Apr 10, 2017, 8:42 pm
Last edit by: WineCountryUA
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CHICAGO, April 27, 2017 /PRNewswire/ -- We are pleased to report that United and Dr. Dao have reached an amicable resolution of the unfortunate incident that occurred aboard flight 3411. We look forward to implementing the improvements we have announced, which will put our customers at the center of everything we do.
What facts do we know?
- UA3411, operated by Republic Airways, ORD-SDF on Sunday, April 9, 2017. UA3411 was the second to last flight to SDF for United. AA3509 and UA4771 were the two remaining departures for the day. Also, AA and DL had connecting options providing for same-day arrival in SDF.
- After the flight was fully boarded, United determined four seats were needed to accommodate crew to SDF for a flight on Monday.
- United solicited volunteers for VDB. (BUT stopped at $800 in UA$s, not cash). Chose not to go to the levels such as 1350 that airlines have been known to go even in case of weather impacted disruption)
- After receiving no volunteers for $800 vouchers, a passenger volunteered for $1,600 and was "laughed at" and refused, United determined four passengers to be removed from the flight.
- One passenger refused and Chicago Aviation Security Officers were called to forcibly remove the passenger.
- The passenger hit the armrest in the aisle and received a concussion, a broken nose, a bloodied lip, and the loss of two teeth.
- After being removed from the plane, the passenger re-boarded saying "I need to go home" repeatedly, before being removed again.
- United spokesman Jonathan Guerin said the flight was sold out — but not oversold. Instead, United and regional affiliate Republic Airlines – the unit that operated Flight 3411 – decided they had to remove four passengers from the flight to accommodate crewmembers who were needed in Louisville the next day for a “downline connection.”
United Express Flight 3411 Review and Action Report - released 27 April 2017
Videos
- Passenger one row behind and on the aisle footage BEFORE man was dragged off https://www.liveleak.com/view?i=655_1492004707
- Videos of man being removed https://www.liveleak.com/view?i=4b7_1491983214 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0nAZEk6nsNE
- Video of man re-entering plane https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HNEQDWpYbZA (link dead)
Internal Communication by Oscar Munoz
Oscar Munoz sent an internal communication to UA employees (sources: View From The Wing, Chicago Tribune):
Dear Team,
Like you, I was upset to see and hear about what happened last night aboard United Express Flight 3411 headed from Chicago to Louisville. While the facts and circumstances are still evolving, especially with respect to why this customer defied Chicago Aviation Security Officers the way he did, to give you a clearer picture of what transpired, I've included below a recap from the preliminary reports filed by our employees.
As you will read, this situation was unfortunately compounded when one of the passengers we politely asked to deplane refused and it became necessary to contact Chicago Aviation Security Officers to help. Our employees followed established procedures for dealing with situations like this. While I deeply regret this situation arose, I also emphatically stand behind all of you, and I want to commend you for continuing to go above and beyond to ensure we fly right.
I do, however, believe there are lessons we can learn from this experience, and we are taking a close look at the circumstances surrounding this incident. Treating our customers and each other with respect and dignity is at the core of who we are, and we must always remember this no matter how challenging the situation.
Oscar
Summary of Flight 3411
Like you, I was upset to see and hear about what happened last night aboard United Express Flight 3411 headed from Chicago to Louisville. While the facts and circumstances are still evolving, especially with respect to why this customer defied Chicago Aviation Security Officers the way he did, to give you a clearer picture of what transpired, I've included below a recap from the preliminary reports filed by our employees.
As you will read, this situation was unfortunately compounded when one of the passengers we politely asked to deplane refused and it became necessary to contact Chicago Aviation Security Officers to help. Our employees followed established procedures for dealing with situations like this. While I deeply regret this situation arose, I also emphatically stand behind all of you, and I want to commend you for continuing to go above and beyond to ensure we fly right.
I do, however, believe there are lessons we can learn from this experience, and we are taking a close look at the circumstances surrounding this incident. Treating our customers and each other with respect and dignity is at the core of who we are, and we must always remember this no matter how challenging the situation.
