Marriott baited and switched us on the upgrade policy
Sep 5, 2018, 11:52 am
#61
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 573
I have been old Platinum at Marriott for many years (10 years according to the new "years tracker" on Marriott.com). I have stayed mostly in Europe and the US. Marriott rarely upgrades to a legitimate suite. At hotels with many room types (older, urban properties), I often get a corner room or perhaps a "junior suite" which is really just a larger guest room. I can count on two hands the number of times I have been upgraded to a legitimate two-room (or more) suite. I would estimate around 10 stays among 700+ nights.Most of my upgrades have been simply to the club floor -- like 80%+ of my stays.
I have stayed mostly in Europe and Asia. If this will change I will switch my stays to Hilton and Hyatt where as my past experience as top tiers was near simmilar to SPG upgrades.
Sep 5, 2018, 12:44 pm
#62
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: CLT
Programs: Marriott Plat, AA Gold
Posts: 1,076
This may not be what legacy SPG members want to hear, but the following has been my experience.
I have been old Platinum at Marriott for many years (10 years according to the new "years tracker" on Marriott.com). I have stayed mostly in Europe and the US. Marriott rarely upgrades to a legitimate suite. At hotels with many room types (older, urban properties), I often get a corner room or perhaps a "junior suite" which is really just a larger guest room. I can count on two hands the number of times I have been upgraded to a legitimate two-room (or more) suite. I would estimate around 10 stays among 700+ nights.
Most of my upgrades have been simply to the club floor -- like 80%+ of my stays. That is what Marriott has long considered a satisfactory upgrade for a Platinum member in its own program. At the great majority of full-service US properties, there are fewer than a dozen suites. The suite-heavy hotels are mostly historic properties, and that property type is a small subset of Marriott/ JW/ Renaissance properties. If you want a specific non-suite room, say a corner room with a particular view, you can add that in the notes, but true suite upgrades have always been vanishingly rare.
I have been old Platinum at Marriott for many years (10 years according to the new "years tracker" on Marriott.com). I have stayed mostly in Europe and the US. Marriott rarely upgrades to a legitimate suite. At hotels with many room types (older, urban properties), I often get a corner room or perhaps a "junior suite" which is really just a larger guest room. I can count on two hands the number of times I have been upgraded to a legitimate two-room (or more) suite. I would estimate around 10 stays among 700+ nights.
Most of my upgrades have been simply to the club floor -- like 80%+ of my stays. That is what Marriott has long considered a satisfactory upgrade for a Platinum member in its own program. At the great majority of full-service US properties, there are fewer than a dozen suites. The suite-heavy hotels are mostly historic properties, and that property type is a small subset of Marriott/ JW/ Renaissance properties. If you want a specific non-suite room, say a corner room with a particular view, you can add that in the notes, but true suite upgrades have always been vanishingly rare.
To use MSPeconomist’s terms, I usually would get “enhanced” rooms, but only occasionally truly upgraded rooms. The secret to having a better chance at upgrades at Marriott in the past seemed to be to clearly ask for them.
Sep 5, 2018, 12:58 pm
#63
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: TUL
Programs: AA EXP 2MM; Marriott Titanium; Hilton Diamond; Hyatt Explorist; Vistana 5* Elite; Nat'l Exec Elite
Posts: 6,177
And where do I find these "notes"? I regularly used such with the previous Starwood booking engine but I do not find that ability with the Marriott site.
Sep 5, 2018, 2:24 pm
#64
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: HEL
Programs: SPG LTP, hotels, OWE, STE+, *G, Octopus
Posts: 5,787
That's interesting. I status matched with both to Diamond a couple of years ago, and was disappointed not to receive a single suite upgrade from either one in either Europe or Asia. I'm clearly not the right fit for spg's new owner, but I haven't found anything close to spg so far.
Sep 5, 2018, 2:52 pm
#65
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Toronto
Programs: UA 1K, AC MM E75, Marriott LT Ti, IHG Dia Amb, Hyatt Glob
Posts: 15,521
This may not be what legacy SPG members want to hear, but the following has been my experience.
I have been old Platinum at Marriott for many years (10 years according to the new "years tracker" on Marriott.com). I have stayed mostly in Europe and the US. Marriott rarely upgrades to a legitimate suite. At hotels with many room types (older, urban properties), I often get a corner room or perhaps a "junior suite" which is really just a larger guest room. I can count on two hands the number of times I have been upgraded to a legitimate two-room (or more) suite. I would estimate around 10 stays among 700+ nights.
