Loads at CLE in the 70's were in the 50-60% range, no where near where they were in CLE during the CO days. The population and corporate HQ numbers were far greater as well. After years of Voinovich, Stokes, White, Oakar, Tubbs and lets not forget Russo and Dimora we are left with a shell of a downtown and fewer businesses and people to fill the planes and the city. Oh yes and the infamous Kucinich, all played their hand in the destruction of the city. Yet re-elected time and time again as the city decayed. For anyone that mentions the reborn flats, half a block on East 4th, or West 6th it will fall again as it did the last time.
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One difference you need to take into consideration is downtowns growing population now exceeds 13,000 and excepts to continue to grow. Lots of new downtown housing on the works, new hotels and new restaurants and retail. All this can do is help to make sure it will not fall again.
As far as UA is concerned CLE still has more flights then any non hub airport and I find it interesting they continue to fly to destinations that has other competition. In particular BOS, LGA, LAS, MCO and now FLL and RSW seasonal. Lets face it the airlines seem to want there hubs in the huge population markets and with consolidation there are less of them. ATL,ORD, EWR,IAD,JFK,LAX,SFO,DTW, and DFW. Not sure about SLC. Somewhat less of the extent PHL,IAH, DEN, and CLT. DL continues to cut at CVG and PIT,STL, and MEM lost the hubs for the population scenario. |
Originally Posted by buckeyefanflyer
(Post 25744321)
As far as UA is concerned CLE still has more flights then any non hub airport and I find it interesting they continue to fly to destinations that has other competition.
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Just wanted to throw out there if it hasn't been mentioned but pushing back from CLE C10 today I noticed that C08 and C06 have been permanently borded up. The jet bridges are gone and there is literally plywood over where they were previously attached. Wonder where they went?
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That's interesting. Didn't those use to be NW gates? Perhaps DL still holds the underlying lease on those or something like that.
The Florida flights aren't particularly surprising, in the winter there's sufficient local demand they can be flown profitably with the loads they anticipate. They "abandoned" CLE by killing most of the O/D RJ operation there because it was RJs. They have several other non-hub destinations from CLE (MCO, CUN, LAS, BOS, DCA, LGA, STL and MKE), some with multiple dailies, plus some seasonal leisure stuff. They do seem to think that it makes sense to keep those, its not insubstantial. |
Originally Posted by RobS
(Post 25755589)
Peak season Florida routes are easy winners.
It doesn't take a genius to drive around SW florida in the winter months and see Ohio license plates everywhere. Or simply ask any RE agent... |
I finally took a look at the newest airport master plan... the last one I looked at was from 2012, I think. What a difference, now that there is no longer a hub operation. The new one certainly seems more realistic and able to be accomplished.
http://www.clevelandairport.com/site...er-Plan-PP.pdf |
Originally Posted by paule123
(Post 25757753)
Sad thing is Smisek didn't understand that. Once he cut southern florida, the ULCC competition came in and stole the business. I flew CLE-RSW today and there were at least 30 empty seats. United had a lock on that route and got premium $$ for it. Now UA brought back the seasonal service and has to settle for $100 o/w instead of the $200+ they were getting previously on full flights.
It doesn't take a genius to drive around SW florida in the winter months and see Ohio license plates everywhere. Or simply ask any RE agent... It's hard to pity UA for having to settle for the lower fares. JetBlue offers an excellent product on its CLE --> FLL route. I find it interesting though that there are still occasions where traffic is still routed through Hopkins. One of my friends in Milwaukee traveled to FLL from MKE and he was routed through Cleveland on UA for the same price as being routed through ORD (an airport he was happy to avoid). |
Originally Posted by plinth857
(Post 25769917)
I finally took a look at the newest airport master plan... the last one I looked at was from 2012, I think. What a difference, now that there is no longer a hub operation. The new one certainly seems more realistic and able to be accomplished.
http://www.clevelandairport.com/site...er-Plan-PP.pdf The new one is still in fantasy-land. They've got this new landside structure between the current ticketing area and the garage. ? Why? Who is going to pay for it? And what improvements will it yield. The Airport Authority needs to get its head out of its butt and start running the airport with some fiscal restraint and a view towards what the traveling public needs. Why do they need this new area? For 30 minutes of the day when the curb area is crowded? Do they need to expand FIS to handle more than 1 flight at a time? How often does that happen? If they're building a big new garage, they ought to put the car rentals in there. That's something that at least the terminating passengers will benefit from on an hourly basis. |
What are they going to do with Concourse D? I did not see any references to that in the master plan.
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Originally Posted by plinth857
(Post 25769917)
I finally took a look at the newest airport master plan... the last one I looked at was from 2012, I think. What a difference, now that there is no longer a hub operation. The new one certainly seems more realistic and able to be accomplished.
http://www.clevelandairport.com/site...er-Plan-PP.pdf If I'm wrong, I'll be happy to buy you a drink at the new hotel in 2025 :D |
The PDF was created a year ago....
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Originally Posted by entropy
(Post 25770500)
The PDF was created a year ago....
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UA has reduced the BOS flights through early April from 5 to 3. Will the extra flights really come back in April, or have they simply not updated the schedule that far out?
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They cut the BOS flights in winter annually. Used to be four (post cuts) they added five when B6 arrived, I'd venture to guess they will add in the spring but since they are condensing gates three might be all we get.
Why does everyone cry for the car rental? Its bad but so is ORD, EWR, ABQ, PHX, PVD just to name a few. |
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