Oscar
Summary of Flight 3411
- On Sunday, April 9, after United Express Flight 3411 was fully boarded, United's gate agents were approached by crewmembers that were told they needed to board the flight.
- We sought volunteers and then followed our involuntary denial of boarding process (including offering up to $1,000 in compensation) and when we approached one of these passengers to explain apologetically that he was being denied boarding, he raised his voice and refused to comply with crew member instructions.
- He was approached a few more times after that in order to gain his compliance to come off the aircraft, and each time he refused and became more and more disruptive and belligerent.
- Our agents were left with no choice but to call Chicago Aviation Security Officers to assist in removing the customer from the flight. He repeatedly declined to leave.
- Chicago Aviation Security Officers were unable to gain his cooperation and physically removed him from the flight as he continued to resist - running back onto the aircraft in defiance of both our crew and security officials.
Dear Team,
The truly horrific event that occurred on this flight has elicited many responses from all of us: outrage, anger, disappointment. I share all of those sentiments, and one above all: my deepest apologies for what happened. Like you, I continue to be disturbed by what happened on this flight and I deeply apologize to the customer forcibly removed and to all the customers aboard. No one should ever be mistreated this way.
I want you to know that we take full responsibility and we will work to make it right.
It’s never too late to do the right thing. I have committed to our customers and our employees that we are going to fix what’s broken so this never happens again. This will include a thorough review of crew movement, our policies for incentivizing volunteers in these situations, how we handle oversold situations and an examination of how we partner with airport authorities and local law enforcement. We’ll communicate the results of our review by April 30th.
I promise you we will do better.
Sincerely,
Oscar
The truly horrific event that occurred on this flight has elicited many responses from all of us: outrage, anger, disappointment. I share all of those sentiments, and one above all: my deepest apologies for what happened. Like you, I continue to be disturbed by what happened on this flight and I deeply apologize to the customer forcibly removed and to all the customers aboard. No one should ever be mistreated this way.
I want you to know that we take full responsibility and we will work to make it right.
It’s never too late to do the right thing. I have committed to our customers and our employees that we are going to fix what’s broken so this never happens again. This will include a thorough review of crew movement, our policies for incentivizing volunteers in these situations, how we handle oversold situations and an examination of how we partner with airport authorities and local law enforcement. We’ll communicate the results of our review by April 30th.
I promise you we will do better.
Sincerely,
Oscar
Each flight you take with us represents an important promise we make to you, our customer. It's not simply that we make sure you reach your destination safely and on time, but also that you will be treated with the highest level of service and the deepest sense of dignity and respect.
Earlier this month, we broke that trust when a passenger was forcibly removed from one of our planes. We can never say we are sorry enough for what occurred, but we also know meaningful actions will speak louder than words.
For the past several weeks, we have been urgently working to answer two questions: How did this happen, and how can we do our best to ensure this never happens again?
It happened because our corporate policies were placed ahead of our shared values. Our procedures got in the way of our employees doing what they know is right.
Fixing that problem starts now with changing how we fly, serve and respect our customers. This is a turning point for all of us here at United – and as CEO, it's my responsibility to make sure that we learn from this experience and redouble our efforts to put our customers at the center of everything we do.
That’s why we announced that we will no longer ask law enforcement to remove customers from a flight and customers will not be required to give up their seat once on board – except in matters of safety or security.
We also know that despite our best efforts, when things don’t go the way they should, we need to be there for you to make things right. There are several new ways we’re going to do just that.
We will increase incentives for voluntary rebooking up to $10,000 and will be eliminating the red tape on permanently lost bags with a new "no-questions-asked" $1,500 reimbursement policy. We will also be rolling out a new app for our employees that will enable them to provide on-the-spot goodwill gestures in the form of miles, travel credit and other amenities when your experience with us misses the mark. You can learn more about these commitments and many other changes at hub.united.com.
