Oct 29, 2018, 2:14 pm
Last edit by: WineCountryUA
UA has started installing Premium Plus / Premium Economy seats in 772s and 773s. Other long haul aircraft will also be receiving these new seats.
For 77x it is a 2-4-2 (vs economy 3-4-3) with 3 rows - 24 seats
For 76x it is believe it will be 2-2-2 (vs 2-3-2) with 3 rows ( and maybe a partial row) - 22 seats
For 78x it is believed it will be 2-3-2 (vs 3-3-3) with 3 rows - 21 seats
UA has not yet started selling this new cabin but has restructured its fare class -- which appears to be in preparation of selling the new cabin (and removed 3-class F)
In the meantime, the Premium Plus cabin is being treated as an extension of E+ and those with E+ access can select the new seats.
In many cases UA is initially using an interim seat maps, such as https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/united-airlines-mileageplus/1926142-interim-772-seat-map-polaris-potentially-premium-economy-2018-a.html
Things start to firm up about 2 days prior but last minute changes can happen
For 77x it is a 2-4-2 (vs economy 3-4-3) with 3 rows - 24 seats
For 76x it is believe it will be 2-2-2 (vs 2-3-2) with 3 rows ( and maybe a partial row) - 22 seats
For 78x it is believed it will be 2-3-2 (vs 3-3-3) with 3 rows - 21 seats
UA has not yet started selling this new cabin but has restructured its fare class -- which appears to be in preparation of selling the new cabin (and removed 3-class F)
In the meantime, the Premium Plus cabin is being treated as an extension of E+ and those with E+ access can select the new seats.
In many cases UA is initially using an interim seat maps, such as https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/united-airlines-mileageplus/1926142-interim-772-seat-map-polaris-potentially-premium-economy-2018-a.html
Things start to firm up about 2 days prior but last minute changes can happen
Real Premium Economy is Coming [Update: UA studying "Real" Prem Y in domestic market]
Jun 16, 2018, 10:43 pm
#691
Join Date: Feb 2008
Programs: 6 year GS, now 2MM Jeff-ugee, *wood LTPlt, SkyPeso PLT
Posts: 6,526
seat maps are here...
https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/29641532-post545.html
UA is putting only 24 PE seats on the 787-10, 772, and 77W. The real estate for PE is coming directly out of E+ on these planes, not that E+ is so hot on any of them (and down right awful on the 10 across 777) but what UA has done is basically split the space it currently gives for E+ into PE and E+
UA is putting only 24 PE seats on the 787-10, 772, and 77W. The real estate for PE is coming directly out of E+ on these planes, not that E+ is so hot on any of them (and down right awful on the 10 across 777) but what UA has done is basically split the space it currently gives for E+ into PE and E+
Jun 16, 2018, 11:04 pm
#692
Join Date: Jan 2000
Programs: UA 1k, AA EXPLT, NZ GE, VA PLT Hyatt Diam, Marr Plat, HH Diam
Posts: 3,445
Jun 16, 2018, 11:42 pm
#693
Join Date: May 2010
Location: AVP & PEK
Programs: UA 1K 1.9MM
Posts: 6,362
https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/29641532-post545.html
UA is putting only 24 PE seats on the 787-10, 772, and 77W.
UA is putting only 24 PE seats on the 787-10, 772, and 77W.
787-10 gets 21 PE
777-200 gets 24 PE
777-300 gets 24 PE
767-300 gets 22 PE
Jun 17, 2018, 8:08 am
#694
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 3,361
https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/29641532-post545.html
UA is putting only 24 PE seats on the 787-10, 772, and 77W. The real estate for PE is coming directly out of E+ on these planes, not that E+ is so hot on any of them (and down right awful on the 10 across 777) but what UA has done is basically split the space it currently gives for E+ into PE and E+
UA is putting only 24 PE seats on the 787-10, 772, and 77W. The real estate for PE is coming directly out of E+ on these planes, not that E+ is so hot on any of them (and down right awful on the 10 across 777) but what UA has done is basically split the space it currently gives for E+ into PE and E+
Jun 17, 2018, 8:50 am
#695
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: MIA
Programs: AA EXP (AC), DL G (SC), Bonvoy LTP, & IHG AMB
Posts: 1,798
I realize that’s it’s hardly an efficient plane, and my moniker gives my preference away, but from a passenger perspective in all cabins, the 767 is hard to beat! 2-2-2 layout for PE is outstanding!
