Clueless people?
Sep 9, 2005 | 7:49 am
#46
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Originally Posted by chauming
You paid? Anyway, let's simplify things. What was the amount of Marriott points you converted to AA miles?
I "bought" award code 083 for 235,000 points. This is 7 nights in a Category 1-5 property, plus 120,000 miles. A Category 5 7-night award is 115,000 points, so I got the miles at the rate of 1 Marriott point = 1 airline mile.
I can earn Marriott points at the rate of at least 16/$ (10/$ basic + 30% plat bonus + 3/$ MR Visa card) and sometimes more during promotions. Once you get past the "hump" of the hotel award, that's a mileage-earning rate only surpassed by actual flying!
At the time (this was earlier this year), AA was offering a 20% bonus on MR -> AA transfers. So, the 120K became 144K AA miles.
I can't find a link to the AA -> HH chart, but it's in my HHonors booklet.
Sep 9, 2005 | 7:56 am
#47
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: IAD
Programs: Chase Million Miler, SPG Gold, HHonors Gold, Hyatt Platinum
Posts: 2,729
Originally Posted by divaof travel
If you use PL extensively for your hotels, then the hotel programs are indeed of lesser value than they would otherwise be. But then I assume you are also using PL for your airline tickets, right? No??? Why not??
Next, let's qualify my hotel stays as "when I stay in hotels, I use HW extensively." I don't stay in hotels very often. Lemme think here, I've had a whopping 5 stays this year.
So, let's put this in perspective... if you flew three or four times per year domestically (or even six or seven times per year up and down one of the coasts) would you really realize much benefit from an FF program? If you could save $50 using PL/HW and not get any of the bennies, would you do it? How about if you flew 25k miles in a year? 50k? 75k? 100k? At a certain point, the FF bennies become something worth looking at.
My hotel stays are like flying three or four times per year. What's in it for me after three, four, or five stays? Not a whole lot. If I'm saving $50 *per night* it adds up. My most recent trip to DFW netted me what I guess would be a $100/night savings over the hotel website. That savings outright paid for my $188 LAX-DFW plane ticket. I never HW'd that airfare, so I don't know how much I "overspent."
Sep 9, 2005 | 7:56 am
#48
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Originally Posted by DHAST
As far as hotels go, I am a leisure traveler. I don't stay in hotels very often, and when I do I very rarely pay rack rate for a room...Unless it's a very rare circumstance, I try to pay under $100 for a room. I just don't know how to do that with a top chain ...
I negotiated a rate at a Fairfield Inn for $30/night, and that lasted over a year. In my current location, I'm also staying at an FI and, while it's higher than that, it's still a very acceptable rate. And fully point-earning.
They treat me like a platinum, always put me in a "suite", all the goodies available, etc. It's like home ... sorta.
Sep 9, 2005 | 8:01 am
#49
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Originally Posted by DHAST
My hotel stays are like flying three or four times per year. What's in it for me after three, four, or five stays? Not a whole lot.
Last year, my status with Hilton was expiring [it could have been one of those "call and they'll make you Gold" things, but it wasn't]. There was this promotion (ACAQ) which got you 50K points after 4 stays.
So I did it twice -- two different accounts, and then combined them.
Those 8 stays got me 100K+ HH points, and a very nice Christmas vacation with my wife at the Cavalieri in Rome.
The moral of the story is ... if you're gonna play the game, you gotta get serious about it.
Sep 9, 2005 | 8:54 am
#50
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Baltimore - Hyatt Lifetime Diamond/Courtesy Card, UA 2M
Posts: 993
When you are on a reasonable expense account, and stay at hotels frequently, you are missing out on a great benefit if you don't participate in the hotel programs. I have earned and redeemed hundreds of free nights at high quality hotels in great locations around the world. And up until this round of Hyatt's "Faster Free Nights" , you could even earn free nights on PL stays.
There is no doubt that some people's travel habits would not earn them a lot of free hotel nights. Conversely, my current travel load produces only a few free airline tickets per year, but I easily accrue over 20 free hotel nights.
And IMHO, the hotel award are much more lucrative. I have saved loads more money on free hotel rooms than I have on free flights.
