.
Sad that I have to strategize so much post Covid but it is what it is!
Booked a "backup" non stop on WN the day before an international flight from LAX but will be looking at the situation mid January! My sister's father in law was a WN captain before retiring a few years ago. WN is never my first choice despite that. I just desperately need to get to LAX on 1/16 before my other flight on 1/17 to OZ!
Hope to see how weather impacts me at my location before I cancel WN and/or rebook. As of now I am on AA on an award ticket from BNA in F.
Sad that I have to strategize so much post Covid but it is what it is!
Dec 27, 2022, 2:27 pm
#41
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 378
Dec 27, 2022, 2:49 pm
#42
Original Poster
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Denver, Colorado
Programs: IHG Spire, Hilton Honors Gold, Marriott Titanium, Mileage Plus Gold
Posts: 1,736
Dec 27, 2022, 3:42 pm
#43
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: NYC, LON
Programs: *
Posts: 2,773
In life you generally get what you pay for.
Always amuses me when I see all those posts that we should all go free agent and use kayak to select the cheapest flights for our travel. I know I will be told that extreme weather and such disruptions are so rare as to influence day to day choice of airline, but so are car accidents and we still wear our seatbelts everyday. If it costs me 1500 dollars in cumulative incremental ticket costs a year to fly United and achieve a useful elite status, then I would do that any day over being found in a Southwest plane...the cost of the time wastage and inconvenience avoided (plus the incremental benefit you get in IRROPS when booked on UA) will exponentially justify the incremental spend made to avoid likes of WN and B6.
Always amuses me when I see all those posts that we should all go free agent and use kayak to select the cheapest flights for our travel. I know I will be told that extreme weather and such disruptions are so rare as to influence day to day choice of airline, but so are car accidents and we still wear our seatbelts everyday. If it costs me 1500 dollars in cumulative incremental ticket costs a year to fly United and achieve a useful elite status, then I would do that any day over being found in a Southwest plane...the cost of the time wastage and inconvenience avoided (plus the incremental benefit you get in IRROPS when booked on UA) will exponentially justify the incremental spend made to avoid likes of WN and B6.
Dec 27, 2022, 4:01 pm
#44
Join Date: Jul 2005
Programs: Still trying to use my Continental OnePass miles...
Posts: 171
I dunno. I was delayed 2.5+ hours FLL-IAH yesterday because of a missing FA only to land at IAH and not have a gate for 20 minutes. Not very impressive.
Last edited by correction; Dec 27, 2022 at 4:10 pm
Dec 27, 2022, 4:14 pm
#45
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: ORD
Programs: United Premier 1K , Marriot Titanium, Hilton Diamond, IHG Platinum
Posts: 114
Point to point flights on the west coast are fine with South West but I never fly them anywhere else. Their network is just too flaky to handle storms of any kind. Plus they got next to nothing for international, so why bother spending your money with them. I can piss and moan about UA just as much as the next guy but they have always got me home.