Jun 17, 2018, 8:53 am
#696
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 57,616
I'm happy with how UA has made its seat allocation. Now that the long haul E+ seat is narrower, its value has gone down. ^^ to UA adding PE at the expense of E+.
Jun 17, 2018, 10:11 pm
#697
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: May 2001
Posts: 10,971
Look at EVA Air, one of the first to do PE, as an example. They started PE in 1992 on the 744 TPE-LAX. Initially, the front 2/3 of the lower deck was PE and 1/2 Y (upper deck had 8 F and 16 C). Very quickly, they retrofitted and made the lower 1/3 PE and 2/3 Y.
The price differential between Y and PE used to be US$200ish for a roundtrip. Over the years, they continued to shrink the PE cabin and increase the price differential. Now on the 77W, Y is crammed (10 across on the newest configuration), PE is not as good as before (and went from 64 seats to 56 seats), F is gone but C is world class. http://www.evaair.com/en-us/flying-with-eva/fleet-facts/passenger/777-300er.html?filter=Passenger&fleet=777-300ER&seatmap=77M Their target market for PE seems to be upper middle class consumers and corporate.
Even though my company is doing very well stock price-wise, the cut in expenses never ends. (Thank God they at least are blocking out BE.) I can see them adjusting the # of hours required to go into C so it will be a 3-tiered system with full C reserved for 10+ hours (now 8) and not letting us book PE where we have to book Y now. If every company does this, then UA will have a problem.
The price differential between Y and PE used to be US$200ish for a roundtrip. Over the years, they continued to shrink the PE cabin and increase the price differential. Now on the 77W, Y is crammed (10 across on the newest configuration), PE is not as good as before (and went from 64 seats to 56 seats), F is gone but C is world class. http://www.evaair.com/en-us/flying-with-eva/fleet-facts/passenger/777-300er.html?filter=Passenger&fleet=777-300ER&seatmap=77M Their target market for PE seems to be upper middle class consumers and corporate.
Even though my company is doing very well stock price-wise, the cut in expenses never ends. (Thank God they at least are blocking out BE.) I can see them adjusting the # of hours required to go into C so it will be a 3-tiered system with full C reserved for 10+ hours (now 8) and not letting us book PE where we have to book Y now. If every company does this, then UA will have a problem.
Last edited by username; Jun 18, 2018 at 7:35 pm Reason: Corrected Seat Counts
Jun 18, 2018, 10:38 am
#698
Join Date: Feb 2008
Programs: 6 year GS, now 2MM Jeff-ugee, *wood LTPlt, SkyPeso PLT
Posts: 6,526
Look at EVA Air, one of the first to do PE, as an example. They started PE in 1992 on the 744 TPE-LAX. Initially, the front 2/3 of the lower deck was PE and 1/2 Y (upper deck had 8 F and 16 C). Very quickly, they retrofitted and made the lower 1/3 PE and 2/3 Y.
The price differential between Y and PE used to be US$200ish for a roundtrip. Over the years, they continued to shrink the PE cabin and increase the price differential. Now on the 77W, Y is crammed (10 across on the newest configuration), PE is not as good as before (and went from 42 seats to 36 seats), F is gone but C is world class. 777-300ER - EVA Air | America Their target market for PE seems to be upper middle class consumers and corporate.
Even though my company is doing very well stock price-wise, the cut in expenses never ends. (Thank God they at least are blocking out BE.) I can see them adjusting the # of hours required to go into C so it will be a 3-tiered system with full C reserved for 10+ hours (now 8) and not letting us book PE where we have to book Y now. If every company does this, then UA will have a problem.
The price differential between Y and PE used to be US$200ish for a roundtrip. Over the years, they continued to shrink the PE cabin and increase the price differential. Now on the 77W, Y is crammed (10 across on the newest configuration), PE is not as good as before (and went from 42 seats to 36 seats), F is gone but C is world class. 777-300ER - EVA Air | America Their target market for PE seems to be upper middle class consumers and corporate.
