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Man pulled off of overbooked flight UA3411 (ORD-SDF) 9 Apr 2017 {Settlement reached}

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Old Apr 10, 2017, 8:42 pm
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Statement from United Airlines Regarding Resolution with Dr. David Dao - released 27 April 2017
CHICAGO, April 27, 2017 /PRNewswire/ -- We are pleased to report that United and Dr. Dao have reached an amicable resolution of the unfortunate incident that occurred aboard flight 3411. We look forward to implementing the improvements we have announced, which will put our customers at the center of everything we do.
DOT findings related to the UA3411 9 April 2017 IDB incident 12 May 2017

What facts do we know?
  • UA3411, operated by Republic Airways, ORD-SDF on Sunday, April 9, 2017. UA3411 was the second to last flight to SDF for United. AA3509 and UA4771 were the two remaining departures for the day. Also, AA and DL had connecting options providing for same-day arrival in SDF.
  • After the flight was fully boarded, United determined four seats were needed to accommodate crew to SDF for a flight on Monday.
  • United solicited volunteers for VDB. (BUT stopped at $800 in UA$s, not cash). Chose not to go to the levels such as 1350 that airlines have been known to go even in case of weather impacted disruption)
  • After receiving no volunteers for $800 vouchers, a passenger volunteered for $1,600 and was "laughed at" and refused, United determined four passengers to be removed from the flight.
  • One passenger refused and Chicago Aviation Security Officers were called to forcibly remove the passenger.
  • The passenger hit the armrest in the aisle and received a concussion, a broken nose, a bloodied lip, and the loss of two teeth.
  • After being removed from the plane, the passenger re-boarded saying "I need to go home" repeatedly, before being removed again.
  • United spokesman Jonathan Guerin said the flight was sold out — but not oversold. Instead, United and regional affiliate Republic Airlines – the unit that operated Flight 3411 – decided they had to remove four passengers from the flight to accommodate crewmembers who were needed in Louisville the next day for a “downline connection.”

United Express Flight 3411 Review and Action Report - released 27 April 2017

Videos

Internal Communication by Oscar Munoz
Oscar Munoz sent an internal communication to UA employees (sources: View From The Wing, Chicago Tribune):
Dear Team,

Like you, I was upset to see and hear about what happened last night aboard United Express Flight 3411 headed from Chicago to Louisville. While the facts and circumstances are still evolving, especially with respect to why this customer defied Chicago Aviation Security Officers the way he did, to give you a clearer picture of what transpired, I've included below a recap from the preliminary reports filed by our employees.

As you will read, this situation was unfortunately compounded when one of the passengers we politely asked to deplane refused and it became necessary to contact Chicago Aviation Security Officers to help. Our employees followed established procedures for dealing with situations like this. While I deeply regret this situation arose, I also emphatically stand behind all of you, and I want to commend you for continuing to go above and beyond to ensure we fly right.

I do, however, believe there are lessons we can learn from this experience, and we are taking a close look at the circumstances surrounding this incident. Treating our customers and each other with respect and dignity is at the core of who we are, and we must always remember this no matter how challenging the situation.

Oscar

Summary of Flight 3411
  • On Sunday, April 9, after United Express Flight 3411 was fully boarded, United's gate agents were approached by crewmembers that were told they needed to board the flight.
  • We sought volunteers and then followed our involuntary denial of boarding process (including offering up to $1,000 in compensation) and when we approached one of these passengers to explain apologetically that he was being denied boarding, he raised his voice and refused to comply with crew member instructions.
  • He was approached a few more times after that in order to gain his compliance to come off the aircraft, and each time he refused and became more and more disruptive and belligerent.
  • Our agents were left with no choice but to call Chicago Aviation Security Officers to assist in removing the customer from the flight. He repeatedly declined to leave.
  • Chicago Aviation Security Officers were unable to gain his cooperation and physically removed him from the flight as he continued to resist - running back onto the aircraft in defiance of both our crew and security officials.
Email sent to all employees at 2:08PM on Tuesday, April 11.
Dear Team,

The truly horrific event that occurred on this flight has elicited many responses from all of us: outrage, anger, disappointment. I share all of those sentiments, and one above all: my deepest apologies for what happened. Like you, I continue to be disturbed by what happened on this flight and I deeply apologize to the customer forcibly removed and to all the customers aboard. No one should ever be mistreated this way.

