OK......

Anyone actually been de-planed by over-anxious, hyper-neurotic airline personnel? C'mon, 'fess up, you're with family here......

I'd like to know. "Cause, yup, it happened to the Snake.

AA, November 2001:

Flew in to DFW from DCA, transferred planes. I was sitting in my coach seat waiting for the start of DFW to LAX. Plane still at gate, door open, stragglers boarding. Talking on the cell/mobile to my office in Virginia. FA appears & says "Sir, you need to turn off your phone right now." I say "OK" she moves down the aisle. Wrapping up the conversation, here comes the FA 30 seconds later & says, louder, "Sir I told you to turn off that phone. Do it now!" I shoot her unpleasant look, no words exchanged, tell office "Gotta go" & terminate conversation. Office hears entire exchange.

Main door still open. Trek down the aisle to utilize men's lavatory, FA staring hard at me as I enter the loo. Make comment to FA that passengers in first still talking on phones, thus should be fairness for all passengers re: cell phone usage. Finish lavatory use, go sit down in seat.

Hear captain announce "We're ready to head for LAX, I just have to take care of one minor situation."
Me: "uh-oh."



Yup. Gut feeling is correct. Here come da judge. Gate supervisor tells me to collect my belongings & follow her to jetway.
No problem, grab carry-on & trail her out to jetway. Passengers around me shaking heads & smiling sympathetic, rueful smiles. One fellow captive says aloud "That ain't right!" On the way out, walking through first, I take silent note of the fact that 2 people are still....talking on their cell phones!

Once in jetway, I ask "What is the problem?" I am told by supervisor that the pilot will tell me the answer. Herewith appears the pilot, explains to me that "the FA is uncomfortable with you on the plane & thus you have to leave the flight." Me, somewhat stupefied, explain to pilot my side of the story.
Pilot unmoved.

I offer that I am actually the person who is uncomfortable with such a neurotic, irrational, anxiety-ridden FA who is supposedly looking out for our (passenger) safety, and who is obviously drawing distinctions between coach & fc passenger phone privileges.
Pilot unmoved.

Pilot says wait right here, ducks into airplane. Here comes my escort the lovely AA DFW Ground Supervisor. Off I go, escorted to terminal by Ground Supervisor. Me, quiet. Thinking maybe it's time to just shut up if I ever want to see LAX. Thinking just get to LAX & deal with bizarro AA nightmare later.

AA DFW Ground Supervisor tells me that some airborne AA personnel "are a little uptight these days" and she will get me on the next AA flight to LAX.

Me, trying to understand: if I was such a massive threat on previous flight, why would AA put me on very next flight?
My Conclusion: it's 10:00am, but there must be a bar open somewhere in the terminal??

AA DFW Ground Supervisor, to her everlasting credit & my everlasting confusion, upgrades me to Business Class on very next AA flight from DFW to LAX.

I conclude AA flight to LAX in haze of gin & tonic, mulling over my new incarnation as "Threat to Humanity."

I write a letter to CEO of AA. I received reply from drone assistant to CEO citing AA policies ad nauseum. No apology offered to me from AA, I get the "that's the way it goes, we have our policies" response from AA.

Bottom line: I'm not embarrassed. Quite the contrary, I strongly believe that AA should be embarrassed to have on-board FA's who should be actually be in therapy, or working at 7-11, or anywhere but in the air.

It has become a good story to tell in the company of friends.

Yeesh.


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Only one thing endures & that is character.
- Greeley

Hmmm....another snake has insomnia.

Sounds like you handled it well. You rattled a bit but didn't bite.

Sorry, it wouldn't have happened if you had done what you were asked with the phone and not made a big deal about others.

Was the FA wrong? Perhaps, but each of us should take responsibility to do everything that WE can to make for a better flight and environment.

Accepting everything as written above, I have to disagree with you. 99% of the FAs put up with a whole more than they give but I hear an example of an FA going the wrong way on the authority path. The error appears to me to be on the part of the Pilot in Command. A pax acting funny and not "jumping-to" should not be reasons to abuse power. I've seen people really acting funny and talked to in the jetway only to return after being observed by several people, overcoming the initial one person reaction.


[This message has been edited by Warrenlm (edited 12-22-2001).]

Yeah...you sound like a real $% &.


Edited because of the Moderator.

[This message has been edited by IM4Travel (edited 12-22-2001).]

Snake,

Obviously you are the one in serious wrong here --
1) Talking on the cell phone --- What is your problem? -- everyone knows the fact that cell phones somehow can bring down the whole FAA tracking system and here you are using one.
2) You are certainly in a time warp - You state you were on the phone 30 seconds -- now is this a) "Honey I will be ready in half a minute" 30 seconds? In which time I can watch the next 2 innings of a game or Dad, I'm starving I need to eat in like the next 30 seconds -- which will then be followed up by "Are we going to eat yet?" even before the soundwaves of the first question have yet to reach my eardrums.
3) and I think this the fatal flaw -- You went to the bathroom. What were you thinking? --- you were still on the ground. Again this is a part of the mass of knowledge - you don't go on the ground -- lest the ramp agents have to walk in your mess. I know this since the standard procedure for plane bathrooms is to grind up the "material" and spit it out the back. So when the plane is on the gorund -- hence a large puddle.

Dear Mr. Snake I hope this has been able to clear up a misunderstanding of you not seeing the folly of your ways.

And the again everyone knows the F/C has a neutron energy shield that stops the evil rays from cell phones.... and the reason the F/A had to throw you off was not only are you a serious risk -- see reasons above --but your keen sense of obsersvation noticed the F/C pax chatting on phones -- the secret must not get out --

Warning - for those of you still reading -- all of this was typed with tongue planted firmly in cheek.

