Several months on - how are they doing?
Sep 21, 2018, 11:45 am
#61
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: LAS
Programs: PA FT, TW Gold, NW/CO PE, VK Eagleflyer
Posts: 7,173
Hanlon’s razor
Sep 21, 2018, 12:55 pm
#62
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: The World
Programs: WS Platinum, Marriott Titanium, DL Gold, UA Silver
Posts: 1,478
This. 100%
The biggest issue in the whole merger is the near-total lack of communication from Marriott ... particularly to their frequent customers.
Sure, there have been the email blasts that have gone out to everyone (first about transferring points between SPG and MR, then about combining accounts). But even those have been 'light' (to say the least) on detail.
But...
Things go wrong. I can't image the challenges of merging countless systems - reservations, rewards, operations, everything - between these two companies. Everyone gets that, and nobody expected perfection. It's this ongoing near-absolute silence from Marriott that is so infuriating ... and is making things worse.
The biggest issue in the whole merger is the near-total lack of communication from Marriott ... particularly to their frequent customers.
Sure, there have been the email blasts that have gone out to everyone (first about transferring points between SPG and MR, then about combining accounts). But even those have been 'light' (to say the least) on detail.
But...
- Their frequent customers are hungry for details and status updates -- good or bad. There have been none.
- Their frequent customers have been experiencing problems and uncovering issues. There's been no proactive push of communications. Nothing saying "Thanks for your patience, we know there are issues, and we're working to address them." Absolutely nothing. Total radio silence.
- There are some things that have been incredibly under-communicated, like the year-end status sweep for Lifetime members that will see qualifying customers bumped from LTP to LTPP. But customers have had to search for that information ... nothing has been pushed out. A single "As a Lifetime Platinum member of SPG, we'd like to thank you for your business and provide you with an update" would be sooooo easy to compose and push out. Instead, silence.
Things go wrong. I can't image the challenges of merging countless systems - reservations, rewards, operations, everything - between these two companies. Everyone gets that, and nobody expected perfection. It's this ongoing near-absolute silence from Marriott that is so infuriating ... and is making things worse.
Sep 21, 2018, 1:20 pm
#63
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: QDF
Programs: AA EXP (2MM), Marriott Tit
Posts: 1,038
Maybe Marriott is taking a page out of the airlines’ M&A gameplan and sees the need to shed some of their “neediest” customers. A few months of turmoil and the malcontents go away to be replaced by those who know no different. Rinse, repeat.
“We had certain groups in this program that were over-entitled if you will. And now we’ve re-aligned the benefits of that program with what the customers and program participants are actually providing to the program, it’s a good change going forward.”
https://liveandletsfly.boardingarea....s-as-entitled/
Sep 21, 2018, 10:15 pm
#64
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: USA
Programs: MYOB
Posts: 1,292
It seems that Marriott can only handle 3 items per posting as well. I had a 2 night stay at a Westin last week which had:
- base points
- 75% elite bonus
- 1500 points labeled EXTRA which I presume is my welcome bonus and MAGC points added together
What happens if there is a quarterly bonus?
It would be awesome if Marriott had a format that would itemize and identify all the various points earned. Wait a minute, didn't Starwood have an excellent activity statement that could be downloaded to an Excel spreadsheet?
- base points
- 75% elite bonus
- 1500 points labeled EXTRA which I presume is my welcome bonus and MAGC points added together
What happens if there is a quarterly bonus?
It would be awesome if Marriott had a format that would itemize and identify all the various points earned. Wait a minute, didn't Starwood have an excellent activity statement that could be downloaded to an Excel spreadsheet?
The activity detail on the "new" site & legacy Marriott site is pitiful. Looks like it was designed by a 4th grader. The total number for the stay (ie 4200=2800+1400+ 0) with no description, is really weak. (Let alone the "0" that was not credited as the amenity
)I would love to believe that the master plan was "let's get everyone onto one platform, while we work to have rollout by Jan 1st that incorporates many of the features that are VALUABLE and appreciated by out customers (Grid pricing showing multiple rates, Corp Rate codes that WORK, Filtering that is helpful, not having sold out properties clog up the display of available properties, and dare I say Statement detail that is.....detailed), but I don't see that happening. Marriott did not have that before, and clearly sees no value...or they don't have the talent to make it happen and will not stoop to engaging SPG programmers help develop it.
Set aside functions that would be useful for a moment.
