Why are Delta's SkyMiles called SkyPesos?
Jul 11, 2010, 4:03 pm
#136
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"Why are Delta's SkyMiles called SkyPesos?"
... because Delta SkyMiles gest the criticism it deserves from those not married to DL management's customer-unfriendly ways.
... because Delta SkyMiles gest the criticism it deserves from those not married to DL management's customer-unfriendly ways.
Jul 11, 2010, 5:18 pm
#137
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Delta miles are great for domestic hopes on Alaska Airlines, sure. And Delta miles can be used on MH, CZ, AF, etc. Just not always easily. Delta miles are not worthless, they are just worth less than most other currencies.
I do not actually blame Jeff Robertson for this. Though he really needs to beg and plead for some IT resources to at least make the most of the inventory at his disposal, compensate for the lack of DL metal inventory and get partner award booking working on the website for all partners or at least most.
Beyond IT it's really DL inventory management to blame. Skymiles doesn't determine which seats are released as awards, that's the airline itself. Skymiles are worth less because (1) the airline they're associated with offers such poor award availability (2) most (but not all) of their partners offer poor premium cabin award availability and (3) because DL's IT is so bad that it is very very hard to find even those seats that do exist.
It is possible to work aroudn these constraints, it is possible to book awards with Skymiles. But on the whole it's just harder to do so with Skymiles than miles from Co, UA, US, AA, AS, AC, BA, OZ, NH, etc.
I do not actually blame Jeff Robertson for this. Though he really needs to beg and plead for some IT resources to at least make the most of the inventory at his disposal, compensate for the lack of DL metal inventory and get partner award booking working on the website for all partners or at least most.
Beyond IT it's really DL inventory management to blame. Skymiles doesn't determine which seats are released as awards, that's the airline itself. Skymiles are worth less because (1) the airline they're associated with offers such poor award availability (2) most (but not all) of their partners offer poor premium cabin award availability and (3) because DL's IT is so bad that it is very very hard to find even those seats that do exist.
It is possible to work aroudn these constraints, it is possible to book awards with Skymiles. But on the whole it's just harder to do so with Skymiles than miles from Co, UA, US, AA, AS, AC, BA, OZ, NH, etc.
Jul 13, 2010, 6:02 pm
#138
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Pretty soon, it won't matter anyway as there will be only 3 main carriers (besides low fare guys) in the US - UA, DL and AA (as I predict they will buy/merge US). Then, it will get really bad as they'll all jump on the bandwagon of devaluing their mileage plans down to a point where folks won't even bother with accruing any 
Instead, it will be the battle to obtain status while mileage accrual will be only a secondary afterthought
Just some thoughts from an INfrequent traveler (yes, I know my profile shows I'm DL FA but it's not so this year
)
Peace
Instead, it will be the battle to obtain status while mileage accrual will be only a secondary afterthought
Just some thoughts from an INfrequent traveler (yes, I know my profile shows I'm DL FA but it's not so this year
)Peace
Jul 20, 2010, 2:21 pm
#139
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worth less
I saw this interesting post in this thread and thought we could apply the same logic to DL and see what happens.
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/ameri...lidated-9.html
For DL to reach DM,
Miles value for 125k = 125,000 miles + 75k bonus from 50k = 200k miles
EVIPs - outside value = zero, to owner, ~1000? due to high M fare
Waived fees, upgrades, F lounge etc = $4000 I think upgrades for GM, PM on DL en route to DM are also much better than to a plat on AA (does not exist)
so a DM is worth about 7-8000$, say 7500$, or 125k MQM = 7500$ or 6 cpmqm.
This is why DL miles are worth less (I agree with not worthless).
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/ameri...lidated-9.html
I think in determining the value of a mile when comparing a purchased ticket to an award ticket, the purchased value must be subtracted. Example:
First 100,000 miles on AA = EXP
Miles value (200,000) @ .02/mile = $4000
EVIPS @ $500 per x 8 = $4000
Waived fees, upgrades, F lounge etc = $2000
(all subjective values)
So, I placed $10,000 value on 100,000 EQM or $.10/mile. If I fly 13,000 miles and use an award then I'm "out" $1,300 in potential value if I've not flown 100,000 miles yet. For me, the above example would be reduced by $1,300 (assuming 13,000 miles) and the new value be $3,400 or $.025/miles.
Generally, I use $.10 as the value in earning EQM and $.02-$.03 in using miles.
First 100,000 miles on AA = EXP
Miles value (200,000) @ .02/mile = $4000
EVIPS @ $500 per x 8 = $4000
Waived fees, upgrades, F lounge etc = $2000
(all subjective values)
So, I placed $10,000 value on 100,000 EQM or $.10/mile. If I fly 13,000 miles and use an award then I'm "out" $1,300 in potential value if I've not flown 100,000 miles yet. For me, the above example would be reduced by $1,300 (assuming 13,000 miles) and the new value be $3,400 or $.025/miles.
