Stolen Gift cards in mail room

Old Apr 13, 16, 11:11 am
  #1  
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Stolen Gift cards in mail room

I'm not sure if this is the right place for this inquiry/question.


I purchased FOUR seperate $700 gift cards in late February from american express website using my AMEX SPG business card.

The status of it remained 'processing' for a few weeks so i finally decided to call AMEX and long story short it turned out that UPS delivered them 3 days after my order was placed. I live in an apartment building in manhattan and the tracking info provided by UPS states that it was "SIGNED BY: MAIL ROOM"

two days after the cards were left in mail room, they were unloaded at a MACY's and all funds were stolen.

What is my next move? i called the gift card department and they said since the funds have already been drained that i need to dispute it with my Credit card company....so i did that....and 2 weeks later i got an email this morning saying :

""""We previously let you know that we might rebill your account if we received sufficient support from the Merchant. Credit(s) for $2,800.00 was issued to the above referenced account.

We have now received support/explanation of the charge(s) and a copy of the supporting information is attached/explained. Due to this response, we have removed our previously issued credit(s) and rebilled your account for $2,800.00. You'll see the debit(s) reflected on an upcoming billing statement.

If after reviewing this information you still feel credit is due, please notify us so that we may resume our investigation. We appreciate your cooperation in helping us to resolve this matter to your satisfaction and apologize for any inconvenience this may have caused. If we can be of further assistance, please call the toll-free telephone number on your billing statement and speak with a Customer Service Representative."""""


I never uploaded any documents online or received any calls from the dispute department to hear my side of the story...it seems as though they decided that since UPS shows the package delivered to my mail room that I got it...which is wrong.


Is this scenario something that justifies a dispute with my credit card company? or am i SOL ?
bc1549 is offline  
Old Apr 13, 16, 11:23 am
  #2  
 
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This is what I am scared about with AMEX GC also. They come in the mail/UPS, etc, and is already activated. So anybody could use it if they take your mail.

Good luck to you. Hopefully AMEX will help you out.

I always track my delivery. I have UPS mychoice, so they let me know when my package is coming, etc.
sosamo is offline  
Old Apr 13, 16, 11:25 am
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Amex upheld their end of things - your dispute is with your mail room.

I'd be having a conversation with the building management and be asking them how THEY plan to fix this. Macy's can likely provide images off a security camera to show who made the purchase.
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Old Apr 13, 16, 11:33 am
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Originally Posted by bc1549 View Post
I'm not sure if this is the right place for this inquiry/question.


I purchased FOUR seperate $700 gift cards in late February from american express website using my AMEX SPG business card.

The status of it remained 'processing' for a few weeks so i finally decided to call AMEX and long story short it turned out that UPS delivered them 3 days after my order was placed. I live in an apartment building in manhattan and the tracking info provided by UPS states that it was "SIGNED BY: MAIL ROOM"

two days after the cards were left in mail room, they were unloaded at a MACY's and all funds were stolen.

What is my next move? i called the gift card department and they said since the funds have already been drained that i need to dispute it with my Credit card company....so i did that....and 2 weeks later i got an email this morning saying :

""""We previously let you know that we might rebill your account if we received sufficient support from the Merchant. Credit(s) for $2,800.00 was issued to the above referenced account.

We have now received support/explanation of the charge(s) and a copy of the supporting information is attached/explained. Due to this response, we have removed our previously issued credit(s) and rebilled your account for $2,800.00. You'll see the debit(s) reflected on an upcoming billing statement.

If after reviewing this information you still feel credit is due, please notify us so that we may resume our investigation. We appreciate your cooperation in helping us to resolve this matter to your satisfaction and apologize for any inconvenience this may have caused. If we can be of further assistance, please call the toll-free telephone number on your billing statement and speak with a Customer Service Representative."""""


I never uploaded any documents online or received any calls from the dispute department to hear my side of the story...it seems as though they decided that since UPS shows the package delivered to my mail room that I got it...which is wrong.