It looks like we are stuck with a barely functional site that not only cannot provide correct account information (from post 8/18 stays - let alone the completely botched import of account info from legacy SPC accounts), but from many reports here
- Woe to those with an account number that starts with “0”. (And cannot log in)
- Cannot add Account Number to a reservation made is "Guest Mode"
- Incorrect currency for International properties
- Unable to make a straight forward booking (points OR cash).
- Profile information - such as AAA number does not carry over to booking.
- View History from Account Activity returns "General Error" when attempting to log in. But we are to rest assured. they have our data and are transferring it. 3.3 MILLION points missing for one member. Gives new meaning to Earn and BURN.
- CSR's are not empowered/do not have the access to fix things
(imagine how THEY must love coming to work right now) .
- Emails go un-replied to...or are bounced back because of a full mailbox.
- Current year and lifetime status not correct, and in some cases DIFFERENT between the APP and Website.
- Which leads to lack of recognition at check-in
- Which leads to lack of posting of bonus and amenities at check out.
- And the WORST part is..that not everybody has all of the same problems. It's not like xxxx doesn't work - go fix it. xxx is only "half broken" and very unreliable.....for some people.
- It just goes on and on and on, like wiping yourself with a wagon wheel, there ain't nooooooo end to it!
And Marriott Corp is tone deaf and mute. They leave their own people twisting in the wind. God Bless the Lurkers and the front line Reps trying to help people. They are shoveling sand up hill with a broken plastic spoon....in a tornado.
Shame on us for seeing the combined rewards program announced this spring and thinking "Wow, it really looks like they are going to try hard to make this great" We are a bunch of suckers.
Concept was a B+
Execution - not even an F-
How's it going one month in....??? baaaaaahahahahahahahahahahahwawawawawa
Last edited by xzh445; Sep 23, 2018 at 12:44 pm
Sep 21, 2018, 10:48 pm
#65
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Florida
Posts: 29,762
Set aside the radio silence on the communication front, how could a corporate customer service email address could have the "Inbox is full" to bounce customers' emails? As if fail to answer emails is not bad enough... Of all IT failures so far, this "Inbox is full" issue seems the most inexcusable as it is so extremely easy to fix... Just shows how much Marriott cares,
Sep 22, 2018, 9:00 am
#66
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: USA
Programs: MYOB
Posts: 1,292
Set aside the radio silence on the communication front, how could a corporate customer service email address could have the "Inbox is full" to bounce customers' emails? As if fail to answer emails is not bad enough... Of all IT failures so far, this "Inbox is full" issue seems the most inexcusable as it is so extremely easy to fix
You would think. Complete failure..or complete disregard??
Sums it all up.
Sep 22, 2018, 9:43 am
#67
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: LAS
Programs: PA FT, TW Gold, NW/CO PE, VK Eagleflyer
Posts: 7,173
“Marriott will draw upon the very best each program offers and we can’t wait to show the loyal members of these programs the power and benefits of Marriott and Starwood coming together,” said Stephanie Linnartz, Executive Vice President and Global Chief Commercial Officer.”
https://marriott.gcs-web.com/static-...f-39c491a7ebe6
This ham-fisted merger of two disparate cultures demonstrates what happens when marketing BS meets reality
https://marriott.gcs-web.com/static-...f-39c491a7ebe6
This ham-fisted merger of two disparate cultures demonstrates what happens when marketing BS meets reality
Sep 22, 2018, 10:57 am
#68
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: BOS/EAP
Programs: UA 1K, MR LTT, HH Dia, Amex Plat
Posts: 32,052
Moreover, I can't recall an airline merger where the acquiring company recognized the value of elite frequent customers from the airline being acquired, although there could be an argument if you view US as acquiring AA. It doesn't make sense to implicitly pay more for a company due to some particular asset and then proceed to take actions that decrease the value of the asset to you.
Sep 22, 2018, 11:11 am
#69
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Minneapolis: DL DM charter 2.3MM
Programs: A3*Gold, SPG Plat, HyattDiamond, MarriottPP, LHW exAccess, ICI, Raffles Amb, NW PE MM, TWA Gold MM
Posts: 100,413
OT, but I disagree. Upgradeable fares went way up and the website ceased to show upgrade space or permit international upgrades with miles to be confirmed online. People were really upset when they tried to use upgrade certs that didn't clear at the gate only to see nonrevs get the remaining business class seats while top tier elites sat in coach after having paid a very expensive coach fare to be eligible for the upgrade lottery.