While these actions are important, I have found myself reflecting more broadly on the role we play and the responsibilities we have to you and the communities we serve.
I believe we must go further in redefining what United's corporate citizenship looks like in our society. If our chief good as a company is only getting you to and from your destination, that would show a lack of moral imagination on our part. You can and ought to expect more from us, and we intend to live up to those higher expectations in the way we embody social responsibility and civic leadership everywhere we operate. I hope you will see that pledge express itself in our actions going forward, of which these initial, though important, changes are merely a first step.
Our goal should be nothing less than to make you truly proud to say, "I fly United."
Ultimately, the measure of our success is your satisfaction and the past several weeks have moved us to go further than ever before in elevating your experience with us. I know our 87,000 employees have taken this message to heart, and they are as energized as ever to fulfill our promise to serve you better with each flight and earn the trust you’ve given us.
We are working harder than ever for the privilege to serve you and I know we will be stronger, better and the customer-focused airline you expect and deserve.
With Great Gratitude,
Oscar Munoz
CEO
United Airlines
Earlier this month, we broke that trust when a passenger was forcibly removed from one of our planes. We can never say we are sorry enough for what occurred, but we also know meaningful actions will speak louder than words.
For the past several weeks, we have been urgently working to answer two questions: How did this happen, and how can we do our best to ensure this never happens again?
It happened because our corporate policies were placed ahead of our shared values. Our procedures got in the way of our employees doing what they know is right.
Fixing that problem starts now with changing how we fly, serve and respect our customers. This is a turning point for all of us here at United – and as CEO, it's my responsibility to make sure that we learn from this experience and redouble our efforts to put our customers at the center of everything we do.
That’s why we announced that we will no longer ask law enforcement to remove customers from a flight and customers will not be required to give up their seat once on board – except in matters of safety or security.
We also know that despite our best efforts, when things don’t go the way they should, we need to be there for you to make things right. There are several new ways we’re going to do just that.
We will increase incentives for voluntary rebooking up to $10,000 and will be eliminating the red tape on permanently lost bags with a new "no-questions-asked" $1,500 reimbursement policy. We will also be rolling out a new app for our employees that will enable them to provide on-the-spot goodwill gestures in the form of miles, travel credit and other amenities when your experience with us misses the mark. You can learn more about these commitments and many other changes at hub.united.com.
While these actions are important, I have found myself reflecting more broadly on the role we play and the responsibilities we have to you and the communities we serve.
I believe we must go further in redefining what United's corporate citizenship looks like in our society. If our chief good as a company is only getting you to and from your destination, that would show a lack of moral imagination on our part. You can and ought to expect more from us, and we intend to live up to those higher expectations in the way we embody social responsibility and civic leadership everywhere we operate. I hope you will see that pledge express itself in our actions going forward, of which these initial, though important, changes are merely a first step.
Our goal should be nothing less than to make you truly proud to say, "I fly United."
Ultimately, the measure of our success is your satisfaction and the past several weeks have moved us to go further than ever before in elevating your experience with us. I know our 87,000 employees have taken this message to heart, and they are as energized as ever to fulfill our promise to serve you better with each flight and earn the trust you’ve given us.
We are working harder than ever for the privilege to serve you and I know we will be stronger, better and the customer-focused airline you expect and deserve.
With Great Gratitude,
Oscar Munoz
CEO
United Airlines
- Chicago Aviation Department said on the Monday afternoon after the incident that the officer who had dragged the passenger off the plane had been placed on leave pending an investigation. Spokesperson Karen Pride said in an email that "The incident on United flight 3411 was not in accordance with our standard operating procedure and the actions of the aviation security officer are obviously not condoned by the Department."
- 4/12/17: Two more Chicago Aviation officers involved are suspended
- Muñoz does ABC interview, announcing United will no longer use law enforcement to remove passengers: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=90jSUe_vdhM
- United announces policy change that crews traveling on their aircraft must be booked at least 60 minutes prior to departure.