Is this scenario something that justifies a dispute with my credit card company? or am i SOL ?
Was this Chase? I had exactly the same response myself. We ordered a $5,000 piece of equipment for our store last June. The equipment never worked and, after months of working with the manufacturer (they kept promising software updates, new parts, 'we're working on it', etc) they finally told us just to send it back and they would refund me. We sent it back in Dec. (proof of FedEx delivery) but no refund. Disputed with Chase and they came back last week saying we needed to take the machine and get a second opinion from another source who can examine the machine and attest that it does not work. They don't seem to understand that is impossible as the manufacturer has both the machine and my money. They acknowledge that the only way I can win the dispute is to provide this document and they acknowledge that this document is impossible to provide as we no longer have the merchandise but they give me no way out of this Catch-22. So last week, they re-debited the amount as I am unable to provide the second opinion and I am now out $5,000 with my only recourse SCC. Could have saved myself 5 months. Thanks, Chase!

I guess my point is, Chase isn't going to help you. They suck. What does your mail room say happened to the package?
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Old Apr 13, 16, 11:39 am
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$2.8K is too much for anyone to just let go without a fight. If I were you, I'd do my own investigation on whoever got your package from the 'mail room'. Are there CCTVs in there that you can use as proof of whoever took your package? I've read of similar stories from those who live in apartment complexes where others picked up someone's package(s). This is what I dread about ordering amex GCs, IME there were several times they were left at my door sitting there for possibly hours till I got home. From then on, I subscribed to MyUPS to get alerts for scheduled deliveries of packages to my address. I have quit buying am3x GCs since portals stopped giving CBs for them.

Another thing you can do is find out the exact location of b&m Macy's they were used (the thief may or may not have used them online to order stuff and have them delivered to their address which will help you trace him/her/them). You can then report to Macy's about your stolen GCs and the date/time they were used at their store. That is IF AM3X will cooperate with you and provide transaction info when they were used. If the CCTV can show the buyers, that is your proof you were not the one who used the GCs. Without any proof you're not the one who used the GCs, you may be SOL.
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Old Apr 13, 16, 11:39 am
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Originally Posted by Stoughton View Post
Amex upheld their end of things - your dispute is with your mail room.

I'd be having a conversation with the building management and be asking them how THEY plan to fix this.
Agree with the above. Good luck - I have a feeling you're gonna need it.

Originally Posted by Stoughton View Post
Macy's can likely provide images off a security camera to show who made the purchase.
Well, in theory, they may have been able to do that - if they were motivated - back within a few days of the events. At a lot of big stores, you might be disappointed in their willingness to make video available unless they ahve some skin in the game. With the passage of time though, this probably becomes moot - I suspect Macys doesn't archive all their store cam video footage forever...after a few days, it's quite possible that the video footage has been over-written by new data and impossible to recover even if they wanted to. I can easily imagine them taking the "not our problem" position.

I would be extremely reluctant to order a bunch of gift cards delivered by US mail to an unsecure location.

Good luck.
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Old Apr 13, 16, 11:42 am
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this package should of never been left in the mail room. worst case scenario they should of took the elevator up to my apartment door and left it in front of there by UPS.

The cards were used at Macy's. the activity on the cards shows that whoever stole these cards was unsure of the amount on them b/c several $10 and $20 charges were done on the first card until they figured out there was $700 on it and then they drained the remaining three.

This is either the responsiblity of AMEX as fradulent charges to the customer are not liable to me and possibly some blame should be on UPS for leaving it without a signature in an open mail room.
bc1549 is offline  
Old Apr 13, 16, 11:44 am
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Originally Posted by Finkface View Post
Was this Chase? I had exactly the same response myself. We ordered a $5,000 piece of equipment for our store last June. The equipment never worked and, after months of working with the manufacturer (they kept promising software updates, new parts, 'we're working on it', etc) they finally told us just to send it back and they would refund me. We sent it back in Dec. (proof of FedEx delivery) but no refund. Disputed with Chase and they came back last week saying we needed to take the machine and get a second opinion from another source who can examine the machine and attest that it does not work. They don't seem to understand that is impossible as the manufacturer has both the machine and my money. They acknowledge that the only way I can win the dispute is to provide this document and they acknowledge that this document is impossible to provide as we no longer have the merchandise but they give me no way out of this Catch-22. So last week, they re-debited the amount as I am unable to provide the second opinion and I am now out $5,000 with my only recourse SCC. Could have saved myself 5 months. Thanks, Chase!