And I don't care what airline you are on, a long-haul flight in F is still a pain in the rear. It is not an experience that any rational person looks forward to. Domestic is even worse. (And I have NEVER had a meal on an airline (including SQ first) that I would sit down and pay for on the ground.)
Now two weeks in an oceanfront suite at Hyatt Regency Kauai is a reward most people could look forward to.
There is no doubt that some people's travel habits would not earn them a lot of free hotel nights. Conversely, my current travel load produces only a few free airline tickets per year, but I easily accrue over 20 free hotel nights.
And IMHO, the hotel award are much more lucrative. I have saved loads more money on free hotel rooms than I have on free flights.
And I don't care what airline you are on, a long-haul flight in F is still a pain in the rear. It is not an experience that any rational person looks forward to. Domestic is even worse. (And I have NEVER had a meal on an airline (including SQ first) that I would sit down and pay for on the ground.)
Now two weeks in an oceanfront suite at Hyatt Regency Kauai is a reward most people could look forward to.
Last edited by divaof travel; Sep 9, 2005 at 4:52 pm
Sep 9, 2005 | 11:37 am
#51
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: Cleveland, OH
Posts: 794
Originally Posted by divaof travel
What is even more intriguing to me are people who get it for airlines, but ignore the hotel programs, even if they spend scores of nights each year at high end chains. Almost everyboy I come across who travels frequently is involved with the airline programs, but only a minority participate in a hotel scheme.
I have made a point to check in with these folks and get MY hotel FF number of their reservation and pay for their rooms just to get the credits and points.
Works for me!!!
Sep 9, 2005 | 12:50 pm
#52
In Memoriam
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: EWR (Wayne Township, NJ) and PHX
Programs: CO OnePass Plat and SPG - Plat, Marriott Plat (don't use -it's a comp), AmericaWest CP
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Originally Posted by TXNancy
...Just recently I had to turn down an upgrade because I was traveling with my young son. The gentleman next to me mentioned that he had never sits in the first class because of the cost. He wants to know why I was offered a seat in the first class. By the end of the flight, he had a OnePass Application in his hand. He flies once a week.
Seriously though, I run into people the time who think I'm nuts for playing the system. Many of them are family members and associates. I cant complain and when the people who I actually care to educate understand there is some value to it all, they often have OnePass numbers printed out before they fly.
My uncle in LAS flies CO to the east coast couple times a year, while he may not hit elite I explained the miles dont expire - why not collect them until you might need them?
My one aunt doesnt care about travel rewards, but loves transfering the miles to Amtrak from CO to redeem for Gift Cards.
Until people see a value or can relate why would they bother to care?
-Vincent
Sep 9, 2005 | 5:40 pm
#53
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: IAD
Programs: Chase Million Miler, SPG Gold, HHonors Gold, Hyatt Platinum
Posts: 2,729
Originally Posted by BigLar
I stay 150+ nights/year in the Marriott and Hilton chains, and have never paid over $79/night.
I negotiated a rate at a Fairfield Inn for $30/night, and that lasted over a year. In my current location, I'm also staying at an FI and, while it's higher than that, it's still a very acceptable rate. And fully point-earning.
They treat me like a platinum, always put me in a "suite", all the goodies available, etc. It's like home ... sorta.
I negotiated a rate at a Fairfield Inn for $30/night, and that lasted over a year. In my current location, I'm also staying at an FI and, while it's higher than that, it's still a very acceptable rate. And fully point-earning.
They treat me like a platinum, always put me in a "suite", all the goodies available, etc. It's like home ... sorta.
Is this a rate avaiable to me, or is it a negotiated discount ala the corporate discount programs that the airlines have? I sure don't get any cheaper fares on the airlines just because I flew XXX miles last year. If you're getting negotiated volume discounts, it's really irrelavent to me who stays 5 stays a year and doesn't have the volume to negotiate a deal like that.
Sep 9, 2005 | 5:57 pm
#54
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Baltimore - Hyatt Lifetime Diamond/Courtesy Card, UA 2M
Posts: 993
Originally Posted by DHAST
...My hotel stays are like flying three or four times per year. What's in it for me after three, four, or five stays? Not a whole lot. If I'm saving $50 *per night* it adds up...
For example, what could four nights a year at Hyatt net you? How about two free nights at Park Hyatt Tokyo, Paris, Milan, London, Maui of Kauai (where it would be difficult to buy the room for under $400.) And this could be earned by spending as little as $250 total revenue for the four "earning" nights .