Most of my upgrades have been simply to the club floor -- like 80%+ of my stays. That is what Marriott has long considered a satisfactory upgrade for a Platinum member in its own program. At the great majority of full-service US properties, there are fewer than a dozen suites. The suite-heavy hotels are mostly historic properties, and that property type is a small subset of Marriott/ JW/ Renaissance properties. If you want a specific non-suite room, say a corner room with a particular view, you can add that in the notes, but true suite upgrades have always been vanishingly rare.
I have been old Platinum at Marriott for many years (10 years according to the new "years tracker" on Marriott.com). I have stayed mostly in Europe and the US. Marriott rarely upgrades to a legitimate suite. At hotels with many room types (older, urban properties), I often get a corner room or perhaps a "junior suite" which is really just a larger guest room. I can count on two hands the number of times I have been upgraded to a legitimate two-room (or more) suite. I would estimate around 10 stays among 700+ nights.
Most of my upgrades have been simply to the club floor -- like 80%+ of my stays. That is what Marriott has long considered a satisfactory upgrade for a Platinum member in its own program. At the great majority of full-service US properties, there are fewer than a dozen suites. The suite-heavy hotels are mostly historic properties, and that property type is a small subset of Marriott/ JW/ Renaissance properties. If you want a specific non-suite room, say a corner room with a particular view, you can add that in the notes, but true suite upgrades have always been vanishingly rare.
I wonder if any long time Marriott members will be saying "Wow, wish I had switched to SPG years ago". (I did 12 yrs ago after accumulating 300+ nights at Marriott and have never looked back.) What remains to be seen is whether Marriott brings legacy Starwood properties down to its level. And if they don't, we might see a huge influx of legacy Marriott Plats thus reducing the number of suite upgrades for everyone. Guess we can't win.
Sep 5, 2018, 5:46 pm
#66
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: SNA
Programs: Bonvoy LTTE/AMB, AmEx Plat, National EE, WN A-List, CLEAR+, Covid-19
Posts: 4,967
Don't ... while I don't stay (at least on paid travel) in some of the higher-end properties that SPG apparently has more of, I've been upgraded (and to some seriously nice spaces) in my time as a Plat in MR fairly often. Sure, sometimes it's just a Junior Suite in an FI (which do exist, I was surprised to find out, and fairly spacious) and sometimes it's the Presidential suite in an FS- but I was with MR vs. SPG due to availability and price (which was very important as I almost never traveled on OPM) and that's the world I knew.
But YMMV, and I am a little concerned at how this new influx of members (on both sides of the aisle toward the middle) will affect the attitudes and availability of properties.
But YMMV, and I am a little concerned at how this new influx of members (on both sides of the aisle toward the middle) will affect the attitudes and availability of properties.
Sep 5, 2018, 6:44 pm
#67
Join Date: Jan 2017
Programs: Marriott Lifetime Titanium, Hyatt Globalist
Posts: 2,200
Coming from SPG side... historically in Asia, Middle East and Africa I have a 90% suite upgrade rate. Full suite. And often upgraded far above to a specialty suite.
I don't want to say 100% SPG upgrades, but I frankly can't remember a time I was not upgraded to a suite or a property like SGS moved me to a suite when one opened up. In Europe I also have had a majority hit rate. I
n US, only about a 20% suite upgrade rate... but frankly the US suites were not particularly good anyway except for Westin in San Diego where they gave me a 2 story room and this giant spot in Seattle but I forget which property. And there are so many more plats in US competing for upgrades... while in Asia because of relatively new program and lack of property development, and no credit cards, it is relatively rarer to get a plat and many properties have told me I was their first or first in months LTP.
So I have been worried greatly about Marriott's wording as suites to me are more important than Club Lounge in most cases.
So far in 2018:
Asia:
Legacy SPG: upgraded suites 100%.
Legacy Marriott: upgraded to a full suite every time except once.
Europe:
Legacy SPG: no suite but great views and GM clearly went out of his way for me
Legacy Marriott: suite
US:
SPG: no suites
Marriott: no suites
I have Africa and Australia coming up and will report back to you.
My plan? In the US, I will expect little in terms of suites in both SPG and Marriott props as they never really gave much anyway... and analyze which props have a fair # of suites in other locales as it seems Marriott will give suites if they have them... but I think I have read that SPG props tended to have more suites.
