I've had a Tungsten C for years and love it. When I lost my first one, I bought a second. The prices have come down quite a bit. I haven't used it for VOIP mostly because there isn't a dominant application developed for it to handle that. I assume one will come out once a Treo with native WIFI support is released. It is adequate for surfing the web or IM and does a great job with email.

About the Treo 650... It does not officially support WIFI. However, a developer named Shadowmite on treocentral hacked it, and it now works. The thread is extremely long, so you may want to jump to the end. I found reading the entire thing interesting. It was a bit like a techno thriller novel.

The Treo 650 is now available for GSM in the US, either locked on Cingular or unlocked.

What are the drawbacks of buying it unlocked?

Besdies the price? no real drawback, except possibly for a lack of support from the operator in times of problems with the device...

The other advantage is that you will not have to re-up your contract.

Thanks. I just bought it locked.

Somehow I got concerned that I'd have to constantly switch manually back to Cingular when I moved into a cell where the stronger signal is another GSM carrier.

ANd yes, it was a littel easier on the wallet (by $50).

Such a shame that the 650 is already yesterday's doo-doo, thanks to HP.

That HP is gonna kick some Treo ash.

I see it being competitive for someone who wants MS software vs. Palm, but I don't see any huge breakthroughs.

It's 20% bigger

2 SD slots - I don't come close to filling my 1GB card so I don't know what I'd do with 2

1.3MP camera - seriously, do you take a lot of pictures with your camera? I've used mine maybe 5 times - you can get 4MP cameras the size of this device.

Bluetooth, USB docking station, etc - nothing new here

Integrated GPS - that could be cool, depending on what it does. It it a full-function GPS solution, with mapping, etc. a la Garmin? Or the "cell phone GPS" that doesn't really do much?

I see it as a Windows-platform equal of the 650. With a reported release date of "sometime in the second half of the year" it's about the leapfrogging that I would expect 7+ months after the 650 release.

Given the lack of significant 600 to 650 improvments, I would hope the next Treo is well under way and will jump back over the HP in terms of capabilities (WiFi, GPS, etc.) in maybe late '05 or early '06. Unless the falling trajectory of 300-600-650 development continues, which would be bad news for them.

I think that now that the form factor, borne out by treo and RIM, is where it needs to be, the pocketpc os, for things like seemless exchange integration, calendering, etc. and GPS programs usage, is going to make this really a killer product.

I have really wanted to be able to have my gps programs, on my blackberry or treo, but it just wasn't possible. Now, with a bluetooth gps receiver, and a good gps program like copilot, I could have ONE device for mapping when in a differant city, and of course all my email, calendering, contacts, etc.

I want one NOW!

You may not, but I certainly do.

When you are that small 20% is pretty minor. Plus, the lack of that ugly antenna makes up for a lot, and it is thinner.


You probably are a palm user, Palms SUCK at multimedia, but I for one enjoy taking a Divx movie with me, or 1Gb of MP3 files. I know a Treo can do this, eventully, and with some additional software, but it is not a nice experience.



Except that the Bluetooth on PocketPC's is not crippled like in the Treo and that the USB docking station is foldable and portable, unlike that large POS the Treo has (as an optional extra I might add).


Initial reviews say that it is a real GPS receiver. Cellphone GPS (LBS) is only really available on iDen anyway.


Except of course that the PocketPC platform is around 3 years ahead of the Palm platform, and has been for several years now.

Given the current state of affairs at PalmOne I wouldn't be so sure about that. Just last night PalmOne screwed its customers by raising the price of the unlocked Treo650 by $100 infuriating customers and getting some serious bad PR. As for the trajectory of the 300-600-650; there is very very little improvement between these devices, the Treo650 is certainly not what it should have been and it shows PalmOnes lack of innovation quite clearly. They were innovative when the 180/300 was introduced, but lately they have failed to impress.

And don't forget that HP is bringing the GOOD client to the masses. RIM has been painfully slow to get Blackberry Connect to the market, so best of luck to GOOD.

The HP is very much a "real" GPS, and comes bundled with TomTom navigator software.

FWIW, I use the 1,3MP camera on my Siemens phone every day (just today to capture a photo of several phone numbers on a For Sale sign in a building window). Even though compared to dedicated cameras the quality sucks, it is quite good enough to capture moments that otherwise wouldn't be. I would not want another phone without a good camera.

that would rock, the tomtom is pretty nice, so that is worth another 125$ or so. Having the gps, and being able to bt another receiver is great.

I could do without the camera, if it saved me some weight.

damb, I want it NOW!!

I don't even want to think about what this thing is going to cost. If it were in MDA territory, it would be a no-brainer.

$1199, anyone?

I've been waiting around for the 650 GSM to come available. This new HP unit looks promising, but it probably won't be out for quite a while. I'll definately be waiting to see what it really is all about when it's released, and if it will make sense for me.

I'm going to buy a Cingular 650 next week just to fill the gap for a little while. There are really only two applications on PPC that I would probably REALLY use - Skype and Windows Terminal Server Client. Otherwise, Palm has worked great for me for the past 10 years.

As far as Palm raising the price on the unlocked 650, I agree that sucks. However, I've always just had my subsidised phones unlocked anyway. People are also complaining about the 'crippled' Bluetooth, but this has already been enabled by a hack.

On the other hand, I've got a postcard from Sprint PCS today for a 650 @ $329. I just can't bring myself to go CDMA because of my international travels.