In addition, there were features of the PMNW website that DL has *never* implemented, such as doing upgrades online. Another example is the premium seats in business class and FC cabins that were reserved for elites, such as the business class seats in the small upper deck of the old 747-200s with the old FC seats or seats downstairs in the nose of the 747-400s (before flat beds were installed and the reconfigured upper deck became better).
PMNW made folks feel especially appreciated at the end with phantom upgrades, but that was before the merger, and at the initiative of Bob Soukup, the PMNW whatever title in charge of loyalty, who left for a job directing the loyalty program at Best Buy.
In addition, there were features of the PMNW website that DL has *never* implemented, such as doing upgrades online. Another example is the premium seats in business class and FC cabins that were reserved for elites, such as the business class seats in the small upper deck of the old 747-200s with the old FC seats or seats downstairs in the nose of the 747-400s (before flat beds were installed and the reconfigured upper deck became better).
PMNW made folks feel especially appreciated at the end with phantom upgrades, but that was before the merger, and at the initiative of Bob Soukup, the PMNW whatever title in charge of loyalty, who left for a job directing the loyalty program at Best Buy.
Sep 22, 2018, 2:33 pm
#70
Join Date: Feb 2018
Programs: Bonvoy :Ambassador , ALL :Diamond, Skywards :Silver, Krisflyer :Silver
Posts: 2,808
Set aside the radio silence on the communication front, how could a corporate customer service email address could have the "Inbox is full" to bounce customers' emails? As if fail to answer emails is not bad enough... Of all IT failures so far, this "Inbox is full" issue seems the most inexcusable as it is so extremely easy to fix... Just shows how much Marriott cares,
Sep 22, 2018, 2:55 pm
#71
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Somewhere...
Programs: AA PLT/3MM, UA GM/1MM, DL DM/1MM, FB Plat, AS MVP Gold, WN AList+
Posts: 1,588
Not as horrible as some, but not smooth either.
I am still furious at Hilton over tanking mine (and everyone else’s) account in the Blackrock buyout...and both IHG (which I am currently typing from), Accor and Hyatt all have their limitations. IHG already gets 40-50% of my business and Lifetime PE status is still there when it things settle down.
Marriott captives probably do not mind too much, but based on the last month I suspect a lot of Starwood people (of which I am one) are looking, but again all the alternatives have more than a few warts. And, I do NOT trust Hilton! I am still angry about the events from a decade ago...
Sep 22, 2018, 6:43 pm
#72
Join Date: Apr 2005
Programs: Starwood:Lifetime Platinum, Air Canada:Basic, Asiana:Lifetime Diamond Plus, ANA: Basic
Posts: 980
Since we are entering the alleged Century of full rise of China, let me offer some insights of what it would be like had Marriott is a State-owned Enterprise and Marriott members are living within the influence sphere of China's mighty government.
1) When the merge happens, the website would have gone down completely and would have gone down as long as it takes for IT staff to do the work.
2) No points and night credits will earn or redeemed until the site is back on. Meanwhile, you can stay at rival hotels or Marriott/SPG state-owned ones without status recognition and night credits. You should love the hotel for the hard products
3) If you have complains, talk to the wall and if you have anger issues, hit the head against the wall until the anger goes away.
4) Once the new Travel Cert mapping is out, it's final. No one is backing -down. Those dissidents are warned to stop complaints and some famous blogger has his/her account closed with all points/nights removed. Then harmony returns with everyone accepting the new conversion or choose to stay in a different hotel chain.
5) The website comes back on a month later. Those accounts that merging is unsuccessful are asked to keep quiet while problems being fixed. Those who are strong dissidents and famous flyertalkers/celebrities/bloggers are then disappear for 3 months to be reform in jail (like Chinese actress Fan BingBing) for disrupting harmony. Those overseas learn to keep the harmony or else their family members that are living under the sphere of influence would be "inconvenienced".
On the surface, it is all integration is smooth and only positive reviews are being posted.
1) When the merge happens, the website would have gone down completely and would have gone down as long as it takes for IT staff to do the work.
2) No points and night credits will earn or redeemed until the site is back on. Meanwhile, you can stay at rival hotels or Marriott/SPG state-owned ones without status recognition and night credits. You should love the hotel for the hard products
3) If you have complains, talk to the wall and if you have anger issues, hit the head against the wall until the anger goes away.
