Issues involving foreign exchange conversion rates
Dec 5, 2011, 8:04 pm
#106
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I have done ~500 credit card transactions on BankCom terminals over the past year, and have yet to figure out a workaround that doesn't entail using a different terminal (which may or may not be available). As such, I am forced to conclude that it is about as mandatory as it gets.
Dec 5, 2011, 8:24 pm
#107
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easy, just say "no" to signing off on a credit card charge if other then in RMB
I have done ~500 credit card transactions on BankCom terminals over the past year, and have yet to figure out a workaround that doesn't entail using a different terminal (which may or may not be available). As such, I am forced to conclude that it is about as mandatory as it gets.
Dec 5, 2011, 8:35 pm
#108
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,762
There is no such thing as mandatory DCC. If you attempt to tell them to void the transaction and they refuse to do so, write local currency not offered, circle the amount in local currency, cross out the amount in your currency and then dispute the charge. Your bank MUST charge it back through the visa/mc system as it clearly says that dcc can only be carried out on those who choose to allow themselves to be scammed this way.
Dec 5, 2011, 8:48 pm
#109
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There is no such thing as mandatory DCC. If you attempt to tell them to void the transaction and they refuse to do so, write local currency not offered, circle the amount in local currency, cross out the amount in your currency and then dispute the charge. Your bank MUST charge it back through the visa/mc system as it clearly says that dcc can only be carried out on those who choose to allow themselves to be scammed this way.
In order to dispute, one needs:
-to scan or mail the receipts
-develop a spreadsheet showing amount charged and the amount you should have been charged (based on WSJ rates)
This drill requires lots of TIME.
If you have more to contribute to this topic (especially if you know how to defeat BankCom's thermal slip terminals), I suggest you head to the DCC thread.
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/china...onversion.html
Dec 6, 2011, 12:11 am
#110
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I did..........
If you have more to contribute to this topic (especially if you know how to defeat BankCom's thermal slip terminals), I suggest you head to the DCC thread.
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/china...onversion.html
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/china...onversion.html
Dec 6, 2011, 12:22 am
#111
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In my case, as I had stricken through the "conversion" before I signed the invoice reconciliation, there was no way they could seriously contend I had agreed. I suspect, though, that anyone who signed the reconciliation without striking through the bogus conversion could be argued to have consented.
When no correction appeared after about a week, I again contacted Courtyard and this time they wanted me to write to the company (in Ireland, as I recall) that processed their currency conversion for them and submit all sorts of documents.
For the first time, they informed me of the details of their currency conversion "feature" -- they applied a currency exchange rate (did not specify where it came from), added 3%, and charged that against my card. They didn't care whether my card also charged 3% for foreign transactions or not -- indeed, they explicitly said that they didn't care and wouldn't refund that money. The only thing they would do is to refund any excess on the currency conversion (but not the 3% conversion fee), but only if I sent them all sorts of documentation including a charge on the same card on the same day that didn't go through them, and even then they would only refund the excess they had charged over the conversion rate charged in the other transaction (so maybe 1% of the charge).
I declined to go through that process, as I had never agreed to it, and after some further exchanges with the hotel (in one of which I had to point out that I suspected German law considered the Euro to be legal tender unless otherwise agreed between the parties to the transaction, and I had never agreed to pay anything other than Euros), the Courtyard agreed that participation in their conversion program was voluntary and posted a refund to my credit card account. So ultimately I was satisfied with the result.
For the first time, they informed me of the details of their currency conversion "feature" -- they applied a currency exchange rate (did not specify where it came from), added 3%, and charged that against my card. They didn't care whether my card also charged 3% for foreign transactions or not -- indeed, they explicitly said that they didn't care and wouldn't refund that money. The only thing they would do is to refund any excess on the currency conversion (but not the 3% conversion fee), but only if I sent them all sorts of documentation including a charge on the same card on the same day that didn't go through them, and even then they would only refund the excess they had charged over the conversion rate charged in the other transaction (so maybe 1% of the charge).
I declined to go through that process, as I had never agreed to it, and after some further exchanges with the hotel (in one of which I had to point out that I suspected German law considered the Euro to be legal tender unless otherwise agreed between the parties to the transaction, and I had never agreed to pay anything other than Euros), the Courtyard agreed that participation in their conversion program was voluntary and posted a refund to my credit card account. So ultimately I was satisfied with the result.
Here is what I do if they pull this scam on me and refuse to void the transacton, not credit it. I circle the local currency amount. cross out the statement that I accept the conversion as final and write local currency not offered. I then will most assuredly dispute the bill and insist on a charge back If people began to do this, it might slow this cancer down.
But the Chinese banks just changed their firmware http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/china...on-33.html#488
Disputing is pointless cos it impacts the wrong company. We find that most issuers don't fight with the culpable acquirers. They just eat the charge.
Voiding does some damage to the merchant and acquirer involved, not to mention lost business.
Same was asked upon checkout at Marriott SkyCity Hong Kong Airport.
The lady at the counter asked what my preference was for the final charge: a currency conversion direct to USD or no conversion Hong Kong Dollars. I asked to be charged in HK Dollars and she checked as such. On the bill given back to me, a typed 'X' was present on the HKD.