- United releases multiple changes in overbooking / denied boarding policies "We are making changes to ensure that we always put customers first" (http://newsroom.united.com/2017-04-2...mer-Experience) released 27 April 2017
- Statement from United Airlines Regarding Resolution with Dr. David Dao - released 27 April 2017
- Response to Senate Commerce Committee questions - 1 May 2017
- United Airlines PR Boss to Step Down
- James Long, one of several officers involved in removing David Dao from the April 9, 2017, flight to make room for airline employees, filed suit on Tuesday against United, Chicago’s Department of Aviation and its commissioner, Ginger Evans. The lawsuit, filed in the circuit court of Cook County, Illinois, alleges he was not properly trained on how to use force.
Poll: Your Opinion of United Airlines
Poll link: https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/KP68GYG
Results link: https://www.surveymonkey.com/results...Q6B2B/instant/
Reference MaterialResults link: https://www.surveymonkey.com/results...Q6B2B/instant/
UA's Customer Commitment says:
Occasionally we may not be able to provide you with a seat on a specific flight, even if you hold a ticket, have checked in, are present to board on time, and comply with other requirements. This is called an oversale, and occurs when restrictions apply to operating a particular flight safely (such as aircraft weight limits); when we have to substitute a smaller aircraft in place of a larger aircraft that was originally scheduled; or if more customers have checked in and are prepared to board than we have available seats.
If your flight is in an oversale situation, you will not be denied a seat until we first ask for volunteers willing to give up their confirmed seats. If there are not enough volunteers, we will deny boarding to passengers in accordance with our written policy on boarding priority. If you are involuntarily denied boarding and have complied with our check-in and other applicable rules, we will give you a written statement that describes your rights and explains how we determine boarding priority for an oversold flight. You will generally be entitled to compensation and transportation on an alternate flight.
We make complete rules for the payment of compensation, as well as our policy about boarding priorities, available at airports we serve. We will follow these rules to ensure you are treated fairly. Please be aware that you may be denied boarding without compensation if you do not check in on time or do not meet certain other requirements, or if we offer you alternative transportation that is planned to arrive at your destination or first stopover no later than one hour after the planned arrival time of your original flight.
CoC is here: https://www.united.com/web/en-US/con...-carriage.aspxIf your flight is in an oversale situation, you will not be denied a seat until we first ask for volunteers willing to give up their confirmed seats. If there are not enough volunteers, we will deny boarding to passengers in accordance with our written policy on boarding priority. If you are involuntarily denied boarding and have complied with our check-in and other applicable rules, we will give you a written statement that describes your rights and explains how we determine boarding priority for an oversold flight. You will generally be entitled to compensation and transportation on an alternate flight.
We make complete rules for the payment of compensation, as well as our policy about boarding priorities, available at airports we serve. We will follow these rules to ensure you are treated fairly. Please be aware that you may be denied boarding without compensation if you do not check in on time or do not meet certain other requirements, or if we offer you alternative transportation that is planned to arrive at your destination or first stopover no later than one hour after the planned arrival time of your original flight.
Man pulled off of overbooked flight UA3411 (ORD-SDF) 9 Apr 2017 {Settlement reached}
Apr 11, 2017, 10:04 pm
#3751
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: DEN
Programs: UA Plat
Posts: 754
Counter checks are legally required for IDB. VDB, is, of course, your deal with the airline. Now, United has a history of refusing to provide that legally mandated cash compensation for IDBs- they always try the flight certs and when confronted by a knowledgable passenger, they usually turn hostile.
They can get away with breaking the law. Simple as that.
They can get away with breaking the law. Simple as that.
Apr 11, 2017, 10:04 pm
#3752
Suspended
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Brunei
Programs: Enrich Sapphire. Kris Flyer Silver.Le Club Accorhotels,Starwood.
Posts: 2,201
Well that is an issue you need to take up with the federal government, not with United Airlines, or any airline for that matter. Federal law gives very little in terms of rights or compensation towards commercial air passengers. That's the way it is and as long as it is that way, airlines will take advantage of it. Can you really blame them? We can only hope this nightmare gets some real changes rolling as it pertains to VDB/IDB compensation.
