7/11 in AMS schipol airport I buy two o/w tickets, B fares from AMS-BOS at Transfer ticket counter 3 for $1500+/each. I bought B fares as I wanted to upgrade to J and Mr. Rijnders who was quite helpful confirmed the upgrade on the spot for 15,000NW miles each. Flight was very good both service and WBC, which I highly regard. (IMO Best tilted 180 degree lie-flat product in the skies, far better than QF's skybed, DLs, UAs, AAs..u get the point). Upon arriving in BOS I check my statement balance and this is what i see:

xxxxxxxxxxxxx UPGDOD 11JUL2006 AMS-BOS Issued Award Ticket -30,000

Fast forward to today and this is what i see in my activity:

xxxxxxxxxx5 UPGDOD 11JUL2006 AMS-BOS Issued Award Ticket -20,000
xxxxxxxxxx4 UPGDOD 11JUL2006 AMS-BOS Issued Award Ticket -30,000

So I call the NW gold desk and ask why they took an extra 20k miles, and they inform me that its not a mistake but its due to the upgrade for my companion. On top of that the agent tells me that if she was me, she would silently go away as I "owe" NW 10K miles as the upgrade should have netted NW 60k miles instead of 50K miles. I say to her I bought Full B fares and the chart clearly shows 15k per o/w, not 30k. I ask to speak to a supervisor. Carolyn Rose comes on the phone claiming that my B fare is really not a B fare but a discounted B fare and therefore it does not count as Full fare (Note: at the time of me buying my tickets I could have chosen Y/W/Q/V/B and Mr. Rijnders explained to me that price-wise it wouldnt have made any difference bcs the flight was a few hours away and they pulled out of the same inventory and price depending on cabin flown... i said whatever as long as its full B/Y and my upgrade goes through for 15000miles. Thats how I ended up with a B fare rather than Y...). So, I ask Carolyn why did you pull 50k miles instead of 60k miles? Mrs. Rose said this is a mistake and that they wont charge me the extra 10k miles even though techinically they should...
What the heck is going on here?

Edited to note: This is how it looks under mileage activity in my account:

KL 6037 NW 0037 B/B AMS - BOS 3,457 1 3,457
50% - Class Elite Qualification Bonus 1,729
100% Gold Elite Bonus 3,457
20K Bonus Play - Bonus Play 1 1,500

http://www.nwa.com/freqfly/direct/charts/europe.html

"Coach full fare" (the 15k upgrade award) = Y fare
"Select coach fares" (the 30k upgrade award) = B fare

Nothing else is upgradeable.

So yes, you got lucky with the 20k for the companion. Not sure what that's about.

thanks. i consulted that chart but nowherer it shows Y= full fare and B=selected coach fare... where do u see that?

I looked under "upgrade award guidelines" and it states:
"Effective March 1, 2005, WorldPerks mileage upgrades for trans-Atlantic and trans-Pacific itineraries are only available on eligible paid Northwest Y and B type fares, Continental Y and H type fares, and on KLM S and B type fares".

Unfortunately it doesn't explicitly say that anywhere. I think they leave it out in case they change the rules for what fare classes are eligible (you'll see there's a little * at the bottom of the page that says they reserve the right to change which fare classes are eligible).

But in general, when an airline says "full fare," they mean "full Y fare" (some discounted Y fares may not even count). Unless that airline is KLM, in which case they mean "full S fare."

Slighlty different issue: Has anyone been able to upgrade on any other fares out of AMS when going to the lounge?

I just upgraded two B fares for 15k each. The rules seem more like "guidelines" from how they get applied.

Was this TATL or TPAC? Or was it US49/Caribbean/Mexico/Central-America?

I swear I have posted this 100 times on this forum.

Everybody says "Y = 15k and B = 30k". This is simply NOT true 100% of the time.

There are transatlantic B fares that can be upgraded for 15k each way. They do exist. I have done this. Numerous times. B2US and B5GB are two examples. These are fully changeable and fully refundable B fares.

So, yes the OP has a valid complaint if he requested "full B fares that can be upgraded for 15k." In theory anyway.

In practice, I have found that 3/4 of the WPSC agents I've dealt with don't know that there are B fares that can be upgraded for 15k. I have bought B2US fares and asked them to be upgraded to be told that it will cost me 30k. I have asked the agent to re-read the rules for this specific fare basis code, and they have come stating, "Wow, I've never seen that before, you CAN upgrade it for 15k!"

I have also searched for mileage upgrades online and nwa.com has returned B fare basis codes requiring 30k miles for the upgrade, but when I called and queried this the fares were upgraded for 15k miles.

So, if most WPSC agents don't know this, your chances of finding a Schiphol transfer desk agent that knows this are somewhere between Slim and None.

I have personally done upgrades at KL outstations and signed the xeroxed form that that authorises 15k miles to be deducted on a discount B fare. I didn't complain when 30k came out because I knew this was a discounted B fare.

However, your situation is different. You specifically asked for something that does exist and you didn't get it. If you paid $1500+ for these one-way fares, I suspect that they WERE 15k upgradeable B fares. I've never seen a 15k upgradeable B for less than $2400 round-trip so you're in the ball park.

I would escalate this.

Caveat Emptor: it's been at least a year since I last bought a 15k upgradeable B fare, so it's possible the rules have changed.

so i try and call again and speak to a second supervisor. This time im told that yes I was on a full fare B and that the reason why i am being charged 30k/upgrade its because i bought the tickets through KLM in holland!! She said that if I had bought the same exact ticket in the US either KLM or NW, I would have been subject to 15k/upgrade
I am thouroughly confused and it makes 0 sense... just dont understand and wont get a straight answer. Just got back from a trip to GUA and tomorrow will call for the third time as i will have more time to take down names and exact reason why i was charged 50k miles for these two upgrades... to be continued.

When are you flying?

When was your reservation made?

just got off the phone with the third supervisor from NW Mike Seavage(?). He claims that my fair is not a Full fare and that it would have qualified as a full fare IF it had been purhcased 24hrs before the flight. He explains that there are no B full fares within 24 hours of flight time and that the only full fares within 24hours of flight time are Y...
I expressed my frustration that in three calls I got three different answers and I gave him the name of the first supervisor (didnt write down the name of the second supervisor), of course he claims that they are both wrong. At this point im frankly annoyed more of the fact that i feel like im dealing with a snake charmer rather than a multi billion dollar corp with 30k+ employees, and that I just an not get a straight answer... what the hell is going on here?
I am going to try one last time via a channel to me offered by a fellow FTer and see what gives... (dont know if i can disclose fully, but sure will once i get the results) stay tuned...

To further add to the confusion, it is also not true that all Y fares are upgradeable for only 15k miles. I found that out today when I tried to upgrade DTW-TPE. According to the agent, not all Y fares are equal, and in my case, it would require 30k miles for the upgrade. Does this mean that they don't sell coach tickets on this route that can be upgraded for 15k miles?

-Jeff