The lady at the counter asked what my preference was for the final charge: a currency conversion direct to USD or no conversion Hong Kong Dollars. I asked to be charged in HK Dollars and she checked as such. On the bill given back to me, a typed 'X' was present on the HKD.
Sadly, on my return trip to Taiwan in Sep 11, Global Payments has gone non-optional http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/catha...k-79.html#1180
There is no such thing as mandatory DCC. If you attempt to tell them to void the transaction and they refuse to do so, write local currency not offered, circle the amount in local currency, cross out the amount in your currency and then dispute the charge. Your bank MUST charge it back through the visa/mc system as it clearly says that dcc can only be carried out on those who choose to allow themselves to be scammed this way.
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/china...ion-8.html#114
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/china...on-33.html#488
When they presented the receipt in the morning it had DCC with the usual rip off rate. I got all the standard lies . "The bank makes us do it", "it's not us it's the bank" "It's the standard exchange rate" etc etc etc. I do have some advantages. I speak German and I've taught law and technology in Germany and the USA. My German lawyer lives only a few miles away. After listening to Hotelier crap for 10 minutes I suggested calling the criminal police and making it a police matter. They quickly refunded the charge and I paid cash.
Last edited by percysmith; Dec 7, 2011 at 1:03 am
Jun 20, 2014, 5:40 am
#112
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Just had this happen at Renaissance Beijing Capital City. Took 25 minutes to sort it out. The personnel in the Club lounge insisted that the charge would be in local currency even when the dollar amount was clearly show, although much smaller font and the word that there is no commission etc.
They also said that every body else always pays this. I did check and this "no commission" transaction would have cost me exactly 4% compared to the spot rate. Asked to speak with the manger on duty. He was aware of this issue and run it through another POS at the front desk.
Let me repeat. This is nothing more than a SCAM. The hotel will get a kickback from the bank when they are using these inflated rates.
They also said that every body else always pays this. I did check and this "no commission" transaction would have cost me exactly 4% compared to the spot rate. Asked to speak with the manger on duty. He was aware of this issue and run it through another POS at the front desk.
Let me repeat. This is nothing more than a SCAM. The hotel will get a kickback from the bank when they are using these inflated rates.
Just tell them to hit the cancel button after entering amount. If they don't know, request to see the manager.
Usually big chain hotels in Beijing use BoC terminals. They all have this feature to opt-out, as a "compliance" to Visa/MC rules...
Aug 13, 2014, 11:11 am
#113
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 4,975
Renaissance Amsterdam questionable billing practices
Be careful when staying here and paying your bill. I have stayed here many times without issue but this past stay the hotel left invoiced in Euros but charged me in USD. This led to around 3-5% higher charge. When I inquired they claimed that I had only been billed in euros but my credit card company confirmed they charged in USD.
After multiple exchanges with the hotel they refunded the difference but kept saying this was a miscommunication and not a mistake. I never authorized them to charge in USD and was never given a bill or invoice in USD.
I suspect this is not a one off instance. Just a reminder to check your credit card statements carefully.
After multiple exchanges with the hotel they refunded the difference but kept saying this was a miscommunication and not a mistake. I never authorized them to charge in USD and was never given a bill or invoice in USD.
I suspect this is not a one off instance. Just a reminder to check your credit card statements carefully.
Aug 13, 2014, 11:56 am
#114
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 3,643
Contest the excess charge through your credit card. I have success doing this in cases where Dynamic Currency Conversion was used without my approval. You may need to review what you signed to make sure your receipt did not somehow include authorization of the conversion.
Aug 13, 2014, 12:03 pm
#115
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Aug 13, 2014, 12:09 pm
#116
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Be careful when staying here and paying your bill. I have stayed here many times without issue but this past stay the hotel left invoiced in Euros but charged me in USD. This led to around 3-5% higher charge. When I inquired they claimed that I had only been billed in euros but my credit card company confirmed they charged in USD.
After multiple exchanges with the hotel they refunded the difference but kept saying this was a miscommunication and not a mistake. I never authorized them to charge in USD and was never given a bill or invoice in USD.
I suspect this is not a one off instance. Just a reminder to check your credit card statements carefully.
After multiple exchanges with the hotel they refunded the difference but kept saying this was a miscommunication and not a mistake. I never authorized them to charge in USD and was never given a bill or invoice in USD.
I suspect this is not a one off instance. Just a reminder to check your credit card statements carefully.
When I stayed at this property this past spring and questioned the practice that is absolutely NEVER beneficial for the consumer, I was told that it was mandated by the new GM.
My advise is to leave unfavorable rating on TripAdvisor with remarks that the hotel is scamming their guests by using DCC without their approval.
Aug 13, 2014, 12:17 pm
#117
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If it's happened more than once I agree w/ you it's not a miscommunication.
Cheers.
Cheers.
Aug 13, 2014, 12:29 pm
#118
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 4,975
I was trying to say that while this has not happened to me before I am guessing that the hotel does this to many of its guests. I am going to also complain directly to Marriott corporate as this is a total scam.
Aug 13, 2014, 12:40 pm
#119
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delete
Aug 13, 2014, 5:45 pm
#120
Join Date: Mar 2007
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Love it that when you complain to the corporate they just fwd the email to the hotel.