So from my experience so far, legacy Marriotts do upgrade to suite when they have availability. However, the SPG ones tended to auto upgrade (that might be because they saw my profile and spending better pre Aug 18) while I had to ask nicely at Marriott spots every time when I checked in and FD magically found a spot.
The suite thing is actually a big deal for me, as well as breakfast. Lounge is nice but not a deal breaker for me. Neither is 4pm and other benefits like point earning.
If I find the breakfast become bad/ devalued, esp in Asia, and if suites in Asia don't keep coming, I will spend more time at other chains. Might become time to pony up for Mandarin Oriental and Peninsula more often.
I don't want to say 100% SPG upgrades, but I frankly can't remember a time I was not upgraded to a suite or a property like SGS moved me to a suite when one opened up. In Europe I also have had a majority hit rate. I
n US, only about a 20% suite upgrade rate... but frankly the US suites were not particularly good anyway except for Westin in San Diego where they gave me a 2 story room and this giant spot in Seattle but I forget which property. And there are so many more plats in US competing for upgrades... while in Asia because of relatively new program and lack of property development, and no credit cards, it is relatively rarer to get a plat and many properties have told me I was their first or first in months LTP.
So I have been worried greatly about Marriott's wording as suites to me are more important than Club Lounge in most cases.
So far in 2018:
Asia:
Legacy SPG: upgraded suites 100%.
Legacy Marriott: upgraded to a full suite every time except once.
Europe:
Legacy SPG: no suite but great views and GM clearly went out of his way for me
Legacy Marriott: suite
US:
SPG: no suites
Marriott: no suites
I have Africa and Australia coming up and will report back to you.
My plan? In the US, I will expect little in terms of suites in both SPG and Marriott props as they never really gave much anyway... and analyze which props have a fair # of suites in other locales as it seems Marriott will give suites if they have them... but I think I have read that SPG props tended to have more suites.
So from my experience so far, legacy Marriotts do upgrade to suite when they have availability. However, the SPG ones tended to auto upgrade (that might be because they saw my profile and spending better pre Aug 18) while I had to ask nicely at Marriott spots every time when I checked in and FD magically found a spot.
The suite thing is actually a big deal for me, as well as breakfast. Lounge is nice but not a deal breaker for me. Neither is 4pm and other benefits like point earning.
If I find the breakfast become bad/ devalued, esp in Asia, and if suites in Asia don't keep coming, I will spend more time at other chains. Might become time to pony up for Mandarin Oriental and Peninsula more often.
Sep 5, 2018, 7:24 pm
#68
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: SG
Programs: Marriott Plat Amb, oneworld Ruby
Posts: 132
Coming from SPG side... historically in Asia, Middle East and Africa I have a 90% suite upgrade rate. Full suite. And often upgraded far above to a specialty suite.
I don't want to say 100% SPG upgrades, but I frankly can't remember a time I was not upgraded to a suite or a property like SGS moved me to a suite when one opened up. In Europe I also have had a majority hit rate. I
n US, only about a 20% suite upgrade rate... but frankly the US suites were not particularly good anyway except for Westin in San Diego where they gave me a 2 story room and this giant spot in Seattle but I forget which property. And there are so many more plats in US competing for upgrades... while in Asia because of relatively new program and lack of property development, and no credit cards, it is relatively rarer to get a plat and many properties have told me I was their first or first in months LTP.
So I have been worried greatly about Marriott's wording as suites to me are more important than Club Lounge in most cases.
So far in 2018:
Asia:
Legacy SPG: upgraded suites 100%.
Legacy Marriott: upgraded to a full suite every time except once.
Europe:
Legacy SPG: no suite but great views and GM clearly went out of his way for me
Legacy Marriott: suite
US:
SPG: no suites
Marriott: no suites
I have Africa and Australia coming up and will report back to you.
My plan? In the US, I will expect little in terms of suites in both SPG and Marriott props as they never really gave much anyway... and analyze which props have a fair # of suites in other locales as it seems Marriott will give suites if they have them... but I think I have read that SPG props tended to have more suites.
So from my experience so far, legacy Marriotts do upgrade to suite when they have availability. However, the SPG ones tended to auto upgrade (that might be because they saw my profile and spending better pre Aug 18) while I had to ask nicely at Marriott spots every time when I checked in and FD magically found a spot.
The suite thing is actually a big deal for me, as well as breakfast. Lounge is nice but not a deal breaker for me. Neither is 4pm and other benefits like point earning.
