prestonh

that is my experience as well. on a practical level, interlining appears reserved for corner cases/super elites and high rev tickets upon very desperate pleadings. IMO not in the irrops recovery toolbox for the majority of UA pax. Not sure if it a major distinction from WN for most flyers since the super elite have already made their choice and WN does not have a F/J cabin. Nowhere did i dispute WN is seriously broken, because it is.

mduell

When was the last time UA cancelled more than half the network for multiple sequential days?

DELee

As noted over in the December 2022 UA Waiver thread, WN has a systemwide waiver through until 02 January 2023:

David

rmadisonwi

The key difference, though, is that if UA cancels ORD-STL, they cancel the return STL-ORD and the plane and its crew are where they need to be for the next flight (granted, not all of the time, but often enough). If WN cancels MDW-STL, for example, that plane and crew were going to fly STL-ABQ-LAS-OAK (using a hypothetical random example). Now you have several flights disrupted and the plane and crew aren’t where they need to be for the next round.

Further complicating this is the fact that WN’s IT is apparently very ancient and lacking in capability and so they don’t have an easy time of putting what is already a complex operation back together when the dominoes start to fall.

A few years ago, post-merger, UA made the decision to move towards more out-and-back flying instead of heavily mixing aircraft through hubs via outstations (e.g., a plane flying ORD-ATL-ORD and IAH-ATL-IAH instead of doing ORD-ATL-IAH and vice versa), and one of the reasons given was the improved reliability during IRROPS because they had less need to try and mend a bunch of pieces together that were out of place (particularly the crews, but also planes if they are of different types or configurations).

Now, my fun story for today is that I was to fly PHL-ORD at 11:15 am. On my way to the airport (fairly early, because I was carpooling with a relative who had an earlier flight), I happened to check the app and see that my flight was canceled (no text message, no email). UA auto-rebooked me onto the 6 pm flight. I was annoyed about my evening plans being shot, but thankful to have an alternative.

Then, while sitting in the United Club at PHL, wondering what to do for 10 hours, I happened to check back and notice that my rebook was for *tomorrow* at 6 pm (seriously, I wish that would have been highlighted to me rather than me having to read the date, half-asleep in the middle of the holiday week when I barely know what day it is anyway).

So, after a bit of searching (and the agent at the UA club even checked AA out of PHL; everything was booked solid all day), I was able to grab the last seat on LGA-ORD at 6 pm tonight.

So now I’m on the Q70 bus, having taken SEPTA to Amtrak to LIRR to get to New York.

But I’ll get home tonight, and that’s the important thing.

(My cancel was due to mechanical, it seems UA doesn’t have much, if any, slack in the Airbus fleet right now, and perhaps no spare 737 planes and crew to sub in).

Repooc17

I am thankful I don't have to fly anywhere for Christmas and New Year's - three weeks of family time. No UA, no WN, no carriers, period
I purposely miss all of the peak travel times.

Back to the grind the second week of January - 70K BIS scheduled just in the first quarter.

It's been pretty bad for all of the carriers. Sounds like WN is not coping too well. Good luck to everyone out there.

PTahCha

Airlines, in general, do not have planes sitting around "just in case".

zeus2120

Pics from my first and only Jet Blue experience on an A-320. Is this a one off? All I know is I got off that plane and swore that I'll never complain about the interior of a United Plane again lol

rmadisonwi

I never claimed they did. But there can be slack in the schedule, which can be accomplished by having longer turns, changing maintenance schedules, etc. It’s not like a carrier with 800 planes in their fleet is going to know exactly how many planes will be available at every minute of every day. Between new deliveries (the exact date of which can vary by a few days), planes rotating in and out of maintenance (just track the UA fleet thread and you see weekly reports of Nxxxxx scheduled to exit ABC maintenance on such-and-such date; followed by an update that the exit flight was canceled and they rescheduled for a day or two later, etc.), repaints, refits, etc. Plus others sometimes held for charters and then having to reposition to/from a hub, and what have you. Bottom line is, in the grand scheme of things, there is some slack in the schedule, plus tons of other horse-trading going on to run the operation. Just less of it during a busy period.

If there wasn’t any slack, you’d never get an aircraft swap for a mechanical problem and your only options would be delay or cancel.

prestonh

i guess you didn't go through the summer from he**, i believe there were 25,000 cancelled flights.

mduell

So maybe 20+ years ago? And 25k flights over a summer certainly isn't half the flights cancelled on sequential days so probably not.

Longboater

Flew BWI-SRQ last Wednesday evening on WN but flight was delayed an hour due to late pilots. Southwest's on-time percentage for my flying the past year and a half is poor. Even before this meltdown, I was planning on using them just once next year and that is only because of a credit I have. After I return SRQ-BWI in two weeks, I hope to only step on a WN plane once more in 2023. Say what you want about UA, operationally they are running very well, even with this past weekend. Also, I prefer maintaining status on at least one airline and with the 2023 changes at UA, I am flying almost exclusively UA in 2023.

prestonh

you asked, i answered. it was bad.
It happened in Aug 2000, ~25,000 flights canx, 1,000,000 fewer passengers carried in that month. (remember UA was less than half the size it was then). i was affected in multiple trips. horrible times.

gold23

Honestly, I'm not sure. I fly Jet Blue maybe five or six times per year (almost always to leisure destinations), and haven't seen interiors like that. I've seen some pretty rough UA interiors- though maybe not to the extent pictured here. Mostly just ceiling panels broken, seat back pockets 90% off and hanging, ripped seating. Not common, but I've experienced it with almost every domestic carrier.

My comment was primarily consistent live tv with many channels and a very solid wifi product. Watching a sporting event makes a flight go by quite fast.

lincolnjkc

I've been fortunate enough to only need OAL protection a handful of times -- and no it's never been automatic but at least when I ask for it it can and does happen... Unlike WN (or B6 or F9 or NK) who the only way they can put you OAL is if they actually buy a ticket on that carrier and good luck with that most of the time.

sinoflyer

I worked in PMUA reservations in the early 2000s and experienced the other side of many IRROPS, including SFH 2000. Even if the phone lines were flashing red, it was regular practice to pull agents off the calls to work the rebooking queues. We rebooked on UA first (of course), and then OA, even in F, as the last resort. In 2000, when I was staffed on the phone line for non-status passengers and Premiers (whom PMUA treated the same in regard to reservations), I certainly had rebooked many non-status pax in F on another airline as a matter of standard policy. (Before the advent of complimentary upgrades, last-minute F inventory was always plenty.)

Now that airlines have reduced reservations staffing in favor of online booking, I don't know how proactive and to what extent the airlines can be to automatically rebook pax in OA, without needing the pax to call in, during massive IRROPS. But that practice still exists, and it's a differentiator from WN.