got ejected from my exit aisle seat(777) because arm has a quarter-size bruise
Aug 27, 2017, 4:24 pm
#46
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This was a service failure on the part of UA. The FA did something stupid, but it can't be undone; it's in the past. You can't get re-seated after the flight lands. The best you can expect is some compensation, but not if you don't ask/complain first.
...
Don't listen to the vindictive voices who only care about punishing the FA (unless you are one of them). That's management's job. Take your miles and get on with your life. IOW, get over it.
...
Don't listen to the vindictive voices who only care about punishing the FA (unless you are one of them). That's management's job. Take your miles and get on with your life. IOW, get over it.
This has everything to do with making management aware of the issue and giving them the opportunity to prevent future service failures at the hand of this crew member.
In other words, by reporting the issue the OP is doing you and me a favor.
Aug 27, 2017, 4:26 pm
#47
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 812
If you really want to get even, file a small claims lawsuit against a "Jane Doe" and then subpoena United for the flight attendant's contact information, then serve her. If United won't discipline these lying employees, maybe the thread of court action will.
You can probably justify the lawsuit because it's illegal to discriminate against a medical condition/skin coloration that do not affect your ability to operate the exit door. Her actions could also be torturous interference of the contract between you and United. As a defense, UA will claim that they can change your seat for no reason, but adhesion contracts (like the conditions of carriage) are interpreted against the company because you don't have an ability to negotiate it, and common carriers are under heightened scrutiny. In any case, you do not need a slam dunk case--the point of this is to get her into court and have to explain her actions, under perjury and in public, to a judge. And small court rules are quite relaxed, so you do have a decent chance of winning. Definitely get the media involved as well.
And it is key that you sue the flight attendant personally, not United. Even if you win and United ends to covering her damages, the threat of personal legal hassles will go quite far to keep the bad FAs in line in the future.
You can probably justify the lawsuit because it's illegal to discriminate against a medical condition/skin coloration that do not affect your ability to operate the exit door. Her actions could also be torturous interference of the contract between you and United. As a defense, UA will claim that they can change your seat for no reason, but adhesion contracts (like the conditions of carriage) are interpreted against the company because you don't have an ability to negotiate it, and common carriers are under heightened scrutiny. In any case, you do not need a slam dunk case--the point of this is to get her into court and have to explain her actions, under perjury and in public, to a judge. And small court rules are quite relaxed, so you do have a decent chance of winning. Definitely get the media involved as well.
And it is key that you sue the flight attendant personally, not United. Even if you win and United ends to covering her damages, the threat of personal legal hassles will go quite far to keep the bad FAs in line in the future.
Last edited by sincx; Aug 27, 2017 at 4:44 pm
Aug 27, 2017, 5:03 pm
#48
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I would absolutely escalate this. That being said, I would make it clear that you're not interested in a token amount of miles. Rather, you are calling shena, and you believe this FA should, at the very least, be re-educated as it pertains to NRSA/buddy pass policies.
Aug 27, 2017, 5:06 pm
#49
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Although seats are not guaranteed I expect that E+ seating is a major factor for many elites when deciding what airline to fly. I will often choose UA for family trips even when the fare is higher because I value the 4 E+ seats (including 2 aisle seats).
I think we all understand that equipment changes and cancellations may require a change in plans (though sometimes you can choose to an earlier or later flight with E+) But if FAs are empowered to arbitrarily boot passengers from their pre-assigned seats after they have boarded the plane (as was the case with Dr. Dao) then UA is not meeting the customer's expectations. And if this happens often enough and receives publicity then E+ will cease to be a selling point and we will all start making different choices.
I think we all understand that equipment changes and cancellations may require a change in plans (though sometimes you can choose to an earlier or later flight with E+) But if FAs are empowered to arbitrarily boot passengers from their pre-assigned seats after they have boarded the plane (as was the case with Dr. Dao) then UA is not meeting the customer's expectations. And if this happens often enough and receives publicity then E+ will cease to be a selling point and we will all start making different choices.
