How low SPG can go? [Issues with stay at Mystique, Greece]
Jun 1, 2014, 11:18 pm
#196
Suspended
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Watchlisted by the prejudiced, en route to purgatory
Programs: Just Say No to Fleecing and Blacklisting
Posts: 102,095
No. I'm suggesting it's no more likely a driver for the OP's incident than Golden Dawn types in Greece.
India is a very diverse country, including religiously. And at least three of its four largest religions have philosophical underpinnings that are doctrunally against casteism. You can't fairly judge or entertain judging a person based on a name, religion or parental national or religious origin; unfairly, it surely can be done -- as evidenced in this thread.
India is a very diverse country, including religiously. And at least three of its four largest religions have philosophical underpinnings that are doctrunally against casteism. You can't fairly judge or entertain judging a person based on a name, religion or parental national or religious origin; unfairly, it surely can be done -- as evidenced in this thread.
Jun 1, 2014, 11:27 pm
#197
Suspended
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Watchlisted by the prejudiced, en route to purgatory
Programs: Just Say No to Fleecing and Blacklisting
Posts: 102,095
I see and read all the comments. If same situations had happened to me while staying at Westin Times Square or Princeville and I had written a bad review on TA while still staying there, would this happen?
Some have made comments about some arguments between us and hotel. No such things occurred.
Some have made comments about not taking the replacement room. Room was way smaller and view was not good compared to what we already had.
Some have made comments about not giving the hotel a chance to show us 3 rooms next day. That never happened. Supervisor was supposed to call us instead she came to tell us that owner wants to meet us (around 11:00 am or so). We were never shown any rooms.
Clean shower is important to me. May not be big deal for some.
Wi-fi did not work for about 3 hrs till after technician came. What takes the room to be ready? Are these not quality checks? How do you become one of the best if room has these flaws?
Being world traveler for 17 years, stayed at Princeville, Waldorf (Hilton), Bora Bora, Westin Times Square, Phoenician to name a few and they do everything in style and never had an iota worth of issue. How come? Gotten upgrades without even asking as GOLD.
Only mistake on my part has been that I criticized someone's child while in their house (bad review on TA).
TA is primarily designed to get all kind of reviews (good or bad) as long as they are honest so others can benefit (making a choice for themselves based on review).
Owner of Mystique could not take one bad review and we happened to be billy goat.
I am not looking for any sympathy. I am sharing my experiences and SPG is known about it the moment this happened.
I hope this will clear few clogs and confusion.
Some have made comments about some arguments between us and hotel. No such things occurred.
Some have made comments about not taking the replacement room. Room was way smaller and view was not good compared to what we already had.
Some have made comments about not giving the hotel a chance to show us 3 rooms next day. That never happened. Supervisor was supposed to call us instead she came to tell us that owner wants to meet us (around 11:00 am or so). We were never shown any rooms.
Clean shower is important to me. May not be big deal for some.
Wi-fi did not work for about 3 hrs till after technician came. What takes the room to be ready? Are these not quality checks? How do you become one of the best if room has these flaws?
Being world traveler for 17 years, stayed at Princeville, Waldorf (Hilton), Bora Bora, Westin Times Square, Phoenician to name a few and they do everything in style and never had an iota worth of issue. How come? Gotten upgrades without even asking as GOLD.
Only mistake on my part has been that I criticized someone's child while in their house (bad review on TA).
TA is primarily designed to get all kind of reviews (good or bad) as long as they are honest so others can benefit (making a choice for themselves based on review).
Owner of Mystique could not take one bad review and we happened to be billy goat.
I am not looking for any sympathy. I am sharing my experiences and SPG is known about it the moment this happened.
I hope this will clear few clogs and confusion.
Jun 1, 2014, 11:39 pm
#198
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: New York, NY USA
Programs: AA 8MM Exec,Life Plat, Marriott Amb,Life Titanium, ,Hilton Diamond, Hyatt Globalist.
Posts: 495
Back to the original posting......
I get both sides of this. The OP had incredible expectations at this all suite category 7 property. He saved his points.....planned for the fabulous anniversary....And got there and realized....His shower didn't drain...nor did the sink.....and he had poor wifi? He addressed it, and they couldn't fix it...or could fix it but not in his time frame. They sent a cake....it was too late.. They offered another room however this was seen as a downgrade? Less of a view? This is my summation.
