Apr 23, 2013, 6:22 pm
Last edit by: WineCountryUA
Presented as Q&A format (Originally posted by Alex_B)
Q: What is a stopover?
A: A stopover on an international itinerary is any break in your air travel for more than 24 hours except at the destination.
Q: What is an open-jaw?
A: An open-jaw is where you travel by your own means (either land, sea or a separate air ticket) between two points in a journey.
Q: How many stopovers am I allowed on a roundtrip award?
A: One stopover, in addition to the destination, is permitted (an unlimited number of stops less than 24hours is allowable).
Q: How many open-jaws are allowed on a roundtrip award?
A: Two open-jaws are permitted. These must be at the stopover, destination or origin.
Q: Can I have a stopover or open-jaw on a one-way award?
A: No
Q: Can I have a open-jaw at both the stopover and destination?
A: Yes, plenty of posters have reported success in booking this
Q: Can I transit my destination multiple times (e.g. fly to JNB, fly to CPT and then return home via JNB)?
A: Yes, plenty of posters have reported success in booking this. You can only stop in your destination for > 24 hours once though.
Q: Can I cross both oceans?
A: Yes. The rule that prohibited crossing both oceans appears to have been removed from both MP and *A award rules. There are many many successful examples of people booking these itineraries.
Q: Is EWR-PVG transatlantic or transpacific?
A: US-East Asia/South East Asia is always transpacific no matter what geography might suggest.
Q: Do I pay more for a stopover or open-jaw?
A: Typically no additional mileage is required but additional taxes or fees are often payable (especially in UK with high Air Passenger Duty). Extra mileage will often be required if an open-jaw or stopover adds a higher cost region into the itinerary. Also awards wholly within CONUS, Canada and Alaska (formerly known as Series 0 awards) require additional mileage (10K miles) for a stopover of >4 hrs.
Q: What's this about a free one-way I can get on awards?
A: The concept of free one-ways is a misnomer and often confuses people, it is better to consider it a stopover in the city of origin. If you have a simple roundtrip award without a stopover, you can often create a stopover and open-jaw at your origin on the return leg to add an addition flight. E.g. I wish to book EWR-LHR (destination)-EWR which is a roundtrip US-Europe award. I could also book this as EWR-LHR (destination)-EWR (stopover)-SFO for the same mileage (and a few dollars of extra tax). The EWR segment would need to be within 330 days of booking and would be subject to the usual change fees.
Other notes:
Seeing your fare construction on an already booked award ticket:
In order to see your award fare construction to see where your stopovers and destination are, follow these steps.
Go to http://www.saudiairlines.com/
Then hit "Manage My Bookings" and select "E-Ticket"
Enter your UA ticket number (hint: 016 will go in the first box, and then everything else in the second box). Then your last name and hit "Retrieve My Booking". On the next page you'll see a line like this under "Fare Calculation":
CHI LH X/FRA LH ROM0.00CSM/YB52 /- FLR LH X/FRA LH X/DUS LH CHI UA SEA
This example is:
ORD-FRA-FCO
Open Jaw at Destination
FLR-FRA-DUS-ORD
Stopover at origin
ORD-SEA
Q: What is a stopover?
A: A stopover on an international itinerary is any break in your air travel for more than 24 hours except at the destination.
Q: What is an open-jaw?
A: An open-jaw is where you travel by your own means (either land, sea or a separate air ticket) between two points in a journey.
Q: How many stopovers am I allowed on a roundtrip award?
A: One stopover, in addition to the destination, is permitted (an unlimited number of stops less than 24hours is allowable).
Q: How many open-jaws are allowed on a roundtrip award?
A: Two open-jaws are permitted. These must be at the stopover, destination or origin.
Q: Can I have a stopover or open-jaw on a one-way award?
A: No
Q: Can I have a open-jaw at both the stopover and destination?
A: Yes, plenty of posters have reported success in booking this
Q: Can I transit my destination multiple times (e.g. fly to JNB, fly to CPT and then return home via JNB)?
A: Yes, plenty of posters have reported success in booking this. You can only stop in your destination for > 24 hours once though.
Q: Can I cross both oceans?
A: Yes. The rule that prohibited crossing both oceans appears to have been removed from both MP and *A award rules. There are many many successful examples of people booking these itineraries.
Q: Is EWR-PVG transatlantic or transpacific?
A: US-East Asia/South East Asia is always transpacific no matter what geography might suggest.
Q: Do I pay more for a stopover or open-jaw?