I agree wholeheartedly that 4xfare in an era where ~$100 one way Y fares aren't uncommon is laughable and hardly a penalty to the airline. I also think the suggestion a few posts back mandating all DB compensation, including VDB, be paid in cash rather than vouchers is wise. Vouchers aren't worth jack to the majority of flyers and worth even less to the airline. Might as well be monopoly money.
I agree wholeheartedly that 4xfare in an era where ~$100 one way Y fares aren't uncommon is laughable and hardly a penalty to the airline. I also think the suggestion a few posts back mandating all DB compensation, including VDB, be paid in cash rather than vouchers is wise. Vouchers aren't worth jack to the majority of flyers and worth even less to the airline. Might as well be monopoly money.
Just because the laws side with the airline, does not mean common sense and sensible decision making goes out the window and mistreating passengers like sub-human's is acceptable.
The problem lies with the attitude of the ground staff and the management who not only hire people with this mentality and idea that the customer is not always right and the airline is never wrong and they can do as they please.
Whoever decided to offload the passengers has gotten away scott free. His or her name has not been mentioned but that individual who was bloodied and bruised is all over the news and social media.
I would very much like to know the rational of bumping 4 passengers off a flight that was ready to depart instead of sending the 4 crew members an hour later on a rival airliner that was going to the very same destination.
And who in flight operations decided to do this and for what reason.
I wish UA would stop hiding and covering up their mistakes and pretending this will all go away tommorrow.
Apr 11, 2017, 10:04 pm
#3753
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 110
Not only that but why is there a "surprise" we need 4 emergency seats for the crew? Did they somehow get stuck in ORD? Don't they have all their schedules planned well in advance?
The story sounds pretty fishy as that UA3411 plane is a small ERJ-170 with 74 total seats. 4 overbooked (5.4%) seems ridiculous - do they really expect over 5% no shows? I'd expect them to overbook 1 or 2 seats max.
The story sounds pretty fishy as that UA3411 plane is a small ERJ-170 with 74 total seats. 4 overbooked (5.4%) seems ridiculous - do they really expect over 5% no shows? I'd expect them to overbook 1 or 2 seats max.
If it was me, the real dealbreaker wouldn't have been the $800, rather the 3pm flight the next day. If I could have gotten on an early flight Monday morning, then the whole day wouldn't have been wrecked.
But this was only 5pm. There was plenty of time to react/rebook/reaccomodate. But in typical BS UNITED style, they didn't bother to do anything beyond the most basic.
Heck, I've never lived in Chicago and don't know THAT much about it, but could have come up with a bunch of alternatives:
- AA has a hub at Ohare. Don't they have flights to Kentucky?
- SW has a lot of flights from Midway. Shuttle the crew or passengers over there.
- Charter a limo and drive the passengers to Kentucky.
- Same with the crew.
- Fly them to CVG. Just a couple of hours more to Kentucky from there.
- Fly them to Atlanta, and overnight them there, then put them on the 1st flight to Kentucky the next morning.
- Ditto with Charlotte, Memphis (are they still a hub?), etc....
- Fly them somewhere ELSE in Kentucky. If I remember correctly, aren't there quite a few fairly large cities there?
- Ditto to Nashville?
But this was only 5pm. There was plenty of time to react/rebook/reaccomodate. But in typical BS UNITED style, they didn't bother to do anything beyond the most basic.
Heck, I've never lived in Chicago and don't know THAT much about it, but could have come up with a bunch of alternatives:
- AA has a hub at Ohare. Don't they have flights to Kentucky?
- SW has a lot of flights from Midway. Shuttle the crew or passengers over there.
- Charter a limo and drive the passengers to Kentucky.
- Same with the crew.
- Fly them to CVG. Just a couple of hours more to Kentucky from there.
- Fly them to Atlanta, and overnight them there, then put them on the 1st flight to Kentucky the next morning.