While I respect this OP's post and I think the property handled this poorly, I a not surprised they told him to get out. Different countries have different ways and this person left quite a nasty review for things I consider small....But alas....to each their own. The owner was PO'd and rightfully so. Ín the days of social media....that review will do him NO good.....and for relatively little....
In the world of hotel snafu's I have been Walked from hotels.....I have had my rooms forceably packed up and checked out, including safe items as they emptied the wrong room.....I have had drunks at my door and people fornicating in the hallways, Rats running down the hallways, People knocking at my door drunk at 4AM....Fire alarms, fires, lobby shootings and a variety of other oddities. In the scope of my world, Water not draining and poor internet doth not mean I am writing a Tripadvisor review entitled Pure Garbage.....
1) The water after a shower is YOUR dirty water....How dirty can that be? Most westerners shower twice per day...
2) The water in the sink didn't drain either? So it was up to the very top and you could not wash your hands? I don't get this? Did it just drain slowly?
3) Were they able to fix the internet? Ooooh thats right you got kicked out before you found out.
It seems to me this OP flew off the handle about some small island details. Greece is a country in great transition and the islands are indeed ISLANDS....They move slower and little things tend to get fixed in good time, but again, slowly.
Having been and Stayed in Oia many times, I can tell you that these properties are built into the mountain....Often reclaiming OLD properties....with old plumbing, many bends and curves etc..depending on rock...This is the Island of Santorini. We stayed at a non starwood hotel (egads!) in Oia, it had a pool on our terrace and our room was built into the mountain and the sunsets were spectacular as was the service and food....I think it cost around $1700 per night...it was far from perfect, but alas, neither are we. Our shower didn't drain great....their were numerous cracks in our walls and animal feces on our walk up the mountain, We had unruly kids at the hotel AND we had a mouse/rat in our room one night who was shoed away by a maid with a broom who told him that he/she had to go... and told us he would not return.... The hotel was CHARMING....We LOVED our stay..Many stories to tell...Things Happen when you travel....This is travel. A simple letter to SPG or phone call and the OP probably would have received the compensation he sought..or a fix.
So instead of letting things go and having some patience.....Enjoying a fabulous view at one of the most beautiful places in the world....time with his wife....He apparently lost it.....and brought about a turn in events which led to this. We will never know what really happened here. Sad.
Wise words from my grandmother: Take three deep breaths......Wait 15 minutes.....Think about what is important to you? Then Choose Your Battles.
Safe travels to all!
While I respect this OP's post and I think the property handled this poorly, I a not surprised they told him to get out. Different countries have different ways and this person left quite a nasty review for things I consider small....But alas....to each their own. The owner was PO'd and rightfully so. Ín the days of social media....that review will do him NO good.....and for relatively little....
In the world of hotel snafu's I have been Walked from hotels.....I have had my rooms forceably packed up and checked out, including safe items as they emptied the wrong room.....I have had drunks at my door and people fornicating in the hallways, Rats running down the hallways, People knocking at my door drunk at 4AM....Fire alarms, fires, lobby shootings and a variety of other oddities. In the scope of my world, Water not draining and poor internet doth not mean I am writing a Tripadvisor review entitled Pure Garbage.....
1) The water after a shower is YOUR dirty water....How dirty can that be? Most westerners shower twice per day...
2) The water in the sink didn't drain either? So it was up to the very top and you could not wash your hands? I don't get this? Did it just drain slowly?
3) Were they able to fix the internet? Ooooh thats right you got kicked out before you found out.
It seems to me this OP flew off the handle about some small island details. Greece is a country in great transition and the islands are indeed ISLANDS....They move slower and little things tend to get fixed in good time, but again, slowly.
Having been and Stayed in Oia many times, I can tell you that these properties are built into the mountain....Often reclaiming OLD properties....with old plumbing, many bends and curves etc..depending on rock...This is the Island of Santorini. We stayed at a non starwood hotel (egads!) in Oia, it had a pool on our terrace and our room was built into the mountain and the sunsets were spectacular as was the service and food....I think it cost around $1700 per night...it was far from perfect, but alas, neither are we. Our shower didn't drain great....their were numerous cracks in our walls and animal feces on our walk up the mountain, We had unruly kids at the hotel AND we had a mouse/rat in our room one night who was shoed away by a maid with a broom who told him that he/she had to go... and told us he would not return.... The hotel was CHARMING....We LOVED our stay..Many stories to tell...Things Happen when you travel....This is travel. A simple letter to SPG or phone call and the OP probably would have received the compensation he sought..or a fix.