A: Typically no additional mileage is required but additional taxes or fees are often payable (especially in UK with high Air Passenger Duty). Extra mileage will often be required if an open-jaw or stopover adds a higher cost region into the itinerary. Also awards wholly within CONUS, Canada and Alaska (formerly known as Series 0 awards) require additional mileage (10K miles) for a stopover of >4 hrs.
Q: What's this about a free one-way I can get on awards?
A: The concept of free one-ways is a misnomer and often confuses people, it is better to consider it a stopover in the city of origin. If you have a simple roundtrip award without a stopover, you can often create a stopover and open-jaw at your origin on the return leg to add an addition flight. E.g. I wish to book EWR-LHR (destination)-EWR which is a roundtrip US-Europe award. I could also book this as EWR-LHR (destination)-EWR (stopover)-SFO for the same mileage (and a few dollars of extra tax). The EWR segment would need to be within 330 days of booking and would be subject to the usual change fees.
Other notes:
- The open-jaw portion must be smaller (in miles) than any other leg. -While technically true for revenue fare construction this is not strictly enforced on awards.
- For awards between CONUS/Canada/Alaska and South Asia award regions the maximum number of segments is 5 segments each way on a round-trip and 4 segments on a one-way. (Note that many FTers report recently being read a memo that imposes an eight segment maximum on a roundtrip (4 each way). It is unclear whether this eight-segment maximum is limited to South Asia routings through Europe or North Asia, or has broader application.)
- Stopovers and open-jaws are NOT additive. You do not get extra stops included in your itinerary simply by making an open-jaw out of it.
Seeing your fare construction on an already booked award ticket:
In order to see your award fare construction to see where your stopovers and destination are, follow these steps.
Go to http://www.saudiairlines.com/
Then hit "Manage My Bookings" and select "E-Ticket"
Enter your UA ticket number (hint: 016 will go in the first box, and then everything else in the second box). Then your last name and hit "Retrieve My Booking". On the next page you'll see a line like this under "Fare Calculation":
CHI LH X/FRA LH ROM0.00CSM/YB52 /- FLR LH X/FRA LH X/DUS LH CHI UA SEA
This example is:
ORD-FRA-FCO
Open Jaw at Destination
FLR-FRA-DUS-ORD
Stopover at origin
ORD-SEA
Rules for Open Jaw & Stopover Award Flights (Consolidated)
Jun 22, 2012, 3:37 pm
#136
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Florida
Posts: 29,762
I notice that when searching for international round trip awards with a stopover, there is less availability (both in terms of awards seats being available and the number of flights that show up in the search).
I'm comparing with searching for the three individual legs one by one.
Is this deliberate? Or is it just a glitch and I can expect to book the flights if I call?
I'm comparing with searching for the three individual legs one by one.
Is this deliberate? Or is it just a glitch and I can expect to book the flights if I call?
Since you are 1K you have the luxury to piece an itinerary via segment search and then call to book without paying the fee. Us peons would have to pay if we want a more reasonable itinerary that can only show up via segment search.
I too, wonder if this is a scheme to make people not book stopovers or make them book over the phone thus pay the fee?
Jun 22, 2012, 8:51 pm
#137
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: San Francisco/Sydney
Programs: UA 1K/MM, Hilton Diamond, Marriott Something, IHG Gold, Hertz PC, Avis PC
Posts: 8,159
Yup. Put it down to website brokenness and book over the phone - That's what I did recently for a US->Australia->Asia->US trip which had the same problems. Use one-way searches on the website to find what's available, and then call and book it.
Jun 23, 2012, 8:36 am
#138
Join Date: Feb 1999
Location: Denver CO
Posts: 3,682
I called UA, noted the problem, and asked to speak to someone who could show me how to do it online, as I didn't want to pay the phone fee. The CSR said she would book it for me and waive the fee, which she did.
It may be that's a lot easier to do than it is to find someone who can make that search engine work properly.
Jun 24, 2012, 1:45 pm
#139
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: World
Programs: Alaska, AA, UA, DL, SPG, AMEX
Posts: 278
Need help with United Award booking Open Jaw & Stopover query
HI;
I am looking for below routing using UA miles for award travel:
SFO-BOM(Desitination)-SIN(Stopover)-IAH(Open Jaw)-AUS-SFO
My question is if this routing is allowed? To me it seems One Open Jaw and One stopover which should be allowed.. I am not able to price it on UA website when I add the last segment of AUS-SFO. Is my assumption wrong?
I am looking for below routing using UA miles for award travel:
SFO-BOM(Desitination)-SIN(Stopover)-IAH(Open Jaw)-AUS-SFO
My question is if this routing is allowed? To me it seems One Open Jaw and One stopover which should be allowed.. I am not able to price it on UA website when I add the last segment of AUS-SFO. Is my assumption wrong?
