LHs strategy: discussion thread for customers, investors, consultants & armchair CEOs
Oct 25, 2015, 5:44 pm
#2223
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A lot of "aviation enthusiasts" like flying in the nose of a 747 in F (in some seats you're actually ahead of the pilots), which you could not do in LH's 744s. So I suspect Lufthansa will do just fine without their 744s, without your endorsement as an "aviation enthusiast", and with an F seat that's pretty solid compared to competitors.
Oct 25, 2015, 6:07 pm
#2224
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Oct 25, 2015, 9:10 pm
#2225
Join Date: Oct 2015
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LH never had their new 744 product "on 90% of their routes".
A lot of "aviation enthusiasts" like flying in the nose of a 747 in F (in some seats you're actually ahead of the pilots), which you could not do in LH's 744s. So I suspect Lufthansa will do just fine without their 744s, without your endorsement as an "aviation enthusiast", and with an F seat that's pretty solid compared to competitors.
A lot of "aviation enthusiasts" like flying in the nose of a 747 in F (in some seats you're actually ahead of the pilots), which you could not do in LH's 744s. So I suspect Lufthansa will do just fine without their 744s, without your endorsement as an "aviation enthusiast", and with an F seat that's pretty solid compared to competitors.
Oct 25, 2015, 9:12 pm
#2226
Join Date: Oct 2015
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What makes you say that? I have had quite a bit of experience in it, (even the old First in the A330 was quite nice) and hope to have a little bit more and I can surely say when they had it available it WAS top notch! The problem is that Lufthansa are removing ALL First Class from nearly all their routes! If you want to go to Dubai, Vancouver, Seattle, or any 744 A343 or most A346 routes, you cannot fly any First!
Oct 25, 2015, 10:40 pm
#2227
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Well the problem with their "temporary arrangement" is that it was so good it should have been permanent! It was very private, and very comfortable. It could have been an amazing selling point for Lufthansa! How many airlines can proudly be flashing on their ads "get a seat AND a bed when you fly First!) NONE! If I was in charge of this, I would take out the A340 600s first class instead, seeing as does appear to be more expensive to fly, and its first is nothing unique. Back to the point, how do they expect to become "5 star" airline if they simply do not have their one top notch product, for sale on 90% of their routes! If they want to imitate the US airline 3 class strategy, at least do it right! Take a page from Air Canada's book! They do not have First,yet on most of their 777s and even some 767s Business class passengers are offered privacy and comfort that almost rivals BAW First. Yet with Lufthansa, you are given a 2-3-2 layout (any decent airline should use no more then 2-2-2 layout for long haul) and on top of all that hardly any privacy and little space! How does using miles make Lufthansa loose money? These people are cheap, and greedy!
(1) The bed+seat is over: it was a stop-gap. It's gone, dead, finished, never to return. Rave all you want, you won't see it again on Lufthansa.
(2) Lufthansa first is very good. On the A380 it is top-notch.
(3) Lufthansa business-class is very much subpar. But I'm guessing the airline believes it is good enough to satisfy its not-too-demanding core market. I don't like it, and I gather you don't either
. I use it only when the price is right (it very rarely is): I suggest you do the same.(4) First-class is disappearing on many routes because Lufthansa believes it can make more money filling the front of long-haul aircraft with business-class seats rather than first-class ones. The airline's call: you don't agree. But you don't run an airline (there might be good reason for that).
(5) I have no idea what your reference to miles is about.
Oct 26, 2015, 5:57 am
#2228
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AA is also trying a 4U/EW thing: http://finance.yahoo.com/news/americ...111525931.html
Oct 26, 2015, 6:04 am
#2229
Join Date: May 2009
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Where do you see a "4U/EW" thingy there? I certainly don't...
They're (according to the article) not going to create a daughter company (which is outside *A) - what they'll do instead is having a bucket of "as cheap as competitors seats" on the same direct routes.
It's the same in Europe - if competition is flying the same route as LH Group, their fares will be affordable too. And if LH has a monopoly, they'll milk the cow.. which is exactly what American will keep doing (those cheap-buckets will only exist on direct flights with competition)
So.. they're doing the exactly same thing as LH mainline. Hardly news in my opinion, and most certainly has nothing to do with 4U/EW strategy as you're trying to claim.
They're (according to the article) not going to create a daughter company (which is outside *A) - what they'll do instead is having a bucket of "as cheap as competitors seats" on the same direct routes.
It's the same in Europe - if competition is flying the same route as LH Group, their fares will be affordable too. And if LH has a monopoly, they'll milk the cow.. which is exactly what American will keep doing (those cheap-buckets will only exist on direct flights with competition)
So.. they're doing the exactly same thing as LH mainline. Hardly news in my opinion, and most certainly has nothing to do with 4U/EW strategy as you're trying to claim.
Oct 26, 2015, 8:21 am
#2230
Join Date: Mar 2008
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AA is also trying a 4U/EW thing: http://finance.yahoo.com/news/americ...111525931.html
It seems way closer to the Delta approach then LH brand engineering.
Oct 26, 2015, 8:44 am
#2231
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AA is also trying a 4U/EW thing: http://finance.yahoo.com/news/americ...111525931.html
Oct 26, 2015, 8:52 am
#2232
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(3) Lufthansa business-class is very much subpar. But I'm guessing the airline believes it is good enough to satisfy its not-too-demanding core market. I don't like it, and I gather you don't either . I use it only when the price is right (it very rarely is): I suggest you do the same.
. I use it only when the price is right (it very rarely is): I suggest you do the same.The core market is very very demanding, actually (as always in Germany) it is the most demanding core market in the world, simply because Germans tend to demand top quality, unfortunately they are not willing to pay for it....
And again, for those who still do not get it, product quality for a fan on FT is not really comparable to product quality for a professional traveler.
There is be a small difference between a 1000 Euro summer Biz ticket to BOS and a 5000 Euro winter Biz ticket to BOS and guess who is more important for an airline.
Oct 26, 2015, 9:00 am
#2233
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When did I mention that this is from an enthusiasts point of view? Everything I said in the Lufthansa forum was from a passenger POV. I am not just upset about the 744, when I said 90% of their routes I meant all their routes that used to have any First 744 or not. Do you have a problem with avgeeks? You seem to dismiss all my comments on the ground that I am an "aviation enthusiast"
Lufthansa is NOT removing F from 90% of their routes. A good chunk of their routes haven't had F for a very long time, if ever (European routes flown on shorthaul aircraft- I'm not familiar with what LH might have done in the 1960's or 1980's on those routes, so I plead ignorance on some stuff). They are removing F from some longhaul routes where F apparently doesn't sell well enough to justify the cabin space compared to other products. This is common for airlines to not offer F in all longhaul markets; SQ doesn't, CX doesn't, QR doesn't, QF doesn't, JL doesn't; all of which have well-regarded F products. So your complaint doesn't seem to have much merit, given how many other airlines offer similar F products but do not offer them in all markets. One might think a self-described "aviation enthusiast" would account for this in their arguments.
Oct 26, 2015, 9:01 am
#2234
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Demanding top quality without the top price hardly seems like a uniquely German thing.
Oct 26, 2015, 9:14 am
#2235
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