So instead of letting things go and having some patience.....Enjoying a fabulous view at one of the most beautiful places in the world....time with his wife....He apparently lost it.....and brought about a turn in events which led to this. We will never know what really happened here. Sad.
Wise words from my grandmother: Take three deep breaths......Wait 15 minutes.....Think about what is important to you? Then Choose Your Battles.
Safe travels to all!
Jun 2, 2014, 12:00 am
#199
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: BOS/UTH
Programs: AA LT PLT; QR GLD; Bonvoy LT TIT
Posts: 12,764
There's one way to find out the other side of the story, -- I have sent an email addressed to the GM or owner of the property explaining a little about the debate going on here, providing a link to this thread and inviting him/her to post a reply. Hopefully there will be one in the not too distant future.
Jun 2, 2014, 12:20 am
#200
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: New Orleans, AA EXP, DL PM, SPG PLT, HH Diamond
Posts: 3,750
Unless I learn something different from the OPs info, I would never consider staying at this property...
There's one way to find out the other side of the story, -- I have sent an email addressed to the GM or owner of the property explaining a little about the debate going on here, providing a link to this thread and inviting him/her to post a reply. Hopefully there will be one in the not too distant future.
Jun 2, 2014, 12:24 am
#201
Suspended
Join Date: Nov 1999
Posts: 24,153
Discussing the FTer's ethnicity (based on a name) to try to explain a situation and assign blame to (or otherwise disparage) the FTer on the basis of an ethnic name/ethnicity seems like a form of racism, no better than caste-ism. Hitherto, no one brought up that perhaps the OP got assigned a bad room because of possible racism on the part of the hotel employees/owner. Did you consider that too? I didn't even consider that possibility until this hour -- and I'd rule it out absent material indication of that sort -- for a variety of reasons including because it seemed like the hotel was making an equitable attempt at a service recovery after being flagged down by the guest for having assigned sub-par accommodations from the start. Why try to paint a picture of blame upon the OP based on ethnicity/national origin? As someone with plenty of Indian and other Asian relatives -- none of whom believe in any Orientalist-characterized caste system and most of whom live in the US or other OECD countries -- I consider the above attribution of behavior to be one based upon ethnic/national origin to be troubling.
Jun 2, 2014, 12:30 am
#202
Suspended
Join Date: Nov 1999
Posts: 24,153
Oh so you know the OP personally? I know many people who live in the US and have for yrs and work here legally for many yrs. The 1 thing they arent are American, yet they travel to and from. So can you be so kind and explain how in fact you know the OP is American and not a legal resident of the US without citizenship
and if you read my posts in this thread you should know, that I ddint put all the balme on the OP, alot belongs to *W who lists this hotels as well as others as LCs meaning they are luxurious when in fact they arent but they are very unquie places for various reasons and Ive said numerous times in the thread it would be best for *W to label these as eg *W Cöllection Hotels instead of LC. I dont blame the OP for being very
when they got there and realized this isnt a LUXURY hotel. I do blame them for how they handled it and for what seems to be not telling us or TA everything that took place, just as he left out how the hotel tried to resolve the problems but it wasnt to his satisfaction, Im sure he left out aöot of what did happen on FT
and if you read my posts in this thread you should know, that I ddint put all the balme on the OP, alot belongs to *W who lists this hotels as well as others as LCs meaning they are luxurious when in fact they arent but they are very unquie places for various reasons and Ive said numerous times in the thread it would be best for *W to label these as eg *W Cöllection Hotels instead of LC. I dont blame the OP for being very
when they got there and realized this isnt a LUXURY hotel. I do blame them for how they handled it and for what seems to be not telling us or TA everything that took place, just as he left out how the hotel tried to resolve the problems but it wasnt to his satisfaction, Im sure he left out aöot of what did happen on FT
Last edited by craz; Jun 2, 2014 at 12:39 am
Jun 2, 2014, 12:34 am
#203
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Smellington, NZ
Programs: AA EXP 2MM, UA 2P, Marriott LTPP
Posts: 1,453
I completely sympathize with the OP, though agree his tactics and means of expression might have benefited from some re-imagining.