Generally, I use $.10 as the value in earning EQM and $.02-$.03 in using miles.
Miles value for 125k = 125,000 miles + 75k bonus from 50k = 200k miles
EVIPs - outside value = zero, to owner, ~1000? due to high M fare
Waived fees, upgrades, F lounge etc = $4000 I think upgrades for GM, PM on DL en route to DM are also much better than to a plat on AA (does not exist)
so a DM is worth about 7-8000$, say 7500$, or 125k MQM = 7500$ or 6 cpmqm.
This is why DL miles are worth less (I agree with not worthless).
Jul 20, 2010, 7:47 pm
#140
Join Date: Mar 2004
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You'd still be taking more of a chance than with other airlines. In January I was looking to redeem my remaining SkyPesos for LOS-NYC return in September. Whether logged in as a Gold Medallion or not, the lowest price I was getting, 9 months out, was 40,000 miles. Yet with no status on AA, 25,000 miles as far as the eye could see.
Unless you're heavily invested in flying Delta and plan to continue to be, and have the general spending levels to justify DL branded Amex cards, you're better off looking at other programs.
Unless you're heavily invested in flying Delta and plan to continue to be, and have the general spending levels to justify DL branded Amex cards, you're better off looking at other programs.
The only reason to accumulate Skymiles is if you live in a Delta hub city and are earning elite status for domestic upgrades.
Even if you live in a Delta hub, but aren't going to make status, credit your flying to Alaska.
And if you don't live in a Delta hub, fly a different airline and earn status with them and miles with them instead.
The only reason to earn non-flight miles with Skymiles is if those miles help you towards status. If your credit card spend isn't going towards status, it makes no sense to accumulate Skymiles at all. And other non-MQM earning activity? No way.
Even if you live in a Delta hub, but aren't going to make status, credit your flying to Alaska.
And if you don't live in a Delta hub, fly a different airline and earn status with them and miles with them instead.
The only reason to earn non-flight miles with Skymiles is if those miles help you towards status. If your credit card spend isn't going towards status, it makes no sense to accumulate Skymiles at all. And other non-MQM earning activity? No way.
Aug 20, 2010, 4:23 pm
#141
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Has anyone from top management of Delta commented lately ( 2010) on these complaints and how Delta would correct them?
Aug 22, 2010, 6:44 pm
#142
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Why are Sky Miles called Sky Pesos? Check BE availability for two November 2010 through March 2011.
Feb 11, 2012, 12:26 pm
#143
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You're really going to stake your argument on how 'limited' the domestic route networks of American Airlines and US Airways are? Sure, if you frequently want to go places that only Delta flies when redeeming your awards and you fly enough to be a Delta top tier elite then you should fly Delta and credit your flight miles to Skymiles. What cities are those, adn is htat actually your redemption pattern?
I've long said that someone who lives in a Delta hub city and flies enough to earn a good tier of elite status should probably fly Delta and credit to Skymiles, because upgrades matter.
And that person might even use a Delta credit card for the spending contribution towards status, and the Reserve card's bump in upgrade priority.
But that's different from saying that they should make that choice because of Skymiles redemption ability.
And if they don't need the credit card to boost status, then even in your relatively limited case of someone who only wants to redeem within the 48 contiguous United States (and that is a VERY limiting case, and even there your quote above concedes you aren't saying Delta is best) I'd argue such a person should probably use a cash back card and use the cash to buy those domestic tickets if they wish. If the tickets are for themselves, as a Dimaond they'll be upgraded most of the time. And regardless of who they're for they won't have to fight for inventory at the low level.
As for promos I will gladly take 4750 US Airways miles over even twice as many Delta miles on a car rental, but that's because I think of my miles as more than a minor cashback currency to be used to take me in coach to Florida at the holidays. I leverage the miles and points for the sorts of aspirational awards that I couldn't or wouldn't pay cash for. For the kinds of things that have really enriched my life, seeing places and things I wouldn't otherwise have seen and experiencing cultures I wasn't already familiar with -- and doing it all in a modicum of comfort otherwise-unsupported by my modest income.
I've long said that someone who lives in a Delta hub city and flies enough to earn a good tier of elite status should probably fly Delta and credit to Skymiles, because upgrades matter.
And that person might even use a Delta credit card for the spending contribution towards status, and the Reserve card's bump in upgrade priority.
But that's different from saying that they should make that choice because of Skymiles redemption ability.
And if they don't need the credit card to boost status, then even in your relatively limited case of someone who only wants to redeem within the 48 contiguous United States (and that is a VERY limiting case, and even there your quote above concedes you aren't saying Delta is best) I'd argue such a person should probably use a cash back card and use the cash to buy those domestic tickets if they wish. If the tickets are for themselves, as a Dimaond they'll be upgraded most of the time. And regardless of who they're for they won't have to fight for inventory at the low level.