I want you to know that we take full responsibility and we will work to make it right.

It’s never too late to do the right thing. I have committed to our customers and our employees that we are going to fix what’s broken so this never happens again. This will include a thorough review of crew movement, our policies for incentivizing volunteers in these situations, how we handle oversold situations and an examination of how we partner with airport authorities and local law enforcement. We’ll communicate the results of our review by April 30th.

I promise you we will do better.

Sincerely,

Oscar
Statement to customers - 27 April 2017
Each flight you take with us represents an important promise we make to you, our customer. It's not simply that we make sure you reach your destination safely and on time, but also that you will be treated with the highest level of service and the deepest sense of dignity and respect.

Earlier this month, we broke that trust when a passenger was forcibly removed from one of our planes. We can never say we are sorry enough for what occurred, but we also know meaningful actions will speak louder than words.

For the past several weeks, we have been urgently working to answer two questions: How did this happen, and how can we do our best to ensure this never happens again?

It happened because our corporate policies were placed ahead of our shared values. Our procedures got in the way of our employees doing what they know is right.

Fixing that problem starts now with changing how we fly, serve and respect our customers. This is a turning point for all of us here at United – and as CEO, it's my responsibility to make sure that we learn from this experience and redouble our efforts to put our customers at the center of everything we do.

That’s why we announced that we will no longer ask law enforcement to remove customers from a flight and customers will not be required to give up their seat once on board – except in matters of safety or security.

We also know that despite our best efforts, when things don’t go the way they should, we need to be there for you to make things right. There are several new ways we’re going to do just that.

We will increase incentives for voluntary rebooking up to $10,000 and will be eliminating the red tape on permanently lost bags with a new "no-questions-asked" $1,500 reimbursement policy. We will also be rolling out a new app for our employees that will enable them to provide on-the-spot goodwill gestures in the form of miles, travel credit and other amenities when your experience with us misses the mark. You can learn more about these commitments and many other changes at hub.united.com.

While these actions are important, I have found myself reflecting more broadly on the role we play and the responsibilities we have to you and the communities we serve.

I believe we must go further in redefining what United's corporate citizenship looks like in our society. If our chief good as a company is only getting you to and from your destination, that would show a lack of moral imagination on our part. You can and ought to expect more from us, and we intend to live up to those higher expectations in the way we embody social responsibility and civic leadership everywhere we operate. I hope you will see that pledge express itself in our actions going forward, of which these initial, though important, changes are merely a first step.

Our goal should be nothing less than to make you truly proud to say, "I fly United."

Ultimately, the measure of our success is your satisfaction and the past several weeks have moved us to go further than ever before in elevating your experience with us. I know our 87,000 employees have taken this message to heart, and they are as energized as ever to fulfill our promise to serve you better with each flight and earn the trust you’ve given us.

We are working harder than ever for the privilege to serve you and I know we will be stronger, better and the customer-focused airline you expect and deserve.

With Great Gratitude,

Oscar Munoz
CEO
United Airlines
Aftermath
Poll: Your Opinion of United Airlines Reference Material

UA's Customer Commitment says:
Occasionally we may not be able to provide you with a seat on a specific flight, even if you hold a ticket, have checked in, are present to board on time, and comply with other requirements. This is called an oversale, and occurs when restrictions apply to operating a particular flight safely (such as aircraft weight limits); when we have to substitute a smaller aircraft in place of a larger aircraft that was originally scheduled; or if more customers have checked in and are prepared to board than we have available seats.

If your flight is in an oversale situation, you will not be denied a seat until we first ask for volunteers willing to give up their confirmed seats. If there are not enough volunteers, we will deny boarding to passengers in accordance with our written policy on boarding priority. If you are involuntarily denied boarding and have complied with our check-in and other applicable rules, we will give you a written statement that describes your rights and explains how we determine boarding priority for an oversold flight. You will generally be entitled to compensation and transportation on an alternate flight.