I guess my point is, Chase isn't going to help you. They suck. What does your mail room say happened to the package?

No, Chase -isn't- going to help

Originally Posted by bc1549 View Post

I purchased FOUR seperate $700 gift cards in late February from american express website using my AMEX SPG business card.
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Old Apr 13, 16, 11:48 am
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why should the burden of proof be on ME to prove that i did NOT receive them? UPS left these cards in an open mail room.

How is this any different than a package getting left in front of somebody's house and a theif walking right up and snatching it ???

I was frequently logging onto the amex gift card site to find out updates on this package and it remained in 'processing' for weeks.
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Old Apr 13, 16, 11:50 am
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Originally Posted by bc1549 View Post
This is either the responsiblity of AMEX as fradulent charges to the customer are not liable to me and possibly some blame should be on UPS for leaving it without a signature in an open mail room.
it won't help you to go on woulda, shoulda, coulda mode

Try going to UPS to see what compensation they can provide, if any. I doubt they will admit responsibility, but for that much, it's worth your time. As to am3x, if you will not proactively find proof it wasn't you that used the GCs, you're likely to lose your $2.8K.
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Old Apr 13, 16, 11:52 am
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Originally Posted by bc1549 View Post
why should the burden of proof be on ME to prove that i did NOT receive them? UPS left these cards in an open mail room.

How is this any different than a package getting left in front of somebody's house and a theif walking right up and snatching it ???

I was frequently logging onto the amex gift card site to find out updates on this package and it remained in 'processing' for weeks.
Is this just an open room or is there someone working in it? Did the package require signature?
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Old Apr 13, 16, 11:54 am
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Originally Posted by Stoughton View Post
Is this just an open room or is there someone working in it? Did the package require signature?


it is just an open room.....anybody who can get through the front door had potential access to it.


And i felt as though this should of been something that the AMEX gift card department would flag as something that required a signature.
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Old Apr 13, 16, 11:55 am
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Originally Posted by bc1549 View Post
this package should of never been left in the mail room. worst case scenario they should of took the elevator up to my apartment door and left it in front of there by UPS.

The cards were used at Macy's. the activity on the cards shows that whoever stole these cards was unsure of the amount on them b/c several $10 and $20 charges were done on the first card until they figured out there was $700 on it and then they drained the remaining three.

This is either the responsiblity of AMEX as fradulent charges to the customer are not liable to me and possibly some blame should be on UPS for leaving it without a signature in an open mail room.
But there wasn't a fraudulent charge - you bought the gift cards, Amex mailed them.

If you ordered anything else online and it was stolen from your residence, would the seller be responsible?
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Old Apr 13, 16, 1:18 pm
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So there is no individual locked mailboxes? Mail for all the tenants are just left in a pile to sort through?

No camera in the room?
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Old Apr 13, 16, 1:18 pm
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Originally Posted by Stoughton View Post
But there wasn't a fraudulent charge - you bought the gift cards, Amex mailed them.

If you ordered anything else online and it was stolen from your residence, would the seller be responsible?
This.

Packages are stolen from people's front porches all the time. It's on the local news constantly.

Amex fulfilled their responsibilities.
UPS fulfilled their responsibilities.
Macy's fulfilled their responsibilities.

All of MS involves some risk. Some of it involves more risk.

I'd say that ordering something worth $2800 (anything - in this case it was Amex gift cards, but it could have been a diamond ring) and having that left on your doorstep in an area where anyone could grab it, is very, very risky.

At this point, this may simply be a police matter. Something was stolen from your (widely open) mail room. I don't know about where you live, but where I live, if I called the police and told them I ordered something online, UPS delivered it, but it was stolen from my doorstep, they would tell me to go file a form online to report the theft, and then I would probably never hear from them (they don't investigate minor property crimes).

You can try UPS, but I doubt they will do anything - they did what they were told, deliver a parcel. The seller didn't tell them to require a signature. If you go to Amex, they will probably tell you that you should have chosen a more secure delivery option - they did what you asked them to: send you something.

It sucks, but I don't think UPS, Amex, Macys, or your apartment building is likely to do much for you here.
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