If I find the breakfast become bad/ devalued, esp in Asia, and if suites in Asia don't keep coming, I will spend more time at other chains. Might become time to pony up for Mandarin Oriental and Peninsula more often.
I don't want to say 100% SPG upgrades, but I frankly can't remember a time I was not upgraded to a suite or a property like SGS moved me to a suite when one opened up. In Europe I also have had a majority hit rate. I
n US, only about a 20% suite upgrade rate... but frankly the US suites were not particularly good anyway except for Westin in San Diego where they gave me a 2 story room and this giant spot in Seattle but I forget which property. And there are so many more plats in US competing for upgrades... while in Asia because of relatively new program and lack of property development, and no credit cards, it is relatively rarer to get a plat and many properties have told me I was their first or first in months LTP.
So I have been worried greatly about Marriott's wording as suites to me are more important than Club Lounge in most cases.
So far in 2018:
Asia:
Legacy SPG: upgraded suites 100%.
Legacy Marriott: upgraded to a full suite every time except once.
Europe:
Legacy SPG: no suite but great views and GM clearly went out of his way for me
Legacy Marriott: suite
US:
SPG: no suites
Marriott: no suites
I have Africa and Australia coming up and will report back to you.
My plan? In the US, I will expect little in terms of suites in both SPG and Marriott props as they never really gave much anyway... and analyze which props have a fair # of suites in other locales as it seems Marriott will give suites if they have them... but I think I have read that SPG props tended to have more suites.
So from my experience so far, legacy Marriotts do upgrade to suite when they have availability. However, the SPG ones tended to auto upgrade (that might be because they saw my profile and spending better pre Aug 18) while I had to ask nicely at Marriott spots every time when I checked in and FD magically found a spot.
The suite thing is actually a big deal for me, as well as breakfast. Lounge is nice but not a deal breaker for me. Neither is 4pm and other benefits like point earning.
If I find the breakfast become bad/ devalued, esp in Asia, and if suites in Asia don't keep coming, I will spend more time at other chains. Might become time to pony up for Mandarin Oriental and Peninsula more often.
However, my 2018 upgrade percentage for points-only award stays in the region is zero, across a sample of three legacy SPG hotels and one legacy Marriott. Confirmed that suites were in fact available during that period but didn't bother complaining as they were one-night stays.
Sep 5, 2018, 9:03 pm
#69
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Pittsburgh
Programs: MR/SPG LT Titanium, AA LT PLT, UA SLV, Avis PreferredPlus
Posts: 31,009
Either they intentionally lied, baited and switched, etc., etc to chase away their best customers and evilly rub their hands together while laughing hysterically at the joy of screwing over those evil SPG customers --- or an error was made.
Occam's Razor.
https://viewfromthewing.boardingarea...416.1527256622
Communicating to/educating legacy Marriott properties could be a challenge, but the terms now match what was committed.
Occam's Razor.
https://viewfromthewing.boardingarea...416.1527256622
Marriott Fixes Program Rules for Suite Upgrades, Platinums Now Entitled to Standard Suites
The new Marriott program’s terms have been updated and they’ve fixed this.
Platinum Elite Members receive a complimentary upgrade to the best available room subject to availability for the entire length of stay at the time of check-in. Complimentary upgrade includes suites, rooms with desirable views, rooms on high floors, corner rooms, rooms with special amenities or rooms on Executive Floors.
The new Marriott program’s terms have been updated and they’ve fixed this.
Platinum Elite Members receive a complimentary upgrade to the best available room subject to availability for the entire length of stay at the time of check-in. Complimentary upgrade includes suites, rooms with desirable views, rooms on high floors, corner rooms, rooms with special amenities or rooms on Executive Floors.
Sep 5, 2018, 9:24 pm
#70
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: SLC/HEL/Anywhere with a Beach
Programs: Marriott Ambassador; AA EXP 3MM; AS MVP, Hilton Gold, CH-47/UH-60/C-23/C-130 VET
Posts: 5,234
And ... it all comes down to the hotel GM on how they are applying the upgrade policy. In only rare circumstances, is that GM employed by Marriott. Rather they are employed by a company with a franchise to operate the hotel. Some GM's see keeping their best 10-20 percent of guests happy as important to the success of the property and assume we talk to each other to sell the property. Other GM's see there is some extra housekeeping costs with suites and it disrupts the metrics for how many rooms a housekeeper can clean in a shift. They figure any individual PPE+A will come to their property just once so why does it matter.