- Ditto with Charlotte, Memphis (are they still a hub?), etc....
- Fly them somewhere ELSE in Kentucky. If I remember correctly, aren't there quite a few fairly large cities there?
- Ditto to Nashville?
Apr 11, 2017, 10:07 pm
#3754
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Minneapolis: DL DM charter 2.3MM
Programs: A3*Gold, SPG Plat, HyattDiamond, MarriottPP, LHW exAccess, ICI, Raffles Amb, NW PE MM, TWA Gold MM
Posts: 100,417
This is one of the things that drives me crazy about airline behavior (not just UA--they all do this): they consistently put their staff ahead of their customers. Examples:
--Taking paying customers off a flight in order to accommodate crew.
--Delivering crew bags at baggage claim ahead of passenger bags
--Accommodating crew carryons in the cabin when passenger bags are gate checked
--Filling the overhead bins with crew bags (recently was in business class on another airline in bulkhead seats and found that the entire overhead bin was filled with crew bags--the mini cabin was only one row, so there was literally nowhere to put a carryon).
--Cutting in front of passengers at security checkpoints
--Reserving one lavatory just for crew use (rare, but I see it a few times per year)
I am not saying that they don't have an occasional late inbound aircraft and need to make a tight connection--just like some pax--and need to skip a line once in a while--just like some pax--but I cannot think of another business that puts employees ahead of paying customers on such a regular basis as normal operating procedure. It is just bad customer service.
--Taking paying customers off a flight in order to accommodate crew.
--Delivering crew bags at baggage claim ahead of passenger bags
--Accommodating crew carryons in the cabin when passenger bags are gate checked
--Filling the overhead bins with crew bags (recently was in business class on another airline in bulkhead seats and found that the entire overhead bin was filled with crew bags--the mini cabin was only one row, so there was literally nowhere to put a carryon).
--Cutting in front of passengers at security checkpoints
--Reserving one lavatory just for crew use (rare, but I see it a few times per year)
I am not saying that they don't have an occasional late inbound aircraft and need to make a tight connection--just like some pax--and need to skip a line once in a while--just like some pax--but I cannot think of another business that puts employees ahead of paying customers on such a regular basis as normal operating procedure. It is just bad customer service.
An addition to your list that I've personally experienced is the incoming international crew being allowed to board shuttle buses between terminals first, before a long line of passengers who have been waiting much longer. Then, on the bus, those same crew members put their possessions on empty seats so that each uniformed crew member takes three seats for himself/herself. Very few passengers can board the shuttle bus so that the customers must wait even longer in unpleasant conditions and possibly miss connecting flights.
ADDED: Another one was when a big bunch of nonrevs were boarded in FC on a long flight with dinner service so that it became a nonrev party flight. Looking after their own, the FAs served dinner to the nonrevs first and ran out of all meal choices. I arrived absolutely starving but it was too late to get dinner either in the airport or at my hotel (or in fact anywhere I could have gone so late that night).
Last edited by MSPeconomist; Apr 12, 2017 at 11:13 am
Apr 11, 2017, 10:10 pm
#3755
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Chicagoland, IL, USA
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Posts: 14,193
LEX from ORD might have been an alternative for the deadheaders. About 70 minutes' drive from SDF. But it is pretty busy these days with Keeneland running.
Apr 11, 2017, 10:13 pm
#3756
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Everywhere and Nowhere
Programs: DL GM
Posts: 515
I don't agree that this was entirely UA's fault though. IDBs happen daily, hundreds of them. The only thing that made this incident worldwide news was overreaching rent-a-cops under guise of law decided the only way they could get an elderly man off a plane was beat the crap out of him and drag him off. That's a Chicago Aviation Security issue, and a big one at that.
Could UA avoided this by not being stingy, of course, but I get the sense that UA and their affiliates don't give GAs much leeway to spend more than they absolutely have to.
I think when the dust settles UA would have been close to better off financially if they had bought a commuter jet to fly the crew on, not just leased one.