Aug 27, 2017, 5:30 pm
#50
Join Date: Sep 2014
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The way I see it, there are two separate issues.
The first is how much discretion the FA has in determining the OP's fit to sit in the exit row. I expect that the answer is that FAs are allowed to take a wide range of factors in making their determination.
The second is whether the FA followed procedure in relocating OP to a different seat. On that one, I suspect that the answer could easily be demonstrated to be no. I am sure any number of aisle seat occupants in E+ and E would have happily traded with OP. For the FA to pick someone who has a middle seat, and who just happens to be related to OP's neighbor, shows unprofessional bias.
The first is how much discretion the FA has in determining the OP's fit to sit in the exit row. I expect that the answer is that FAs are allowed to take a wide range of factors in making their determination.
The second is whether the FA followed procedure in relocating OP to a different seat. On that one, I suspect that the answer could easily be demonstrated to be no. I am sure any number of aisle seat occupants in E+ and E would have happily traded with OP. For the FA to pick someone who has a middle seat, and who just happens to be related to OP's neighbor, shows unprofessional bias.
Aug 27, 2017, 6:19 pm
#52
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If you really want to get even, file a small claims lawsuit against a "Jane Doe" and then subpoena United for the flight attendant's contact information, then serve her. If United won't discipline these lying employees, maybe the thread of court action will.
You can probably justify the lawsuit because it's illegal to discriminate against a medical condition/skin coloration that do not affect your ability to operate the exit door. Her actions could also be torturous interference of the contract between you and United. As a defense, UA will claim that they can change your seat for no reason, but adhesion contracts (like the conditions of carriage) are interpreted against the company because you don't have an ability to negotiate it, and common carriers are under heightened scrutiny. In any case, you do not need a slam dunk case--the point of this is to get her into court and have to explain her actions, under perjury and in public, to a judge. And small court rules are quite relaxed, so you do have a decent chance of winning. Definitely get the media involved as well.
And it is key that you sue the flight attendant personally, not United. Even if you win and United ends to covering her damages, the threat of personal legal hassles will go quite far to keep the bad FAs in line in the future.
You can probably justify the lawsuit because it's illegal to discriminate against a medical condition/skin coloration that do not affect your ability to operate the exit door. Her actions could also be torturous interference of the contract between you and United. As a defense, UA will claim that they can change your seat for no reason, but adhesion contracts (like the conditions of carriage) are interpreted against the company because you don't have an ability to negotiate it, and common carriers are under heightened scrutiny. In any case, you do not need a slam dunk case--the point of this is to get her into court and have to explain her actions, under perjury and in public, to a judge. And small court rules are quite relaxed, so you do have a decent chance of winning. Definitely get the media involved as well.
And it is key that you sue the flight attendant personally, not United. Even if you win and United ends to covering her damages, the threat of personal legal hassles will go quite far to keep the bad FAs in line in the future.
Aug 27, 2017, 6:21 pm
#53
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Nobodyherebutme beat me to it - if the goal was to get you out of the exit row because you weren't exit row qualified, they could have done this with an E+ aisle trade. But that wasn't the goal - it was to get a non-rev a better seat.
When you write, be sure to tell them what seat you ended up in. I believe that the non-rev should also be retrained - and possibly have her non-rev privileges, um "adjusted".
When you write, be sure to tell them what seat you ended up in. I believe that the non-rev should also be retrained - and possibly have her non-rev privileges, um "adjusted".
Aug 27, 2017, 6:50 pm
#54
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The crew has broad discretion to determine fitness to sit in the exit row, but this sounds like a case where that discretion was abused. You should complain to UA and hope for some kind of compensation.