4) Once the new Travel Cert mapping is out, it's final. No one is backing -down. Those dissidents are warned to stop complaints and some famous blogger has his/her account closed with all points/nights removed. Then harmony returns with everyone accepting the new conversion or choose to stay in a different hotel chain.
5) The website comes back on a month later. Those accounts that merging is unsuccessful are asked to keep quiet while problems being fixed. Those who are strong dissidents and famous flyertalkers/celebrities/bloggers are then disappear for 3 months to be reform in jail (like Chinese actress Fan BingBing) for disrupting harmony. Those overseas learn to keep the harmony or else their family members that are living under the sphere of influence would be "inconvenienced".
On the surface, it is all integration is smooth and only positive reviews are being posted.
Sep 22, 2018, 7:49 pm
#73
Join Date: Apr 2005
Programs: Starwood:Lifetime Platinum, Air Canada:Basic, Asiana:Lifetime Diamond Plus, ANA: Basic
Posts: 980
Back to the main point.
I have been to two legacy SPG hotels post merger to see how integration is going. One is the a Westin Grand in Vancouver. The other Sheraton Hong Kong.
Both hotel is me showing up without my ambassador giving any hints on any upgrades or any special requests. Both hotels I have stayed with over a decade. Both hotels I got to see the manager came to say "hi" and small chat. Staff did say they are having difficulties learning the new system and recognizing the so many different Platinum levels. Perhaps next year, SPG/Marriott can come up with better names for the various status. Neither hotel manager heard about Marriott Five Star status but they know those with "ambassadors" are on the top and asked why my "personal assistant" (Sheraton HK), "personal concierge" (Westin Grand) didn't put anything in. I assume those terms are just interchangeable.
Compare to my pre-merger experience...
The Westin Grand gave me a suite on a high floor- the suite is normal because it is a all-suite hotel. The suite I got was is the biggest suite on that floor according to the emergency exit map posted on the door. It is comparable to similar suites I had stayed in this hotel through my decade. So there was no downgrade. As a rare thing, I ordered in room breakfast because I had a serious licensing exam to go to. The quality of breakfast was ok. Nothing improved, nothing amazing and overall ok.
I was also at the Sheraton Hong Kong during the week of typhoon Mangkhut. I was there for a family funeral so I have a room with two beds in case extended family from China needed to use the room for the night. In the back of my mind, I had this childhood memory where I walked with my dad and there was this red carpet and staff lined up on both sides and my dad walked in both sides did a 90 degree bow and says "welcome boss Yeung". It was as cringe worthy as seeing those Chinese tourist in Sweden making fake falling onto the ground and accusing Swedish police of brutality. I keep thinking hotel manager might pull small version of such prank like that on me. Luckily, the manager greets me apologize that the situation of the hotel was really full. I jokingly asked about the penthouse and it was taken by paid guest. He reminds me that National Day of communist China is coming up so it was "being used". I told him they got it easy. The hotels in China will get a visit by officials each quarter to "have some tea" and you would have prepared your quarterly white envelope stuffed with cash. How else are can party members afford to send party children to North America to study on government employee salary. Money don't grow on trees. For the first time ever, I was assigned a partial ocean-city view corner suite... but it only had one bed. Normally if it is a suite in previous years, it will be a suite overlooking the city (ie no Ocean view). I returned to the front desk and I politely explained I was here for a funeral and may have relatives in China that may need an extra bed. So they... ahem.... swamped future customers to my suite and downgraded me my usual full ocean view room that I normally enjoy.
Breakfast was still at the Cafe. Nothing much change there - the coffee cups got smaller. It only meant I needed more refills. Kudos to hotel staff that kept working during the typhoon - strongest in Hong Kong history. I am sure hotel gave them staff sleeping quarters but I can imagine the rooms are nothing like guest rooms... This was one of the very rare times I accept paying the extraordinary prices of eating simple stuff in the hotel restaurant and accept paying generous service charges- despite having bread and cup noodles in my room to eat during the typhoon. It's my personal way of appreciate those that are serving us even in Hong Kong's worst of times and risk their lives coming to work.
I have been to two legacy SPG hotels post merger to see how integration is going. One is the a Westin Grand in Vancouver. The other Sheraton Hong Kong.