So you can certainly might save $50/night on HW. But I would rather have the free rooms worth $800, plus the status perks (free breakfast, snacks, drinks and upgrade.) And of course, the extra $50 I might spend to get a Hyatt is not out of my own pocket anyway...
Sep 9, 2005 | 6:44 pm
#55
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Land of ORD
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Time was all I cared about was getting an elite level so I could board early. I would qualify on 4 airlines each year. If I got one free ticket a year I would just give it to my Mom. I joined all of the hotel plans so I could get upgrades and a free paper.
Last year I got a bigscreen TV and a 130mm computerised telescope from AMEX using points and a power washier form ICHotels.
Plus I still have a million airline miles left after taking a few trips!
But you have to have clear goals in mind. And many plans do nothing for you if you do not use them. The AMEX plan costs 50 dollars a year to play. If you didn't spend at least $5000 on AMEX it was not worth it.
Last year I got a bigscreen TV and a 130mm computerised telescope from AMEX using points and a power washier form ICHotels.
Plus I still have a million airline miles left after taking a few trips!
But you have to have clear goals in mind. And many plans do nothing for you if you do not use them. The AMEX plan costs 50 dollars a year to play. If you didn't spend at least $5000 on AMEX it was not worth it.
Sep 9, 2005 | 11:10 pm
#56
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Originally Posted by DHAST
Next question...
Is this a rate avaiable to me, or is it a negotiated discount ala the corporate discount programs that the airlines have? I sure don't get any cheaper fares on the airlines just because I flew XXX miles last year. If you're getting negotiated volume discounts, it's really irrelavent to me who stays 5 stays a year and doesn't have the volume to negotiate a deal like that.
Is this a rate avaiable to me, or is it a negotiated discount ala the corporate discount programs that the airlines have? I sure don't get any cheaper fares on the airlines just because I flew XXX miles last year. If you're getting negotiated volume discounts, it's really irrelavent to me who stays 5 stays a year and doesn't have the volume to negotiate a deal like that.
As an example, when I was doing my "mattress run" earlier this year for Hilton, I uncovered a govt rate at the Hilton Suites in Auburn Hills, MI -- $69/night. I got a nice suite, a pretty good hotel, and (as a Diamond) a very nice hot breakfast. Never asked for ID, but I had it if needed.
Nobody's gonna call you up and offer you a deal -- you gotta search them out.
Sep 9, 2005 | 11:14 pm
#57
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Originally Posted by SirFlysALot
The AMEX plan costs 50 dollars a year to play. If you didn't spend at least $5000 on AMEX it was not worth it.
The Starwood AMEX is (IIRC) cheaper than that, and there are lots of associated bennies.
The Hilton AMEX is FREE, and is a very good point earner for Hilton. Plus, if you run $20K a year through it, you are automatically a Gold. Not bad at all. And, they give you access to their AXON award, 4 nights at a Cat 5 or Cat 6 property (think Paris, Rome, W=A, etc.) for 125K points.
Sep 9, 2005 | 11:20 pm
#58
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Originally Posted by Ring Lardner
It's not that so many folks is ignorant; it's just that so many folks know things that ain't so!
A lot of us go through life with certain fixed ideas (Large Economy Size is always cheaper, Southwest has the best price, hotel points -> airline miles is always a losing proposition, etc.). We have to step back and actually evaluate each individual case before we make knee-jerk decisions, based on what "everybody knows".
That's the beauty of Flyertalk.
Sep 10, 2005 | 6:32 am
#59
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: MSY
Programs: NW Gold and now Delta Gold
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Marathon Man, Let me say first that I am so sorry to hear about your dad being killed on 9-11.
Second, as a Katrina evacuee whose home airport was most recently famous for having medical triage on the baggage claim, I'm one thousand percent in agreement with your post. There is a lot of chaos involved in trying to recover and keep safe all of my own accounts and paperwork. We are limited in our time, so we are wise to pick the best programs for our purposes and let the others go by.
Some people are indeed clueless. Other people just know their limits and how much they can put into chasing the deals and giveaways. They know very well they don't get every bonus or benefit, but they consider it a fair trade-off to free up some time.