Even though my company is doing very well stock price-wise, the cut in expenses never ends. (Thank God they at least are blocking out BE.) I can see them adjusting the # of hours required to go into C so it will be a 3-tiered system with full C reserved for 10+ hours (now 8) and not letting us book PE where we have to book Y now. If every company does this, then UA will have a problem.
On the most recent 77W config EVA has 39 J and 56 PE and 10x E- with 31 or 32" pitch, and 20 "exit row" Y (effectively E+). On its 77W (once PE is put in) UA will have 24 PE, 68 E+/exit row, and 60J.
I don't know what EVA does with J corporate accounts, but UA is discounting its J for big business accounts by 40%+. Whether UA has enough seat for the "middle market" in PE given how horrible its E+ seats/service are now getting is a different question.
Jun 18, 2018, 3:06 pm
#699
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: ZOA, SFO, HKG
Programs: UA 1K 0.9MM, Marriott Gold, HHonors Gold, Hertz PC, SBux Gold, TSA Pre✓
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Jun 18, 2018, 3:40 pm
#700
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Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Pacific Northwest
Programs: UA Gold 1MM, AS 75k, AA Plat, Bonvoyed Gold, Honors Dia, Hyatt Explorer, IHG Plat, ...
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Jun 18, 2018, 5:27 pm
#701
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 553
Even though my company is doing very well stock price-wise, the cut in expenses never ends. (Thank God they at least are blocking out BE.) I can see them adjusting the # of hours required to go into C so it will be a 3-tiered system with full C reserved for 10+ hours (now 8) and not letting us book PE where we have to book Y now. If every company does this, then UA will have a problem.
Jun 18, 2018, 7:40 pm
#702
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: May 2001
Posts: 10,971
There are big differences in markets between EVA and UA. UA's TPAC hub - the SFO MSA - has a $84k/per person per capita income. Taiwan has a per capita GDP of $24K. (I can't find an income figure, income would be lower). To give some context, Japan's per capita income is $47K, and the US per capita income was $57K/person.
On the most recent 77W config EVA has 39 J and 56 PE and 10x E- with 31 or 32" pitch, and 20 "exit row" Y (effectively E+). On its 77W (once PE is put in) UA will have 24 PE, 68 E+/exit row, and 60J.
I don't know what EVA does with J corporate accounts, but UA is discounting its J for big business accounts by 40%+. Whether UA has enough seat for the "middle market" in PE given how horrible its E+ seats/service are now getting is a different question.
On the most recent 77W config EVA has 39 J and 56 PE and 10x E- with 31 or 32" pitch, and 20 "exit row" Y (effectively E+). On its 77W (once PE is put in) UA will have 24 PE, 68 E+/exit row, and 60J.
I don't know what EVA does with J corporate accounts, but UA is discounting its J for big business accounts by 40%+. Whether UA has enough seat for the "middle market" in PE given how horrible its E+ seats/service are now getting is a different question.
Jun 18, 2018, 9:30 pm
#703
Join Date: Feb 2015
Programs: united
Posts: 1,636
Oops, I can't count...corrected my count. The point I was trying to make, but forgot to state, is that maximizing yield with a new cabin class might take some data collecting and adjustments. It probably will also depend on the economy and route. The way BR was pricing it initially ($200ish extra on a R/T) made it a no brainer for many but when it went to the $500-$600 range...
They then discovered how popular it was and upped the price.
Jun 19, 2018, 7:49 am
#704
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: MIA
Programs: AA EXP (AC), DL G (SC), Bonvoy LTP, & IHG AMB
Posts: 1,798
Unless it's changed since January (last time I was in Y on a 763 from ORD to IAH), the lay-out is definitely still 2-3-2 in Y.
The layout tracks what AA is doing with their 777/787s and beats out DL's A359 which they went with 2-4-2 on when standard Y is 3-3-3
The layout tracks what AA is doing with their 777/787s and beats out DL's A359 which they went with 2-4-2 on when standard Y is 3-3-3
Jun 19, 2018, 10:35 am
#705
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: 42.1% in PDX , 49.9% in PVG & 8% in the air somewhere
Programs: Marriott Ambassador Elite, UA 1K, AS MVP GLD 75K, DL Pt
Posts: 1,086
So beyond layout, timing etc., what is the guess as to price of Premium E versus E+. If the number of seats are few, price high all it means to us who are trapped in E+ is fewer E+ and the one class upgrade maybe easier but a devaluation?