FD1971

Japan is an interesting animal at the moment with the Japanese Government doing a lot regarding incoming tourists, of course, not only for tourists from Europe.

If the weaker currency will turn out to be better for foreign airlines remains to be seen, a lower local currency will certainly support the Government's efforts to attract more tourists, but on the other end, falling currencies in many Asian markets resulted in some issues for European airlines, even Lufthansa is no exception.

ANA is doing a good job with their dual hub strategy in Tokyo at the moment, at least when it comes to differentiating the traffic between O/D and connecting pax and given the severe limitations they face. With the inaugural DUS-NRT service scheduled for tonight, we see another piece of the puzzle in Europe being put together. ^

NewbieRunner

I don't know about 380 > (planned) 748 for Tokyo but 34x > 747 for KIX may be because they still considier Japan to be one of their prime markets for premium pax but there were no Airbuses with new F based in FRA.

I certainly see more non-Japanese pax on LH flights to and from Japan. It doesn't matter if Japanese pax fly on LH or NH to Germany as the two airlines are revenue-sharing anyway.

I'm certainly not complaining that LH Group of airlines and ANA between them will provide more choice of flights between Europe and Japan.

OsakaWino

I beg to differ from the pax viewpoint. For the vast majority of Japanese pax, in both premium and cattle classes, it makes a world of difference between flying a Japanese carrier and a foreign one. Outside of some travel business people, I have never met a Japanese who would select LH over NH. Package trips are able to charge a premium for guaranteeing a Japanese carrier. The business types I know who fly to Europe will fly from ITM up to NRT to take NH rather than opt for the direct flight on LH from KIX. I believe that there are generally only 3 reasons that you will ever see Japanese pax on a foreign carrier: (1) No other route alternatives, (2) Significant fare difference, or (3) No choice on their package trip. Maybe attitudes are a bit different in Tokyo, but I think my view holds true for a significant percentage of the other 90% of the country. More than xenophobia, I would attribute it to a desire for language compatibility.

Of course, it is not uncommon for US pax to disdain flying on JL or NH, or maybe more recently other Asian carriers such as OZ.

Forrest Bump

True, though things seem slowly changing, at least when it comes for Japanese on EK.
I was impressed on few recent flights by the number of them on a DXB-FCO.

NewbieRunner

I think you misunderstood me. I was talking from the airlines' and especially LH's point of view and not from the passengers' point of view since we were discussing the airlines' decision to reduce/increase capacity.

As an aside you obviously haven't met me.

AeroWesty

Looks like First Class service is restored to Seattle on 26OCT14 on the A330, according to ITA Matrix. No update from airlineroute.net yet.

OsakaWino

Well, maybe if you have a 3rd DO, especially if it's in Kyoto

oliver2002

PVG seems to be doing well, with seat capacity just behind NYC:

Considering the flying time from the ME3 hubs to anything in north Asia is the same as from FRA/MUC, the convenience factor still sells seats.

N1003U

+1.

My experience (and those of colleagues) lately is that if you need to travel on a particular day/week, PVG can be a difficult (and expensive) seat from any travel direction. My anecdotal evidence is that load factors are quite high (sometimes over 100% ).

oliver2002

Interestingly our corporate EK Fare of 2100€ rt to PVG is also only available at times when no-one needs to fly. All other critical days its 3500-4000€, despite of 2x MUC-DXB A380 service.

N1003U

Must be all the former LH people working revenue management in Dubai...

Anyone know how well LH is doing these days to/from DXB?

NA-Flyer

It seems they are doing badly there. LH has downgraded its plane from FRA to DXB for the summer time table from a 744 to A340 and phased out F cabin on that route.

San Gottardo

The downgrade happens every summer and therefore is not necessarily a sign of "doing badly". Summer is low season in Dubai, it's simply too hot. All the DXB-based people I know would go on EK anyway as they have more pleasant departure times and more choice of flights: the LH flight leaves at around 2AM from Dubai, on EK FRA is 2x daily once in the morning and once in the afternoon, and the same is true for most other European destinations so people can go there without transfer at FRA. There are a of course some places where LH offers better connections, for instance if one would want to transfer in FRA to places like Stavanger, Riga or Graz. But for those pax and for those that take LH for other reasons (corp contract, FFP, personal preference, schedule constraints that cannot be met by EK) the A340 capacities + the LH A330 to MUC are sufficient.

As for the F class: IIRC there still are F seats to Dubai from Munich (leaving Europe in the evening, flying back to Europe during the day) and from Zurich (operating at similar times as the LH flight from FRA), so almost all pax that want to absolutely go in F class to DXB on one of the LH Group carriers can do so by connecting through ZRH or MUC. Just bad luck for those leaving from/going to places that only connect through FRA. But then, the number of people traveling First Class from places that have 1) no EK nonstop service 2) absolutely want to go on LH 3) are not connected to ZRH or MUC is is small that it does not justify sending a plane with F from Frankfurt if there is better use for it elsewhere.

All in all a smart decision and not at all surprising.

A couple of years ago DXB was the lowest yielding destination in the LH network. I have no idea whether that is still the case.

FD1971

PVG is def. one of the key destinations in Asia that are pretty much maxxed out (btw, not only for LH)

Uli

FRA - DXB runs 3xdaily on EK.