But the simple solution all along was to up the VDB offer. The at most get would have cost a few grand. Let's put real numbers down. Let's assume the UA CEO is paid $10,000,000 per year. With a month of vacation and 40 hour weeks that's about $5200 per hour. Do you think he's spent 30 minutes dealing with this today (and yesterday and tomorrow etc). That doesn't include the lawsuit(s) and lost revenue. And this over maybe an extra $800 ($1600 for a VDB)?
But the simple solution all along was to up the VDB offer. The at most get would have cost a few grand. Let's put real numbers down. Let's assume the UA CEO is paid $10,000,000 per year. With a month of vacation and 40 hour weeks that's about $5200 per hour. Do you think he's spent 30 minutes dealing with this today (and yesterday and tomorrow etc). That doesn't include the lawsuit(s) and lost revenue. And this over maybe an extra $800 ($1600 for a VDB)?
I've said before that I get the sense from this incident that United doesn't allow their GAs a whole lot of leeway to use initiative or common sense with the company's money. I would not be shocked if it was drilled into the GA's head to not give up any more in VDB money than the computer said she could.
Something for the new CEO to work on once Munoz is shoved out.
Apr 11, 2017, 10:14 pm
#3757
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 110
Not sure he's going to get anything out of this. At the end of the day, United's story is we called the cops and they punched you in the face. Don't like it sue the cops. Suing cops usually ends in pretty small settlements if any. Maybe they pay out due to bad PR.
Not sure how it's United liability of what cops do. I'm sure they didn't tell them to go punch the guy in the face.
If I call the cops and they beat up some guy trespassing on my property am I going to be liable? I think not...
Furthermore, "fame" is a 2 edge sword - news is all over this guy Dr David Dao. Married guy that is a convicted felon for trading drugs for gay sex...
Can't be something you are proud of and if no one knew before they sure do now...
Not sure how it's United liability of what cops do. I'm sure they didn't tell them to go punch the guy in the face.
If I call the cops and they beat up some guy trespassing on my property am I going to be liable? I think not...
Furthermore, "fame" is a 2 edge sword - news is all over this guy Dr David Dao. Married guy that is a convicted felon for trading drugs for gay sex...
Can't be something you are proud of and if no one knew before they sure do now...
Choice C is incorrect.
-get dragged down the aisle while being filmed, become a youtube star, make millions in a settlement.
now we're going to have a bunch of violence on airplanes as people try to recreate a situation to get their 15 mins of fame and millions in settlements.
-get dragged down the aisle while being filmed, become a youtube star, make millions in a settlement.
now we're going to have a bunch of violence on airplanes as people try to recreate a situation to get their 15 mins of fame and millions in settlements.
Apr 11, 2017, 10:17 pm
#3758
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: PHX
Programs: AS 75K; UA 1MM; Hyatt Globalist; Marriott LTP; Hilton Diamond (Aspire)
Posts: 56,478
He'll get a nice payday.
Here I agree with you. This is not likely to be an overall positive event in the poor guy's life. Dude just wanted to get home.
In fact, part of the reason he'll get a nice payday is all the unwanted publicity, which undoubtedly will result in great emotional distress.
In fact, part of the reason he'll get a nice payday is all the unwanted publicity, which undoubtedly will result in great emotional distress.
Apr 11, 2017, 10:19 pm
#3759
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: CLE (mostly)
Programs: UA Plat, Hyatt Explorist, Mlife Gold, Starbucks Gold
Posts: 823
This might be the longest thread I've ever seen on FT.
Apr 11, 2017, 10:19 pm
#3760
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: San Diego, CA
Programs: AA ex-EXP, 2MM (ex DL, ex TWA)
Posts: 1,433
Not sure he's going to get anything out of this. At the end of the day, United's story is we called the cops and they punched you in the face. Don't like it sue the cops. Suing cops usually ends in pretty small settlements if any. Maybe they pay out due to bad PR.
Not sure how it's United liability of what cops do.
Not sure how it's United liability of what cops do.