This isn't specific to legacy brands.
The Portland Marriott only has six suites but gave me a 1500 square feet suite overlooking the river. The Westin Bonaventure always upgrades plats to suites when available.
In contrast, the Westin Alexandria only upgrades to a couple of rooms they have called "standard suites" even when they have a dozen suites in the 500-600 square feet range that most of us think as ordinary suites. I've stayed at the Stamford Marriott 50 times but they've never upgraded me to one of their suites (they only have a few).
And, yes, upgrades in Asia are much better. Legacy Marriott essentially guaranteed it for plats.
https://www.marriott.com/hotel-promo...ite-upgrade.mi
This isn't specific to legacy brands.
The Portland Marriott only has six suites but gave me a 1500 square feet suite overlooking the river. The Westin Bonaventure always upgrades plats to suites when available.
In contrast, the Westin Alexandria only upgrades to a couple of rooms they have called "standard suites" even when they have a dozen suites in the 500-600 square feet range that most of us think as ordinary suites. I've stayed at the Stamford Marriott 50 times but they've never upgraded me to one of their suites (they only have a few).
And, yes, upgrades in Asia are much better. Legacy Marriott essentially guaranteed it for plats.
https://www.marriott.com/hotel-promo...ite-upgrade.mi
Sep 6, 2018, 10:25 am
#71
Join Date: Feb 2018
Programs: Bonvoy :Ambassador , ALL :Diamond, Skywards :Silver, Krisflyer :Silver
Posts: 2,808
Most of my SPG experience is in Asia and Australia, and I agree about the high rates of suite upgrades especially in Asia.
However, my 2018 upgrade percentage for points-only award stays in the region is zero, across a sample of three legacy SPG hotels and one legacy Marriott. Confirmed that suites were in fact available during that period but didn't bother complaining as they were one-night stays.
However, my 2018 upgrade percentage for points-only award stays in the region is zero, across a sample of three legacy SPG hotels and one legacy Marriott. Confirmed that suites were in fact available during that period but didn't bother complaining as they were one-night stays.
Interestingly, I do get a suite upgrade at The Cosmopolitan.
Sep 8, 2018, 6:11 am
#73
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 10,227
Of all the benefits that are offered the suite upgrade, to me,seems the most useless. What is the benefit of a bigger room over a normal room if I’m staying alone in a room on a business trip? Is it purely a status thing? The lounge access and breakfast benefits at least offer some tangible bonus, i.e. free food and drinks. Why is a larger room important at all?
Sep 8, 2018, 9:46 am
#74
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: May 2001
Location: MSY; 2-time FT Fantasy Football Champ, now in recovery.
Programs: AA lifetime GLD; UA Silver; Marriott LTTE; IHG Plat,
Posts: 14,518
Of all the benefits that are offered the suite upgrade, to me,seems the most useless. What is the benefit of a bigger room over a normal room if I’m staying alone in a room on a business trip? Is it purely a status thing? The lounge access and breakfast benefits at least offer some tangible bonus, i.e. free food and drinks. Why is a larger room important at all?
Sep 8, 2018, 12:17 pm
#75
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Pittsburgh
Programs: MR/SPG LT Titanium, AA LT PLT, UA SLV, Avis PreferredPlus
Posts: 31,009
Yes, if you never have and never will in your life stay in a hotel room other than all by yourself on a business trip, then it's useless for you. Your situation is not universal.
I only bother with suite upgrades with family, but I find them very beneficial at that time. Rather than the smallish rooms at the Palacio del Inka in Cusco last summer, we had two smallish rooms plus a connected living room in between with couches, chairs, a desk, refrigerator, etc.
Having 3 rooms and places to set/lie down rather than 2 rooms with just beds made a big difference with 4 people - far from useless.
This has happened many times, and it certainly makes things more pleasant than just 2 separate rooms in the same hallway.
I only bother with suite upgrades with family, but I find them very beneficial at that time. Rather than the smallish rooms at the Palacio del Inka in Cusco last summer, we had two smallish rooms plus a connected living room in between with couches, chairs, a desk, refrigerator, etc.
Having 3 rooms and places to set/lie down rather than 2 rooms with just beds made a big difference with 4 people - far from useless.
This has happened many times, and it certainly makes things more pleasant than just 2 separate rooms in the same hallway.