As for promos I will gladly take 4750 US Airways miles over even twice as many Delta miles on a car rental, but that's because I think of my miles as more than a minor cashback currency to be used to take me in coach to Florida at the holidays. I leverage the miles and points for the sorts of aspirational awards that I couldn't or wouldn't pay cash for. For the kinds of things that have really enriched my life, seeing places and things I wouldn't otherwise have seen and experiencing cultures I wasn't already familiar with -- and doing it all in a modicum of comfort otherwise-unsupported by my modest income.
^^^^
Feb 12, 2012, 8:02 pm
#144
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Delta miles are great for domestic hopes on Alaska Airlines, sure. And Delta miles can be used on MH, CZ, AF, etc. Just not always easily. Delta miles are not worthless, they are just worth less than most other currencies.
I do not actually blame Jeff Robertson for this. Though he really needs to beg and plead for some IT resources to at least make the most of the inventory at his disposal, compensate for the lack of DL metal inventory and get partner award booking working on the website for all partners or at least most.
Beyond IT it's really DL inventory management to blame. Skymiles doesn't determine which seats are released as awards, that's the airline itself. Skymiles are worth less because (1) the airline they're associated with offers such poor award availability (2) most (but not all) of their partners offer poor premium cabin award availability and (3) because DL's IT is so bad that it is very very hard to find even those seats that do exist.
I do not actually blame Jeff Robertson for this. Though he really needs to beg and plead for some IT resources to at least make the most of the inventory at his disposal, compensate for the lack of DL metal inventory and get partner award booking working on the website for all partners or at least most.
Beyond IT it's really DL inventory management to blame. Skymiles doesn't determine which seats are released as awards, that's the airline itself. Skymiles are worth less because (1) the airline they're associated with offers such poor award availability (2) most (but not all) of their partners offer poor premium cabin award availability and (3) because DL's IT is so bad that it is very very hard to find even those seats that do exist.
I will argue that Jeff Robertson could make a stronger case on behalf of his customers but I understand that he's got not just rev mgmt to please but AMEX as well. IT is a matter of time, they will get to nwa.com features of finding seats. I don't envy his position, but wish he would communicate better; often times things coming from SkyMiles only add to the frustration/disgust people have with SkyPesos.
Feb 13, 2012, 1:49 pm
#145
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this thread is absolutely hilarious
Feb 13, 2012, 4:20 pm
#146
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Feb 13, 2012, 6:02 pm
#147
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UA/CO miles, particularly over the past six months, have become much harder for me to redeem domestically (48 states) at the 25K level than DL miles, even without using Medallion inventory. This has been true over a wide variety of dates, times, routings, and lead times. DL miles, as a Medallion member, have gotten me first class every time to boot. Try doing a few test searches yourself... if you do it randomly (not cherry picking), you'll see what I mean.
Feb 13, 2012, 7:27 pm
#148
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UA/CO miles, particularly over the past six months, have become much harder for me to redeem domestically (48 states) at the 25K level than DL miles, even without using Medallion inventory. This has been true over a wide variety of dates, times, routings, and lead times. DL miles, as a Medallion member, have gotten me first class every time to boot. Try doing a few test searches yourself... if you do it randomly (not cherry picking), you'll see what I mean.
For my friends, DL has good upgrade rates (though, with me being at 100% on AA I don't see any reason to complain), but their redemption options have been very frustrating for them. They can never seem to find what they want at the time they want, even booking far in advance, at a reasonable redemption level.
The only DL flyer I know that is happy with DL on Intl flights is someone who's Dad was a DL pilot and they fly on those privilges internationally. They're very happy with the availability of Biz seats on the flights they take. Even on a trip to Rio for carnival they were in Biz class for their whole trip. Would think that DL would have limited availability during that time, and they probably did for FF redemptions, but apparently not for employee benefit people.
Feb 13, 2012, 7:33 pm
#149
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Look around a bit more. A few months ago, you couldn't avoid seeing a new thread or more per day that claimed DL miles were "worthless". Most often, the assertion was broad - not specific to international travel. As the vast majority of Delta's revenue and routes are domestic, it is silly to focus on international-only. Both matter.
Feb 14, 2012, 2:00 am
#150
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But if you have the Delta AMEX and schlep a bag in the hold you can deduct the $50 RT bag fee AA would snooker you for.
Look around a bit more. A few months ago, you couldn't avoid seeing a new thread or more per day that claimed DL miles were "worthless". Most often, the assertion was broad - not specific to international travel. As the vast majority of Delta's revenue and routes are domestic, it is silly to focus on international-only. Both matter.