No doubt the OP had saved tons of points (SPG and UA, too) and planned this well in advance - and for a very special occasion. When so highly invested in something that is so expensive, expectations are naturally inflated, too. Standing water in an airport Four Points is something I would shrug off, but it would be a little irritating to have paid the price that the Mystique commands and face that there. Still, calmer heads all around should have prevailed.
That said, I can think of nothing short of a criminal act or threat against the hotel property or staff that would warrant any hotel throwing anyone out on their ear.
No doubt the OP had saved tons of points (SPG and UA, too) and planned this well in advance - and for a very special occasion. When so highly invested in something that is so expensive, expectations are naturally inflated, too. Standing water in an airport Four Points is something I would shrug off, but it would be a little irritating to have paid the price that the Mystique commands and face that there. Still, calmer heads all around should have prevailed.
That said, I can think of nothing short of a criminal act or threat against the hotel property or staff that would warrant any hotel throwing anyone out on their ear.
Jun 2, 2014, 12:50 am
#205
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: body: A stone's throw from SFO, mind: SE Asia
Programs: Some of this 'n some of that
Posts: 17,263
Jun 2, 2014, 1:07 am
#206
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: New Orleans, AA EXP, DL PM, SPG PLT, HH Diamond
Posts: 3,750
Jun 2, 2014, 2:43 am
#207
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: CEB - primary/YVR -secondary
Programs: AC*Super Elite (100K) / PR*Elite / AY*Platinum (OWE) / SPG*Bonvoy Titanium (LTT)
Posts: 2,272
Some customers are actually better off to the company (not being their customers). Celebrities get banned at hotels, people get banned on airlines, restaurants, etc. Customers are not always right.
The vast majority of reviews on t.a. are excellent ( 214 out of 277), i doubt it that the owner was willing to sacrifice his reputation for 1 (out of 7) poor review..The vast majority of travellers who read t.a. know that not every guest can be pleased. There is more to this than what the o.p. is willing to tell.
Jun 2, 2014, 4:07 am
#208
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: India
Programs: Bonvoy Lifetime Titanium, IHG Plat, HH Gold, Trident Plat, DL Diamond, AI Maharajah
Posts: 29,687
I could imagine if the OP and or his wife comes from a middle to high caste level back in India that in fact that may have resulted in how they spoke to the underlings (low class) employees when they didnt get what they wanted when they wanted it. Been around too many of those arguments in my life. It might have worked back in India but not outside of it
Jun 2, 2014, 5:26 am
#209
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: PMI
Programs: BA,LH,CX,EK SPG,IC mainly and a few others
Posts: 1,862
I read through the first 10 pages or so- IMO, when I stay in a Starwood property I expect certain standards and I expect the property to get it right. If not, I expect *W to resolve it if the property proves difficult.
I can think of two instances in my 12+ years with Starwood where I had to escalate a problem to Starwood when property failed to resolve it (both resorts BTW)- in both cases SPG rep contacted the property immediately and the issues were resolved immediately to my satisfaction.
Maybe OP should have given the property a bit more time to resolve his problem before shooting off his TA review- that said, I will be very concerned if a property start throwing out guests, unless they have become a complete nuisance or engage in illegal activities.
I can think of two instances in my 12+ years with Starwood where I had to escalate a problem to Starwood when property failed to resolve it (both resorts BTW)- in both cases SPG rep contacted the property immediately and the issues were resolved immediately to my satisfaction.
Maybe OP should have given the property a bit more time to resolve his problem before shooting off his TA review- that said, I will be very concerned if a property start throwing out guests, unless they have become a complete nuisance or engage in illegal activities.
Jun 2, 2014, 7:50 am
#210
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: BOS/UTH
Programs: AA LT PLT; QR GLD; Bonvoy LT TIT
Posts: 12,764
this has absolutely nothing to do with coming from a high caste level in india....i have seen the way people from other countries treat employees at hotels, mostly people from developed counties....i've been around too many of these situations in my life as well & its not pleasant....
The fact is that we don't even have the other side of the story yet, let alone any insight into why the OP reacted the way he did. Maybe the OP was completely in the right and the hotel grossly overreacted by booting him. We don't know. Maybe the OP was abusive to the staff. We don't know. Maybe the OP was raised in a family in which the caste system is important and he's accustomed to talking down to people he perceives as being at a lower societal level than he. We don't know. Because of the integral part that the caste system has played in India over a very long time, I suggest that it's a possibility. Anyone who says that it is simply not possible is talking through his/her hat, since, at this point, no one knows anything about the OP.