We make complete rules for the payment of compensation, as well as our policy about boarding priorities, available at airports we serve. We will follow these rules to ensure you are treated fairly. Please be aware that you may be denied boarding without compensation if you do not check in on time or do not meet certain other requirements, or if we offer you alternative transportation that is planned to arrive at your destination or first stopover no later than one hour after the planned arrival time of your original flight.
CoC is here: https://www.united.com/web/en-US/con...-carriage.aspx
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Man pulled off of overbooked flight UA3411 (ORD-SDF) 9 Apr 2017 {Settlement reached}

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Old Apr 12, 2017, 2:09 am
  #3901  
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 118
Originally Posted by JonathanK81
This is probably why you won't be running an airline anytime soon. There was a logistical F up, that you say didn't occur. We already know it to be true. If there wasn't, they would have found an earlier solution to get the 4 employees to Kentucky without doing anything last minute. Unless that is typically how UA does things, which I'd argue would still be a logistical F up and not how an airline "works" as you put it.

Secondly, NO. The doctor doesn't get screwed. UA messed-up, they bite the bullet THEY and ONLY they get screwed. Not "someone, somewhere" That's how a good business is run. My dad owned his own business all his life. Something goes wrong, he didn't make his customers take the hit, he did. Also, his was a standard business, not one that revolves around customer service such as UA. In which case, you bend over backwards and have to do even more to make sure the customer doesn't get screwed. And that's the culprit in all of this. UA'a mentality is they value themselves and the almighty dollar over their customers. We need to be afraid of a company that doesn't value us first.
Exactly. They gamble with overbookings (although this wasn't one) and VDB/IDBs daily. If they lost the gamble because everyone showed up, it is their responsibility to pay up to make their customers whole. If that means shuttling their employees on another airline or paying customers $2000 cash to volunteer, then they need to do it. They lost their gamble and it's all part of their CoGS.

If airlines want to gamble on fuel futures, they will lose millions of dollars (CX). They don't just get to say oh well we will break our contract now that fuel prices are low.

If companies cross that line of legality it would be worse. If car makers want to gamble with illegally fudging their MPG numbers, they will be slammed if they get found out and lose that gamble. I think this situation may prompt legislation regarding how airlines needs to pay up if they lose their gamble.
milty908 is offline  
Old Apr 12, 2017, 2:10 am
  #3902  
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 41
Originally Posted by RumPatrol

The absolute best thing that has come from this disaster is that it makes the casual passenger aware of their rights. I've seen at least a dozen articles online spelling out what rights a passenger has in this situation. An educated consumer can only help. There have been high level FF, million miler types in this very thread that have mentioned they had no idea what their rights in this situation were until now.
Or rather their lack of rights. Apparently for some here, even trying to stand up for your rights and questioning an enforcement officer means that you deserve to get bruised and battered.

Rights? Apparently the passenger has none. COC states we can kick you off mid-flight as long as we give them a parachute. Don't like it? Jump off first and sue later...
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Old Apr 12, 2017, 2:14 am
  #3903  
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 118
Originally Posted by fly18725
Actually, United has given itself broad latitude to cancel the contract (ticket) with a passenger and provide a refund. The passenger's remedy is to bring the case to court, not try and maintain or reinstate the contract.

The contract is very much in favor with the airline.
They surely can cancel your ticket, but they do so without some sort of force majeure, and should you be damaged due to that cancellation without reasonable alternatives, you will recover your damages in court based on contracts law as well.

Last edited by milty908; Apr 12, 2017 at 2:19 am
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Old Apr 12, 2017, 2:16 am
  #3904  
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 41
Originally Posted by fly18725
Actually, United has given itself broad latitude to cancel the contract (ticket) with a passenger and provide a refund. The passenger's remedy is to bring the case to court, not try and maintain or reinstate the contract.

