Sorry, you can't use yourself as the yardstick to measure other people. You can't say whether its due to poor attitudes or not, especially since the internet is rife from complaints about abuse from the TSA.

If it were just a few bad apples or people with attitudes that had a problem with the TSA, you wouldn't see the huge degree of dissatisfaction like you not only see here but everywhere else on the internet, from people of all backgrounds and professions.

Are there people who complain just to complain? Sure, there will always be. However, the degree of the dissatisfaction with the TSA means that there are really some serious problems with the TSA, and you can't just blame the victims (ie the flying public).

When I fly, most of the time I don't have a problem personally, but I do resent the nonsensical TSA policies such as the banning of my gel-filled insoles from being worn onto the plane, or the fact I have to take off my thin flip-flops to go through the WTMD. Add to these ridiculously dumb policies some of the power hungry TSA agents I have encountered, it's no wonder people resent the TSA.

The one thing I think that is great about America is when something is wrong, we Americans don't just put up with it - we let other people know why we think it's wrong.

Your point is taken, to a degree. However, you're missing the real debate, once again, completely, by a mile.

PS - I have not seen the thread complaining about the clip-on ties. If that was all it was about I would conjecture that it was done as a farce to relieve some tensions and frustrations about the TSA. I seriously doubt I would take it at face value. Unfortunately you will probably never get it, as a TSA apologist.

PPS - Just one final thought on this issue:

Standing up for passenger rights is never wrong. Standing up for one's rights and asking for professional treatment will never lead to a security lapse or a terrorist attack.

However, not standing up for one's rights or asking to be treated professionally can lead to disastrous consequences, such as bullying, theft of one's property, loss of essential items like medication, being falsely detained and worse.

I fail to understand those shills who claim, in spite of overwhelming and complete evidence all over the net and the media, that the TSA doesn't abuse and if a traveler "shuts up and puts up with the minor inconvenience" that there's no big deal.

Unfortunately it IS a big deal, and will continue to be a big deal, until TSA policies are changed to ensure consistency, professional and courteous treatment, accountability, and removal of bad apples when eregious passenger treatment occur.

You do realize that of all the people who fly, the percentage of them on this forum is probably close to .0000000000000000001
Right?

Also, and you can look this up if you want because it is a proven fact, people are quick to complain but slow to compliment.
You can easily find websites complaining about any business, group or agency but you rarely find one praising them or others.

Millions and millions of people LOVE Wal-Mart, but there are dozens of anti Wal-Mart website but no (or few) websites praising them.

To think or claim that the complaints you read about online are indicative of the majority opinion or the overall travel experiences of the masses would be incorrect.

People are quick to complain and slow to praise.

I agree that "consistency, professional and courteous treatment, accountability, and removal of bad apples" are legitimate issues that do need to be addressed, and inconsistency is a pet-peeve of mine.

That said, there are better ways to handle things than being confrontational with the TSO's or having a poor attitude which can lead to making a bad situation worse.

Just smile, get through without beeping and make mental notes of their name and ID# and start your letter while at the gate.

Have a pre-made form letter saved in your lappy and just fill in the blanks and send it out once you can print it.

I've had to delete the last half-dozen posts as they weren't about the topic.

Instead, they were argumentative, inflammatory comments about other posters in this thread.

As with any thread here, please stay on topic and bite your tongue instead of taking a personal swipe at a fellow poster.

Thanks for your cooperation.

_________________________

Cholula
Travel Safety/Security Forum Moderator

At risk of sounding pedantic, the percentage of the US flying public that are regular readers of this particular forum (TS/S) is more like 0.0001% (even looking at the entire world only gets you another zero or so). It is still a small number but not completely insignificant. And I suspect if you trim your population to those that fly more than a few round trips a year you can drop the percentage down to 0.01 % or so.

You do realize the number of zeros was for emphasis only, right?

And you didn't file a complaint for sexual harassment?