Apr 11, 2017, 10:22 pm
#3761
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: San Diego, CA
Programs: AA ex-EXP, 2MM (ex DL, ex TWA)
Posts: 1,433
Can I ask a question which I have not seen addressed previously (though I have not read 100% of this thread): How did the victim's name get into the public area? Was it released/leaked by United? Was it the police?
Apr 11, 2017, 10:26 pm
#3762
Suspended
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Brunei
Programs: Enrich Sapphire. Kris Flyer Silver.Le Club Accorhotels,Starwood.
Posts: 2,201
Not sure he's going to get anything out of this. At the end of the day, United's story is we called the cops and they punched you in the face. Don't like it sue the cops. Suing cops usually ends in pretty small settlements if any. Maybe they pay out due to bad PR.
Not sure how it's United liability of what cops do. I'm sure they didn't tell them to go punch the guy in the face.
If I call the cops and they beat up some guy trespassing on my property am I going to be liable? I think not...
Furthermore, "fame" is a 2 edge sword - news is all over this guy Dr David Dao. Married guy that is a convicted felon for trading drugs for gay sex...
Can't be something you are proud of and if no one knew before they sure do now...
Not sure how it's United liability of what cops do. I'm sure they didn't tell them to go punch the guy in the face.
If I call the cops and they beat up some guy trespassing on my property am I going to be liable? I think not...
Furthermore, "fame" is a 2 edge sword - news is all over this guy Dr David Dao. Married guy that is a convicted felon for trading drugs for gay sex...
Can't be something you are proud of and if no one knew before they sure do now...
2) The passenger was well within his rights to reject a request to be off loaded as he had a duty to his patients the following day and the airline should have looked at the option of 1 of the substitute pilots potentially taking a jump seat and solving the problem. Approval could have been given for this from flight operations and this would not have been an issue.
3) The airline had alternative actions it could have taken but chose not to do so without this becoming physical.
Apr 11, 2017, 10:28 pm
#3763
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 110
This is a lesson in life I learned as a kid: anytime you are somebody they will try to dig dirt up on you so better live a clean life if you want to be somebody.
But back to the original question it's all over the news as his name comes up immediately:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017...oliciting-gay/
http://nypost.com/2017/04/11/doctor-...drugs-for-sex/
Probably smear campaign from the police but you can't make that stuff up...
But back to the original question it's all over the news as his name comes up immediately:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017...oliciting-gay/
http://nypost.com/2017/04/11/doctor-...drugs-for-sex/
Probably smear campaign from the police but you can't make that stuff up...
Apr 11, 2017, 10:28 pm
#3764
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: NY Metro Area
Programs: AA 2MM Yay!, UA MM, Costco General Member
Posts: 49,049
Not sure he's going to get anything out of this. At the end of the day, United's story is we called the cops and they punched you in the face. Don't like it sue the cops. Suing cops usually ends in pretty small settlements if any. Maybe they pay out due to bad PR.
Not sure how it's United liability of what cops do. I'm sure they didn't tell them to go punch the guy in the face.
If I call the cops and they beat up some guy trespassing on my property am I going to be liable? I think not...
Furthermore, "fame" is a 2 edge sword - news is all over this guy Dr David Dao. Married guy that is a convicted felon for trading drugs for gay sex...
Can't be something you are proud of and if no one knew before they sure do now...
Not sure how it's United liability of what cops do. I'm sure they didn't tell them to go punch the guy in the face.
If I call the cops and they beat up some guy trespassing on my property am I going to be liable? I think not...
Furthermore, "fame" is a 2 edge sword - news is all over this guy Dr David Dao. Married guy that is a convicted felon for trading drugs for gay sex...
Can't be something you are proud of and if no one knew before they sure do now...
Apr 11, 2017, 10:29 pm
#3765
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Left Coast
Posts: 862
This captured the attention of many. I was riding an Amtrak train today and the conductors were talking amongst themselves about this. I wanted to tell them "you should check out the thread on FT, much better than getting it from the TV news."