The contract is very much in favor with the airline.
So if this is purely a matter of contract law, and is up to United to enforce the terms of their unfair contract then let them enforce it. Why bring a police officer to do your bidding. The police is surely meant to protect the public from criminal syndicates not support them right?
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Old Apr 12, 2017, 2:16 am
  #3905  
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Originally Posted by worldtrav
He was hauled away in an ambulance, does that qualify as medical help?
yes I wasn't aware. But seemingly only after he had enough time for a return appearance on board and bleeding.
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Old Apr 12, 2017, 2:20 am
  #3906  
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Posts: 60,174
Originally Posted by Live4Upgrade
he failed to obey clear instructions from law enforcement. Closed case.
yeah I don't see it closing that simply.
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Old Apr 12, 2017, 2:24 am
  #3907  
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Originally Posted by 747FC
I really don't think this is relevant. In the real world, you can file a complaint or sue for wrongful detention/arrest/etc., but that is after compliance with the directive. In 99.9% of cases, failure to comply to a LEO verbal directive will result in physical means to ensure compliance. Personally, I'd like to avoid that.
Personally, I'd like to see a "cite" for that.

I'm more than 99.9% sure that the number in the post above doesn't align with my experience. I am open to being proven wrong.

I am also open to UA and its used henchmen being found to be in the wrong for this incident at ORD.
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Old Apr 12, 2017, 2:27 am
  #3908  
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 3,361
Originally Posted by milty908
They surely can cancel your ticket, but they do so without some sort of force majeure should you be damaged due to that cancellation without reasonable alternatives, you will recover your damages in court based on contracts law as well.
If a passenger believes they were damaged by cancellation or modification of their contract with an airline, you're correct that the courts is the appropriate place to seek damages.

Originally Posted by justinwong
So if this is purely a matter of contract law, and is up to United to enforce the terms of their unfair contract then let them enforce it. Why bring a police officer to do your bidding. The police is surely meant to protect the public from criminal syndicates not support them right?
Portraying airlines as a criminal syndicate will inhibit any rational discussion.
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Old Apr 12, 2017, 2:35 am
  #3909  
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 3,438
Originally Posted by STS-134
Randomly picking people and pulling them off the plane after they've already been seated is about the stupidest way you could possibly handle it.
Exactly. Their actions are predicated upon the position of power they hold, with an assumption that passengers will comply with whatever they are told, and if LEO's have to be called, so be it. They guessed wrong in this case.
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Old Apr 12, 2017, 2:39 am
  #3910  
 
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Originally Posted by JonathanK81
This is probably why you won't be running an airline anytime soon. There was a logistical F up, that you say didn't occur. We already know it to be true. If there wasn't, they would have found an earlier solution to get the 4 employees to Kentucky without doing anything last minute. Unless that is typically how UA does things, which I'd argue would still be a logistical F up and not how an airline "works" as you put it.

Secondly, NO. The doctor doesn't get screwed. UA messed-up, they bite the bullet THEY and ONLY they get screwed. Not "someone, somewhere" That's how a good business is run. My dad owned his own business all his life. Something goes wrong, he didn't make his customers take the hit, he did. Also, his was a standard business, not one that revolves around customer service such as UA. In which case, you bend over backwards and have to do even more to make sure the customer doesn't get screwed. And that's the culprit in all of this. UA'a mentality is they value themselves and the almighty dollar over their customers. We need to be afraid of a company that doesn't value us first.
These are the words of someone who very clearly does not fly all that often, or run a business for that matter. What happened in this situation happens every single day. Every. Single. Day. Every airline, everywhere. The ONLY thing that makes this situation different from the hundreds of others that occur daily without incident or fanfare is a rogue cop beat up an old man and dragged him off a plane.

Stuff happens man, like I said, look at Delta this last week. That wasn't a logistical f up, it was stuff completely out of control of air crew, air ops or gate agents. There was definitely a f up, don't get me wrong, but sometimes stuff happens and you've got to scramble.

We don't know a damn thing about what the situation was that caused these crew to be placed on the aircraft to begin with so to conclude there was a logistic f up is premature and silly. Even UAX which is well known for its tight scheduling isn't going to emergency rush a crew to Louisville, Kentucky for a next morning flight if some act of god type stuff didn't happen along the way. What if the scheduled crew for that morning flight was weather delayed getting into Louisville the previous night which would put their 10 hour rest period past the departure time for that flight? Is that a logistical f up? No.

I'm sorry but you cannot divine air crew or an aircraft out of nowhere. When the options are IDB 4 people, or delay or cancel a flight of 70, anyone who has run a lemonade stand can realize the correct choice. I'm sorry that I don't believe a business should have to sacrifice tens of thousands, if not hundreds of thousands, of dollars to accommodate 4 people. At some point a tough choice has to be made.

