KoKoBuddy

You know you can't drink there right?

enviroian

Then obviously not a destination for me either

zitsky

Trip is canceled! How can I country with a town called SHIRAZ not drink wine?

ThePointsCollector

Link please.

ThePointsCollector

Wrong. We were talking about illegal immigration numbers, not who's most likely to overstay. From what I have seen Chile has some real problems will illegal immigration from countries like Bolivia. Chileans might not have the same numbers as US adn Mexican illegals, but they also don't have 340 million people.
Those who determine to stay will get to US regardless of visa or not. You wanna tell me there are less illegals from former Easter Block countries like Latvia or Slovenia than Argentines in the US? They don't need visas to come over. Ever been to Chicago?
They charge exactly what US embassy charges their citizens. If it was $2, they would charge $2 as well. But they charge $150. Would you like to guess why?

gglave

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illegal...#Visa_overstay

ThePointsCollector

Nice - accounting for between 33�50% !

I wonder if you would take this kind of deviation from your tax accountant?

PS: So besides jumping the border and overstaying visa what other sources of illegal immigration you aware of?

rankourabu

wow.. now thats pretty ignorant. Please provide any proof/example of anyone being kidnapped in Iran period - never mind by al Qaida.

The only case of anyone detained I know of is the shady ex-FBI agent, and the stupid "hikers". Compare that with the amount of foreigners that the USA has detained (illegaly). I'd be more worried about disappearing into govt custody in the USA.

Iran is a fascinating country, with incredible history, and surreal hospitality of its people. Yes, it was presided over by a nut-job recently, but so was the USA


I am not touching the Israeli comment because saying anything slightly negative about Israel in this forum gets one tarred and feathered immediately.

rankourabu

North Korea is an 'interesting' place to visit. There is no denying that it is a cruel dictatorship and that it is a brainwashed society. It is however, a unique experience, that leaves one speechless.
Every day one just comes back from the state-mandated tour to your hotel that you cant leave with more questions than answers. However, the chances of actually something happening to you during your visit are ZERO. It is probably, ironically, the SAFEST place on earth a tourist can go. There is zero chance of being pickpocketed, zero chance of being mugged, zero chance of being scammed.

I can understand the ethical questions about visiting there. But IMO, there can be ethical questions raised about many places I have visited. Russia, USA, China, Israel, Iran, Qatar, Zimbabwe, Belarus, Myanmar, Brunei, and many others I've been to, all could raise "ethical" concerns for a visitor.

However, if you have not been to a place, and you go by what the media feeds you, IMO, you have no right to judge it.

I hear the king of Swaziland is not a nice guy either, but I havent been to his country, so I do not have the right to comment/judge Swaziland.

marcoolfr

I've been to several countries where laws and tradition are questionnable from a westerner point of view. I often have enough time to speak about this subject with my hosts and it is interesting to see how things can vary greatly. Some will fully support their government and wish that nothing would ever change despite having spent time in western countries... and some just can't stand living in their home countries but cannot escape. And there the wobbly belly middle ground made of people who have no idea how extreme their country can be.

Latest example, I've had some customers from Pakistan visiting me and we talked about the condition of women in their country. They didn't see any problem with stoning women which had been raped.

I have 2 countries on my black list: Pakistan and Afghanistan.

zitsky

If you want examples of people kidnapped in Iran, how about Robert Levinson and this old story. Sure Levinson was ex-FBI so maybe there was something funny going on or somebody thought he might have useful information. I don't know.

Look, you're talking to someone who *likes* Iran and it's people. But I'm not an idiot despite what you think and I recognize that bad things happen. I have a Mexican friend who can tell you a story of getting kidnapped in Mexico City. These things sometimes happen in other countries. Is it wrong to want to protect yourself in another country?

The few Iranians I have met in my life have been friendly and I have great respect for the Iranian engineers I've worked with.

Finally, just like with the US you can like a country's people but not it's leadership.

rankourabu

When did I even bring up Mexico?

Bad things like getting mugged or getting robbed, can happen to you anywhere. Thats crime, thats not what we are talking about in this thread

If I was afraid of bad things happening to me, I would've stayed home instead of spending most of the last 12 years - my best years - my 20s - traveling around the world for fun.

zitsky

When did I say I was afraid to travel? Using common sense is not being afraid. I get around just fine, thanks. You didn't even acknowledge those kidnapping stories you asked for.

I know this thread is about laws, but seems that common sense topics are also relevant.

rankourabu

I already mentioned Levinson. Thats not a kidnapping story - and certainly not by Al Qaida like you implied. Thats someone conducting questionable 'business' being detained, a story that we have no clue what its really about.

The other story is about drug smugglers - again, how is that Al Qaida?
You can get kidnapped for ransom anywhere in the world.

This is a good read: http://www.nyainternational.com/down...-June-2013.pdf

And as for common sense, and this is in no way aimed at you, it absolutely amazes me how people say they are afraid to travel to Dubai or Iran or Malaysia or whatever, but will have no problem going to for example, Barcelona or Rome, or even Miami - statistically far more 'dangerous' places.

UA Fan

Wow, that is just so incredibly sad.