Both hotel is me showing up without my ambassador giving any hints on any upgrades or any special requests. Both hotels I have stayed with over a decade. Both hotels I got to see the manager came to say "hi" and small chat. Staff did say they are having difficulties learning the new system and recognizing the so many different Platinum levels. Perhaps next year, SPG/Marriott can come up with better names for the various status. Neither hotel manager heard about Marriott Five Star status but they know those with "ambassadors" are on the top and asked why my "personal assistant" (Sheraton HK), "personal concierge" (Westin Grand) didn't put anything in. I assume those terms are just interchangeable.
Compare to my pre-merger experience...
The Westin Grand gave me a suite on a high floor- the suite is normal because it is a all-suite hotel. The suite I got was is the biggest suite on that floor according to the emergency exit map posted on the door. It is comparable to similar suites I had stayed in this hotel through my decade. So there was no downgrade. As a rare thing, I ordered in room breakfast because I had a serious licensing exam to go to. The quality of breakfast was ok. Nothing improved, nothing amazing and overall ok.
I was also at the Sheraton Hong Kong during the week of typhoon Mangkhut. I was there for a family funeral so I have a room with two beds in case extended family from China needed to use the room for the night. In the back of my mind, I had this childhood memory where I walked with my dad and there was this red carpet and staff lined up on both sides and my dad walked in both sides did a 90 degree bow and says "welcome boss Yeung". It was as cringe worthy as seeing those Chinese tourist in Sweden making fake falling onto the ground and accusing Swedish police of brutality. I keep thinking hotel manager might pull small version of such prank like that on me. Luckily, the manager greets me apologize that the situation of the hotel was really full. I jokingly asked about the penthouse and it was taken by paid guest. He reminds me that National Day of communist China is coming up so it was "being used". I told him they got it easy. The hotels in China will get a visit by officials each quarter to "have some tea" and you would have prepared your quarterly white envelope stuffed with cash. How else are can party members afford to send party children to North America to study on government employee salary. Money don't grow on trees. For the first time ever, I was assigned a partial ocean-city view corner suite... but it only had one bed. Normally if it is a suite in previous years, it will be a suite overlooking the city (ie no Ocean view). I returned to the front desk and I politely explained I was here for a funeral and may have relatives in China that may need an extra bed. So they... ahem.... swamped future customers to my suite and downgraded me my usual full ocean view room that I normally enjoy.
Breakfast was still at the Cafe. Nothing much change there - the coffee cups got smaller. It only meant I needed more refills. Kudos to hotel staff that kept working during the typhoon - strongest in Hong Kong history. I am sure hotel gave them staff sleeping quarters but I can imagine the rooms are nothing like guest rooms... This was one of the very rare times I accept paying the extraordinary prices of eating simple stuff in the hotel restaurant and accept paying generous service charges- despite having bread and cup noodles in my room to eat during the typhoon. It's my personal way of appreciate those that are serving us even in Hong Kong's worst of times and risk their lives coming to work.
Last edited by yeunganson; Sep 23, 2018 at 8:34 pm
Sep 23, 2018, 3:51 am
#75
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Bangkok
Programs: Marriott Bonvoy Titanium, BAEC Silver, TK Miles & Smiles Elite
Posts: 2,210
Here's a data point.
I stayed Friday night at Ovolo Southside, a Design hotel, and checked out at 11am on Saturday. I confirmed if they had my new SPG/Marriott number and this had been updated in their system but they said they could not see status any more. They are currently relying on memory for the status of previous guests (not that status means much at Design Hotels).
Having checked out yesterday at 11am, the stay posted in my account today, the very next day, at about 2pm. On the app, the stay and points appeared in the account activity but only the YTD points have been added to the running total on the front page. The YTD and lifetime nights have not yet been updated. However... on the web site the stay posted in the account activity, the points were added to the running total and the YTD and lifetime nights have both been updated. Curious IT behaviour but I guess the nights will be on the app by tomorrow.
I stayed Friday night at Ovolo Southside, a Design hotel, and checked out at 11am on Saturday. I confirmed if they had my new SPG/Marriott number and this had been updated in their system but they said they could not see status any more. They are currently relying on memory for the status of previous guests (not that status means much at Design Hotels).
Having checked out yesterday at 11am, the stay posted in my account today, the very next day, at about 2pm. On the app, the stay and points appeared in the account activity but only the YTD points have been added to the running total on the front page. The YTD and lifetime nights have not yet been updated. However... on the web site the stay posted in the account activity, the points were added to the running total and the YTD and lifetime nights have both been updated. Curious IT behaviour but I guess the nights will be on the app by tomorrow.