This situation was bad luck, mixed with some bad attitudes, a whole lot of incompetence and awful management that boiled over into a full fledged worldwide news story. I wish I could find the energy to be afraid of the big bad airlines, but I can't.

Originally Posted by justinwong
How about instead of cancelling the subsequent flight, United just cough up the funds to get the nonrevs them to that place in the first place, including if necessary chartering a plane for them. That's the cost of doing business. They should reap the rewards, but when things go balls up, they need to pay the necessary amount to do so.
No matter what you and others here would like to believe, money is not the only consideration here, which is why they got into this situation in the first place. FAA regulations are immovable no matter how much money you throw at the problem. If this air crew absolutely had to be shoehorned aboard this flight, it was because there were very real time constraints regarding their duty and rest periods.

I'm very curious how some of you ended up on this particular message board when it is evident you have nothing but contempt towards airlines. I'm not about to pretend airlines are the good guys here, but some of you act like it is the evil empire staffing the Death Star.
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Old Apr 12, 2017, 2:40 am
  #3911  
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Please stop saying that UAX selection was random.

http://www.businessinsider.com/how-a...n-delta-2017-4
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Old Apr 12, 2017, 2:43 am
  #3912  
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Programs: United Plat and falling
Posts: 100
Originally Posted by G702TT
About how many of those passengers actually know that $1350 is the limit? I did not even know. So when United is in a pinch, why not just flat out start at $1350 and offer that to everyone? Then there would be a reduced initial perception that the offer is too stingy and possibly four might have stepped right off.

I am not familiar with the COC rules about this limit. Does is state that this is the maximum the airline is allowed to compensate or are they permitted to go higher in cases at their discretion? If it is the latter, than discretion to go much higher would have been more logical from a cost stand point. The common sense in me says just raise the offer to $2500 per person + hotel and its over. Much less cost compared to paying legal and settlement fees not to mention the publicity nightmare and being the center of all late night comedy and SNL jokes.
Anyway - 1,350 is not the entitlement for IDB, it is the limit of liability. The airline is only on the hook for 4x the one-way fare of the person denied boarding up to 1,350. It can be offered in vouchers, but the passenger has to be informed that they are entitled to cash/check. For VDB, the airline can offer what they want and there are no requirements as to how it is paid, or how timely such payment is made.
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Old Apr 12, 2017, 2:43 am
  #3913  
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Originally Posted by geminidreams
Exactly, it was legal for the instruction to leave be given, whether fair or not. He was in the wrong for refusing. Yes laws and rules can be changed and then everyone will complain when fare costs go up.
Anyone can legally ask anyone else to do a whole range of things. But it's your choice whether to comply or not. 'Mandatory' compliance is a whole other level.

Just because a request isn't illegal doesn't mean it is lawful.

Please provide the legal basis where the passenger must comply with all requests, even if unlawful, by law enforcement?
LHR/MEL/Europe FF is offline  
Old Apr 12, 2017, 2:44 am
  #3914  
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: HKG/MEX
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Posts: 199
Originally Posted by BertieWooster
I agree 100%. And if UA had offered cash or gift cards rather than its monopoly money vouchers then more people may have volunteered.
Yup!
Compensation was used to be by cash!
But nowadays... Voucher...
Very disappointing...
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Old Apr 12, 2017, 2:47 am
  #3915  
 
Join Date: Sep 2015
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Posts: 8,405
Originally Posted by geminidreams
If he is asked to leave and refuses by an officer then he is doing something wrong. Whether the request is fair is another thing but they had the right and authority to ask him to get off the flight.
I doubt that. UA violated their own rules and based on that violation called the cops to handle a situation not under the PD's responsibility. I wouldn't be surprised if the lawyers of Mr. Dao file a complaint against the PD for handling a situation that is outside their jurisdiction: Last time I checked, cops weren't competent to resolve contractual disputes.

The doctor wasn't violent. He was agitated (but so would be every average pax in that situation), but remained mostly calm (cf. the video). The cop certainly hadn't any interest in hearing the passenger out. He simply played private enforcer of UA and that's where I have a BIG PROBLEM.
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