Snake I think you handled it as well as you could and an upgrade is not all bad.

A good read.

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TANSTAAFL - but if you work it right, FF miles comes pretty close.

Only if I were on your flight! If I had been there, I would insist the pilot talk to the PAX and call the Airlines on the mobile phone (I would still be talking on the phone.)

They may throw me off, but if a captian does not want to look at the facts, I don't want him flying a plane.

What? Me? I'm being falsely accused, everybody picks on snakes!

[This message has been edited by Mr Snake (edited 12-22-2001).]

Interesting replies from one & all. I knew that I could count on that!

BTW, on the flight from DFW to LAX that I was (finally) placed on by AA, the FA made the announcement that "Cellular phones may be used until the captain orders the main cabin door closed." Hearing that announcement I felt:
a) Relieved & vindicated, since that was exactly what I was doing when FA Eva Braun gave me the heave-ho for being on the phone as we sat at the gate for the first DFW-LAX flight.
b) Annoyed, since there seems to be no firm & consistent AA policy on phone usage.
c) Screwed, because FA Eva was obviously in a position of authority & power over other humans & she grossly abused her authority.

As events unfolded, I thought of calling powers-that-be & refusing to leave, much as JRF has mentioned. I quickly decided that in this day & age, that course of action would more than likely land me in the airport clink with some sort of federal charge slapped on me. Then lawyers fees, more Kafka-esque behavior from the Controllers of Our Destinies...nah! That's why I went gently into that good night.

I disagree with drtravels: your interpretation of my actions is off-base ("...not made a big deal about others"). You seem to have missed the fact that I DID suck it up & Snake Pliskin didn't bite, as eastwest has noted. However, I cannot & will not just roll over, kick my paws in the air, & whimper when someone is abusing me with their authority. I turned the cheek far enough - at some point one must speak up for oneself before there ain't any cheeks left.(: Especially when it is moi who gets the hook from stage-left while the suits in first chat merrily away on their cellphones.
Then again, maybe your style is just different from mine, eh?

As CFM3RD so aptly put it (to paraphrase), sometimes ya gotta handle it as best ya can
& look at the bright side: the upgrade.(: BTW, CFM3RD...whip-snap wicked sense of humour you've got there, yow! If you & JRF had this happen to you all, you'd probably be flying free for life.

Actually, Warrenim hit the nail on the head re: the captain's responsibilities. It's the cap's ship, his flight crew, & his passengers. When he told me to wait a moment, then turned & nipped through the main cabin door, and the next thing I see is the door being sealed with me standing forlornly in the jetway......I actually laughed out loud. Talk about avoiding the issue & refusing to make a valid decision: he scooted into the ship, probably told everyone he made a captain's decision re: said dangerous passenger with cell-phone & then in his most stentorian tone said "Seal the main cabin door!" Ah, the drama. No cojones there at all.

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Only one thing endures & that is character.
- Greeley

While I shouldn't judge since I wasn't there, I'll go out on a limb and suggest that the pilot may have been showing "solidarity" with his flight crew.

On that note, too bad you didn't pursue the FA who pulled this. You could have written in to get her on the path to being relieved of a job she's clearly not cut out for. And I don't want to hear this whining bullshiit nonsense about, "The FA's have it tough these days, waah, waah, waah." That's their goddammed job. It's their job to be on the ball and to be on the up and up, which means *not* going to lunatic extremes with crying to the front office at every little thing or even sarcastic passenger, all the more BECAUSE OF and NOT in spite of, the situation as of late. If they don't have the wherewithal to maintain their professionalism, even-mindedness, and above all sense of customer-orientation, then they should just get the hell out.

9-11 is NOT an excuse for lapses of attention to professionalism. It is a clarion call to renew and redefine it.

If you can't take the heat...

[This message has been edited by ETOPS01 (edited 12-22-2001).]

wrong you are. this is cleary an abuse of power by a neurotic FA. snake, i have to commend your restraint in this situation, as i don't know that i would have done the same. do you hold any elite status on AA? if so, call customer service, speak to a non-peon and throw that around a bit. i think you are entitled to more compensation than an upgrade on a later flight, at least according to the 'spirit' of Rule 240. airlines need our loyalty now more than ever before, and this is not the way to ensure it.

Snake, my commiseration's, what they say about fact being stranger than fiction certainly holds true in your case. At least you took it all in stride to your great credit and as you say, now you have a very interesting story to tell.

Looks like you met your Duke of NY on that flight in the guise of an FA

Great post ETOPS01, hear, hear.



[This message has been edited by Mvic (edited 12-22-2001).]

That is an unbelievable story! How dare they!! I think you should pursue the complaint route again. I'm sure by yanking you off, they made you late into lax. What if you had to be there at a certain time? Can you tell us the FA's name so we can avoid her?

It's too late to complain further with AA. When you voluntarily left the plane, you virtually admitted to being "guilty" (notwithstanding the main cabin door still being open).

Personally, I don't use a cell phone, so it's hard for me to say what I would do as I wouldn't be in exactly the same situation. But it's certainly possible I might be doing something that could have the potential to concern a passenger or crew member, and therefore should be booted off the plane pronto.

Well, if that ever does happen, unlike you, I'm not going quietly. The convenience of taking the next flight is nothing compared to the value I place on my right to due process. If the pilot wants me off the plane, he can have a police officer arrest me. On the plane, not in the jetway. If the FA wants me off, he/she can ask the pilot, who can then ask a police officer to arrest me.

ETOPS01 is right; now is when it is more important than ever that we not allow our freedoms to be diluted by those who abuse their newfound power.