FYI, an essential rule of thumb for seat swap requests is that the person asking for the favor offers a seat at least as good as the seat being given up. In this case, your seat mate in the exit row should have swapped with the person on the middle seat in E-. In the unlikely event that that person was not fit for the exit row, the FA should have arranged a three-way swap.
FYI, an essential rule of thumb for seat swap requests is that the person asking for the favor offers a seat at least as good as the seat being given up. In this case, your seat mate in the exit row should have swapped with the person on the middle seat in E-. In the unlikely event that that person was not fit for the exit row, the FA should have arranged a three-way swap.
Aug 27, 2017, 6:59 pm
#56
Join Date: Sep 2008
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FA's have the right to move a passenger out of an exit row seat for safety reasons, and given that this can happen after the door has been closed (or even potentially whilst in flight) I'd be fairly sure there is no need for them to issue a new boarding pass when doing do.
Of course, I'm not suggesting that a quarter-sized bruise is a valid 'safety reason', just that potentially there is no requirement to do what you're asking for. Still may have been enough to get the point across...
E+ to E- is not considered a "downgrade" as they are both treated as the same class, so officially no compensation would be due.
Of course, I'm not suggesting that a quarter-sized bruise is a valid 'safety reason', just that potentially there is no requirement to do what you're asking for. Still may have been enough to get the point across...
E+ to E- is not considered a "downgrade" as they are both treated as the same class, so officially no compensation would be due.
Why didn't you say suggest that the bruise might possibly have been caused by the flight attendant, if perhaps your seat got changed?
Aug 27, 2017, 7:14 pm
#57
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Exactly.
I've used this line on Air Canada a few times when "weight and balance" resulted in "target the young guy in a t-shirt".
No. Go pick someone from a row without the extra leg room.
I've used this line on Air Canada a few times when "weight and balance" resulted in "target the young guy in a t-shirt".
No. Go pick someone from a row without the extra leg room.
A bit off topic, but you'd allow 13 year olds there based on your rule interpretations?[/url]
A 13 year old probably wouldn't be physically capable. I don't know if there's a "mentally capable" rule, but there should be, and that would also likely preclude a 13 year old from sitting there.
A 13 year old probably wouldn't be physically capable. I don't know if there's a "mentally capable" rule, but there should be, and that would also likely preclude a 13 year old from sitting there.
Aug 27, 2017, 7:21 pm
#59
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so, I was chilling in my favorite exit aisle seat on the 777 this morning, waiting for the other half of the plane to finish boarding.
a flight attendant was just standing in front me. She asked me if I would be willing to swap seats because a couple wanted to sit together. I politely declined and told her I picked that seat months ago. I'm very tall, so other seats wouldn't be as comfortable. She didn't seem amused. Then she asked me if I paid for that seat because exit seats are Economy Plus seats. I told her that I was Permiere Gold and E+ was free Gold members.
She left for a few minutes... then she came back and aske me again... I was standing at this time, putting my carry-on away... when I took my light jackt off, she saw the quarter-size bruise on my arm, near my hand.
Anyway, the FA said, is that an injury? I told her the cause of the bruise. She thought for a few seconds and then ordered me to another seat.
a flight attendant was just standing in front me. She asked me if I would be willing to swap seats because a couple wanted to sit together. I politely declined and told her I picked that seat months ago. I'm very tall, so other seats wouldn't be as comfortable. She didn't seem amused. Then she asked me if I paid for that seat because exit seats are Economy Plus seats. I told her that I was Permiere Gold and E+ was free Gold members.
She left for a few minutes... then she came back and aske me again... I was standing at this time, putting my carry-on away... when I took my light jackt off, she saw the quarter-size bruise on my arm, near my hand.
Anyway, the FA said, is that an injury? I told her the cause of the bruise. She thought for a few seconds and then ordered me to another seat.
Can you post date flight number and routing please?
Aug 27, 2017, 7:29 pm
#60
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Unfortunately, that is my problem. People who know me for a long time always called me Mr. Pushover.