rockflyertalk

May I ask what you are seeking to achieve for your rallying to open up, bar the obvious answer, I admire your persistence but I wonder after such a considerable amount of time that we’ve all endured that we now need to hurry things up now?

We have a long road ahead to recover, we can hurry but it’s still a long road.

I’m intrigued.

flashware

Feels a bit early for Israel to open up given their current case numbers but there you go. https://amp.ft.com/content/4cf1b235-...4-95846a0ecf36

High vaccination rate but still lots of cases. Lockdown for us with medium vaccination rate... Much lower numbers. I'd rather let the data and science dictate when it makes sense to reopen, as much as I'd like to just push on with opening up. Patience is key, we've waited this long what's a few more weeks etc.

DaveS

I would guess economics is a large factor in Israel's decision. There is only so much governments can do to hide from the debt. I think pressure will mount here at Easter. If hospitalisations and deaths continue on their downward trend and the weather really turns plus the vaccination program continues ahead of schedule, there will be pressure to move to the end faster.

flashware

In a way I agree, but it won't be speeding up the first step. I think of all the steps in the road map...... schools reopening was the biggest risk, so if that proves to go well (assessed 4-5 weeks after) then it sets the trajectory for possibly some flex in the road map past that point.

IAN-UK

It's a broken record that assumes saving the lives of individuals is the single role the vaccine plays in all this.

Important from the public health perspective is the expectation that removal of vectors of transmission will slow down infection rates: it's not entirely clear, but it seems those vaccinated are less likely to infect others, less likely to become vectors of transmission.

the HMG defence will be... is indeed a bizarre and combative way of looking at things. The government has no requirement to defend an eminently sensible plan of "no earlier than" dates, structured to evaluate he effects of each stage of the release from lockdown.

Conversely, governmemt would find itself on a back foot if those milestones were dragged forward, against advice, and infections surged.

corporate-wage-slave

I've dug into the stats a bit more. Hammersmith, as of 7 March, had only 75.7% of over 60s vaccinated. Not the worst in London, but one of the worse. Tower Hamlets 66.3%, Westminster is lower on 61% but there are very local factors in terms of part time residency, maybe a bit of that in Canary Wharf too. Compared to the posher bits of Middle England: Surrey Heath 94.4%, Cannock Chase 94.6%, Ipswich 94.9%. So yes in Hammersmith it is probably a case of grab anyone they can. Disappointing, very disappointing to see these health inequalities perpetuate unnecessarily, and more needs to be done here. Leicester City, probably the worst affected city in the UK pandemic wide, with probably even more of the hesistancy factors that apply in Hammersmith, has managed to get to 87.1%, and at long last their numbers are tumbling.Leicester had a 7 day figure of 600 at one point, and is now about 115. Leeds is on 93.1%. So it can be done.

ahmetdouas

Well Texas is 100% open without masks, even California which is the strictest state in the USA has indoor dining open at 25%, so yes the UK's rules look incredibly strict in comparison despite having low infection rates and quite a few vaccines.

Cases are crazy low. 6000 out of 1600000? That's less than 0.4% positivity! Even the ONS survey says London 0.3% positivity!

Be very careful with the word science, lockdowns were never an exact science and it sounds like you are trying to go for Zero Covid which is not realistic.

paulaf

I read yesterday that we have one of the strictest lockdowns in the world, but what are we 3rd on the list of vaccines done per population. Doesn't make sense to me.

flashware

I don't think you know me, who are you to tell me I'm going for zero COVID-19? That couldn't be further from the truth.

Per my post, I'm saying that while the results by the time we hit the 2nd step of the roadmap will be crucial, it may or may not result in the timeline being compressed. If it goes well, it might result in that, but people shouldn't rely on that with false hope.

Internaut

Bearing in mind I work with a bunch of fifty something nerds who live mostly around Trafford, Stockport, and further into Cheshire, it all happened pretty much at once, over a couple of weeks. We have one scratching his head and wondering “Why not me yet?” But that’s fine. If he doesn’t get a letter or text from his GP, we can expect the 50-55s to be given their national invite in the next week or so. For anyone waiting with utmost impatience (as I did), this dual approach is working reasonably well.

GregWTravels

Yes, it is a big problem. I've seen the local MP (Andy Slaughter) mention it in his newsletter and in the House of Commons, and there was an article in the local newspaper. There is some blame being put by the MP (Labour) on supply, but Hammersmith and Fulham have some deprived areas, and some of the areas lagging (Lillie Road and Greyhound Road) would indicate there is a problem with certain socio-economic / racial groups that needs to be tackled. Hopefully we can figure out how to reach all communities and get jabs in arms.

Silver Fox

I forget the chap's name, but I think he may have mentioned that his dad was a bus driver, has he done anything?

Swanhunter

The Hammersmith/Tower Hamlets stats are one of the main reasons why we aren’t opening up faster. There is still a significant risk of a large local outbreak when the bulk of the population at large isn’t immune, and also suffer worse clinical outcomes when infected. It’s cautious, but there is logic and reason to it.

HB7

I hope you are not talking about Sadiq Khan.

rockflyertalk

I digress but Austin Texas is still requiring masks and no doubt some if not many people are choosing to wear masks. Texas Rangers are requiring masks to worn at their first game with a full crowd. It maybe open but the numbers are still poor and I doubt it will improve, we will find out in 2-4 weeks if the plan works.