Jun 24, 2012, 1:47 pm
#140
Join Date: Apr 2005
Programs: DL-PM, HHonors-Silver, Marriott-Gold
Posts: 185
Yes...need to do multiple cities search.
Jun 24, 2012, 1:59 pm
#141
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: World
Programs: Alaska, AA, UA, DL, SPG, AMEX
Posts: 278
I want to avoid paying phone fees. What's the alternative way of booking it?
Jun 24, 2012, 2:02 pm
#142
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: On the road in North America....
Programs: UA 1MM, *G, Global Entry
Posts: 579
That's not an open jaw itinerary. Returning to IAH is the open jaw completion. You need a separate award for IAH-SFO.
joe
joe
Jun 24, 2012, 2:04 pm
#143
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: On the road in North America....
Programs: UA 1MM, *G, Global Entry
Posts: 579
Alternatively you could do BOM-SIN as a separate ticket, then IAH as your stopover on the return. Maybe. Not sure exactly what the stopover rules are, and if IAH would qualify on a SIN-SFO return.
joe
joe
Jun 24, 2012, 2:05 pm
#144
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: World
Programs: Alaska, AA, UA, DL, SPG, AMEX
Posts: 278
Jun 24, 2012, 2:09 pm
#145
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: On the road in North America....
Programs: UA 1MM, *G, Global Entry
Posts: 579
Open jaw is when the return is from a different city, or when you return to a different city. You're trying to do two stopovers.
joe
joe
Jun 24, 2012, 2:19 pm
#146
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: World
Programs: Alaska, AA, UA, DL, SPG, AMEX
Posts: 278
A: SFO-BOM(Desitination)-SIN(Stopover)-IAH(Open Jaw)
B: AUS-SFO
Jun 24, 2012, 2:25 pm
#147
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: On the road in North America....
Programs: UA 1MM, *G, Global Entry
Posts: 579
B is a completely new one way ticket
joe
Let me try this - On a RT award, you can only have three flight segments (each segment one or more flights with no stop more than 24 hrs). In your (A) above, those three segments are SFO-BOM, BOM-SIN, and SIN-IAH.
joe
Last edited by iluv2fly; Jun 24, 2012 at 3:08 pm Reason: merge
Jun 24, 2012, 2:41 pm
#148
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: World
Programs: Alaska, AA, UA, DL, SPG, AMEX
Posts: 278
Thanks for the nice explanation. I thought you could have a flight with 1 open jaw and a stopover or two open jaws (excluding your destination). Isn't this true ? Or am I missing something?
Jun 24, 2012, 2:49 pm
#149
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: On the road in North America....
Programs: UA 1MM, *G, Global Entry
Posts: 579
Open jaws are ALWAYS at destination or origin/return. And you can actually have 2 open jaws and a stopover.
For instance, this is valid:
SFO-SIN (open jaw) BOM-HKG (stopover) HKG-LAX (open jaw)
This might be valid:
SFO-BOM (open jaw) SIN-IAH (stop over) IAH-SFO
But I'm not sure since the final leg on the return is reversing direction. And you still need to buy the BOM-SIN leg some other way.
Your original itinerary had four distinct legs:
SFO-BOM, BOM-SIN, SIN-IAH, IAH-SFO
There's no way to do that with a RT award. One of those legs requires an additional ticket.
joe
For instance, this is valid:
SFO-SIN (open jaw) BOM-HKG (stopover) HKG-LAX (open jaw)
This might be valid:
SFO-BOM (open jaw) SIN-IAH (stop over) IAH-SFO
But I'm not sure since the final leg on the return is reversing direction. And you still need to buy the BOM-SIN leg some other way.
Your original itinerary had four distinct legs:
SFO-BOM, BOM-SIN, SIN-IAH, IAH-SFO
There's no way to do that with a RT award. One of those legs requires an additional ticket.
joe
Jun 24, 2012, 2:50 pm
#150
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 368
I think your question boils down to this: Does an enroute land segment count as an open jaw? Or does one of the airports have to be your origin or destination?
All the rules say is "Two open jaws are permitted per roundtrip award. For example, you can fly from Newark to London and return from Paris to Washington Dulles."
I get that it can be done as two tickets; nobody is arguing that. But this does not imply that it cannot be done as one ticket.
All the rules say is "Two open jaws are permitted per roundtrip award. For example, you can fly from Newark to London and return from Paris to Washington Dulles."
I get that it can be done as two tickets; nobody is arguing that. But this does not imply that it cannot be done as one ticket.