Subpoena all security tapes, all employees that were there, and file a complaint for sexual harassment! (I believe that would be sexual ASSAULT in criminal court). Not only is that brutalizing, that's sexual assault or something like that. It DEFINITELY fits under sexual harassment, it MAY fall under sexual assault.

Unfotunately this was before the tapes.

We tried to pursue complaint at the airport (Anchorage) only to be threatened with missing our flight. I was "written up" in an incident report for writing down names and badge numbers. They called it "interference with the seach". I was told that I "had no right ro write down any names or badge numbers".

We pursued every imaginable complaint venue afterwards. Our letters included the names of all employees involved. It went nowhere.

The airline (AK) backed the screeners and also threatened us with removal from the flight if "we are selected for gate check and do not cooperate".

So much for Bart's suggestions. He really needs to "walk in our shoes" for awhile.

We have since put his episode behind us, and I certainly do not enjoy recalling it except in response to drivel along the lines of "Do as you are told, and you'll be fine".

Go to court. Depo everyone. Call the media. Not just in Anchorage, but all over the WORLD. This is war. Like John Locke said, if the government tramples on your rights (they certainly trampled on your right to recourse after being sexually harassed) they're in a state of war with you. Make TSA's life miserable. Embarrass them so badly in the global media outlets that they'll have to hire a PR firm to mend their permanently damaged reputation. Then sue the person for sexual harassment.

I don't know about you, but sexual harassment should NEVER be acceptable for you. I'd depo and subpoena everyone related to the incident and start a paper war with them.

I don't recall ever seeing such a claim, in this or any other thread. Go with the majority opinion if you want, but you do know what denying the minority theirs is, don't you ?

Maybe not.

Freedom dies slowly. People who question certain rules are always the ones who get blamed.

From what I learned, especially with the background of German history, I have to say "beep" as much as you can. Questioning the actions of a government is the fundamental right of every citizen. It is the foundation of a democratic state. It's the government that has to justify its actions not the people.

I seem to remember metal detectors and security before 9-11.
Does everyone think that before 9-11 everyone just went from car to plane unimpeded?
No security, no metal detectors, nothing?
Seriously?

In most peoples minds the government has justified it's actions by the lack of another air attack...Until that changes there will be no wholesale changes to the TSA...

When people are getting rounded up and being put into labor camps or when others are sent to special security lines because of their race/religion then your argument is valid. I'm Jewish and I am completely and utterly offended by your comparisons. I know your going to say that it's about the attitude but let's face it you can complain to your airline or the TSA directly. The people in you used in your comparison had no voice..

I truly don't see the comparison, and, no, it's not because I work for TSA.

If there's anything that's a slow erosion of our freedoms, it's the laws that allow the police to stop us just to make sure we're wearing our seat belts. The way I see it, we have a God-given right to be stupid. And failure to wear a seat belt is certainly stupid. However, when a police officer stops a driver to make sure the driver is wearing a seat belt, a whole bunch of other things come into play. That officer then can justify, for self-protection, to conduct a search of the car and the driver. To me, this allows police officers an opportunity to "fish for evidence" they may not have originally thought was there. I see this as a slow erosion of our liberty and a gradual slide of government crossing the constitutional lines protecting us against unreasonable searches.

Nothing like this happens at a security checkpoint. Passengers voluntarily undergo the screening process. The screening process itself is designed to look for a specific list of prohibited items. The passenger is well aware of these prohibited items. Possession of these prohibited items result in either the passenger being given the opportunity to exit back into the public area to dispose of these items or the passenger abandoning these items at the checkpoint. No arrests, no detention. Only illegal items, that is to say, items that are specifically unlawful to possess either at any time (such as improvised explosive devices) or at a specific time (such as firearms in carry-on) carry the consequence of arrest and detention. And even so, the police officer must due process as defined by the courts in terms of rights warnings, arraignment, etc.

Nope, there's no erosion of freedom at the checkpoint. The people, that is the Voice of the People as represented in Congress, voted and agreed on establishing the TSA as the agency responsible for and conducting airport security.

If you're going to make any comparisons with Nazi Germany, get it right.