Yachty

Hi there,

I'm hoping to do my first Done4 from Ist. I studied this site, checked my routing on the oneworld timetable and validator and then faxed it off to the BA desk in Istanbul safe in the knowledge that my routing was sound…Or so I thought! I then received a reply, saying they have to 'deny' my route. Before I go back to the drawing board, would anyone mind casting their eye over it to let me know where I went wrong?

IST-BCN-LHR-JFK-SJU-ANU-BWI-LAS-LAX-AKL-SYD-PER-DRW-DPS-HKG-NRT-HKG-CMB-SIN-LHR-IST

The reasons for refusal given are as follows:

1: requested itinerary exceeds the 20 flight segment maximum
(I thought the departure airport didn't count as a segment?)

2: "none of our oneworld partners are operating from Tokyo to Colombo. This has to be purchased separately"
(I wanted a flight from tokyo to Hong Kong to Colombo, does this not exist? Maybe the problem here is that I put the flights NRT - HKG - CMB on the same date?)

Further notes were:

"Please remove at least 2 segments of your itinerary and refax."

"It is recommended to leave out Sydney-Denpasar as this segment is operated by Australia"
(I didn't want to fly from Sydney to Denpasar, I thought you could fly there from Darwin)

Any help would be much appreciated!

hauteboy

It looks like 20 segments to me.. XXX-YYY is a segment and you have 20 dashes.
NRT-HKG-CMB should be ok, but you'll have to check the schedule. HKG-CMB operates as a direct flight via SIN or BKK, but this should still only count as a single segment. DRW-DPS is also OK, but only on certain days.

Yachty

Thanks Hauteboy,

My dates are quite flexible for the Australia / Asia segments, do you think I should just resubmit my itin, emphasising that I can be flexible with dates in order to get direct flights?

JohnAx

The fax must have come across fuzzy the first time. Print it bigger and bolder, apologize for the first one (it may have been their fault, but it doesn't hurt to butter them up) and send it again. They clearly weren't reading the same thing you sent. And no need to offer flexibility. If the route exists they'll know it and it'll be up to you to book the days it operates. I didn't count segments per continent - hopefully you didn't break any of those rules?

FWIW I always send a printout of a spread sheet, listing segments FROM-TO in one column, transit/stop in another, total count in another, counts per continent (e.g. NA1, NA2 etc), flight/date/time or OPEN, etc. Hopefully the agent can take a look, quickly observe that I know the rules and followed them, and get on with pricing it.

MiamiPrep

I wonder if BA is not as knowledgable as AA. I had tentative BA schedule:

... AKL-MEL-PER-SYD-MEL... and BA told me that MEL-PER was considered transcon (as is PER-SYD), and that I am allowed only 1 transcon Australia. However, I had a new RTW with same routing ticketed by AA last week without problem and indeed my current RTW, which I complete next month, has that same routing. Maybe they have different rules?

MiamiBeach

Maybe the problem is ANU-BWI-LAS. There's no service in either one of those routes (which would require adding connecting cities and then you would exceed the segments).

That's good that at least you got an answer from them! How long did they take to respond? How did they respond (phone, fax, e-mail)? I sent them a fax last week and I am still waiting for any response...

Yachty

They replied within 24 hours by fax which was quite impressive bearing in mind I was expecting a 2 week response at best. As for ANU-BWI I'm sure there is a direct flight I think you're right about BWI to LAS though. I think it's DCA that flies to Vegas, I suppose I can't fly out from there without losing another segment between BWI and DCA even though it's overland?

MiamiBeach

You're right about a direct ANU-BWI, but I don't see any BWI/DCA/IAD-LAS direct flights. Also, you seem to have more than 4 Asia segments so you would need to pay for the extra ones.

I am impressed about the 24 hour response! Maybe the fact that they're taking so long to respond to me is good news. I did have an itinerary already built by BA RTW USA desk and I faxed IST the record locator and details.

Yachty

Have I really got too many Asia segs? According to the oneworld site, Denpasar Bali (DPS) is Australia / Pacific?

I originally tried to get UK BA to build the itin for me, but they said i had to deal direct with Ist..maybe i'll give them another go before resubmitting.

MiamiBeach

Well the oneworld timetable puts Indonesia in Australia/SWP, but the oneworld Explorer brochure shows it in Asia. I think by the textbook definition, Indonesia is in Asia as well.

MiamiBeach

Just found this post that previously discussed where DPS is.

Yachty

Thanks for that, although the opinion on that thread seemed split between DPS being Asia or Australia in the eyes of oneworld. Personally I'd be delighted if DPS counted as Asia as If I can then have another Australia destination and lose one other of the Asia segs.

Gardyloo

I think DPS is in Asia. (Is Jakarta in Asia? Yes, so one presumes all of Indonesia is by reference.) Thus yes, too many Asia segments.

AA 855 is a through flight from BWI to LAS. Not sure about seasonality.

If you're in N. America, I'd recommend getting the itinerary koshered by the BA RTW desk here (IMO about all they're good for) then get the PNR and send THAT in the fax to IST. Once they can pull it up on the system, ticketing goes much more smoothly.

Darren

It's in Asia for the purposes of the fare, regardless of where any maps put it. With a few changes, your trip is doable. But you will need to doctor it up and change the order of things.

Edited to add:

First, there are direct flights from ANU to BWI and BWI-LAS according to the AA time schedule. So those should be fine.

Second, fix your Asia segments and the trip should be valid.

This would be a valid itinerary, but you need to get your own ride from Colombo to Singapore. Runs between 200-250usd but I imagine you could get it cheaper in Colombo.

IST-BCN-LHR-JFK-SJU-ANU-BWI-LAS-LAX-AKL-SYD-DRW-PER-NRT-HKG-DPS-HKG-CMB//SIN-LHR-IST.

Third, there are ways of maxing your mileage by changing the order of your cities. Since you didn't state that as being a goal, I just changed what needed to be changed.

Yachty

Thanks for your help, the price of the ticket is going to max out the credit card so I'm keen not to pay for any additional flights. Following all your advice I've come up with the following itin.


(EUROPE)

IST-BCN-LHR-


(NORTH AMERICA)

JFK-SJU-ANU-BWI-ORD-LAX-


(AUSTRALIA / PACIFIC)

AKL-MEL-PER-BNE-DRW-


(ASIA)

DPS-HKG-CMB-HKG-NRT-


(EUROPE)

LHR-IST

Do you reckon BA will buy it? Or more to the point will they let me buy it?!

Thanks again