Second, as a Katrina evacuee whose home airport was most recently famous for having medical triage on the baggage claim, I'm one thousand percent in agreement with your post. There is a lot of chaos involved in trying to recover and keep safe all of my own accounts and paperwork. We are limited in our time, so we are wise to pick the best programs for our purposes and let the others go by.
Some people are indeed clueless. Other people just know their limits and how much they can put into chasing the deals and giveaways. They know very well they don't get every bonus or benefit, but they consider it a fair trade-off to free up some time.
Originally Posted by Marathon Man
The reasons why people disregard some things may go further than some here are willing to comprehend. HOW MANY ACCOUNTS DO YOU HAVE OR WANT IN YOUR LIFE?
does it not get overwhelming to any of us?
YES!
I actually am STILL in the process of trying to streamline my many accounts in life and NO, you cannot have the same password for each one of them! Dont let anyone fool you with that come back!
Example: Continental Airlines wanted a 4 digit password and Continental Vactions site wanted a 6 digit one. There ya go. Some places require letters or other password combinations! It is a lot of stuff to handle.
i have an excel sheet with everything on it. But recently I got so overwhelmed myself, this sheet became a printout with post it notes stuck to it and new accounts or old accounts strewen about all over it. Then we moved and it is in a box that will soon be opened up and hopefully organized in my office to be in a room not yet painted.
And you want ME to join YET ANOTHER service or program?
NOPE!
Now, add a flood in your home town (let's say I llived in New Orleans) and that is just NOt a good thing at all.
hey, my dad was killed on 9/11/01. Do you know how badly it sucked to have to deal with AOL to get into his email and change it over to my mom's ability to read it?
that was harder to deal with than some of the funeral things we did!
wow.
Some people--self included--find it sometimes too hard to open yet another THING in their already busy life.
I gotta go to the bank now, so see you in a while. Oh, which card am I using and what's the pin? And did the bank just email me saying they are changing their systems and got bought out so I gotta choose another one anyway?
MM
does it not get overwhelming to any of us?
YES!
I actually am STILL in the process of trying to streamline my many accounts in life and NO, you cannot have the same password for each one of them! Dont let anyone fool you with that come back!
Example: Continental Airlines wanted a 4 digit password and Continental Vactions site wanted a 6 digit one. There ya go. Some places require letters or other password combinations! It is a lot of stuff to handle.
i have an excel sheet with everything on it. But recently I got so overwhelmed myself, this sheet became a printout with post it notes stuck to it and new accounts or old accounts strewen about all over it. Then we moved and it is in a box that will soon be opened up and hopefully organized in my office to be in a room not yet painted.
And you want ME to join YET ANOTHER service or program?
NOPE!
Now, add a flood in your home town (let's say I llived in New Orleans) and that is just NOt a good thing at all.
hey, my dad was killed on 9/11/01. Do you know how badly it sucked to have to deal with AOL to get into his email and change it over to my mom's ability to read it?
that was harder to deal with than some of the funeral things we did!
wow.
Some people--self included--find it sometimes too hard to open yet another THING in their already busy life.
I gotta go to the bank now, so see you in a while. Oh, which card am I using and what's the pin? And did the bank just email me saying they are changing their systems and got bought out so I gotta choose another one anyway?
MM
Sep 10, 2005 | 7:35 am
#60
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: MCI
Programs: AA LT Gold; BA Silver; Hilton Diamond
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I belong to Toastmasters and I am ITCHING to do a talk to my Club on the glories of loyalty programs. But, it's a company-sponsored chapter. I travel on business only a few times a year although I've scored trips to India and Munich (and am working on getting to India again). Most of the perks I get are due to personal travel (husband and I usually go to Europe twice a year), judicious use of credit cards with hotel rewards (unfortunately I have to use the corporate MC for business) and promos I learned about on FT such as ACAQ and CTCH. I will also switch to a hotel other than the official convention hotel for meetings of my professional society in order to get points- but only if it's convenient and less than the official place.
My concern is that the presentation will somehow make people think I'm making decisions about business travel that cost the company extra to maximize freebies, and then using those perks on personal travel. So, the talk will go undone for now!
My concern is that the presentation will somehow make people think I'm making decisions about business travel that cost the company extra to maximize freebies, and then using those perks on personal travel. So, the talk will go undone for now!