Moderator's Note:
 

Posts discussing the immediate practical impact of the January 23, 2017, shuttle changes were moved to the following thread:
Please let's keep the focus of this thread on the long term plan to overhaul the ground transportation at LAX.

Thank you,

TWA884
Moderator

The Consolidated Rent-A-Car facility is long overdue. It's hard to imagine a worse setup than LAX now for getting between a terminal and your rental car. Some passengers are now spending more time doing that than they spent in the air en route to LAX.

Amen to that. I can't think of a worse airport at which to deal with car rental.

After the joys of waiting for a shuttle on the noisy, smoky lower level, you finally get to the rental lot -- and get to endure the worst service I've seen at any American rental offices. It hardly matters which company, though I confess I had a good interaction with Avis the last time I rented at LAX.

I rarely visit LAX since moving from the city in 2009, but I just have to say that after a recent trip there last week, the upper roadway was absolutely terrible. I was stunned at how the Hertz shuttle from the rental car dropoff took 15 min just to get to the upper roadway, and basically another 15 min to get around to T7 United. This is way worse than I ever remembered, and I don't know what the main problem is -- the lane closures, badly time traffic lights, mergers and intersections of the different sections of loop shortcuts, or what. It was absolutely awful, and if I had not arrived a bit early, I would have missed my flight.

Are there any interim measures that they are considering putting in place to segment lanes / create bypass lanes to help traffic move better, and not allow one terminal's traffic to clog up the entire loop's?

I've lived here all my life and notice the same thing. It probably has a lot to do with this: http://www.travelandleisure.com/airl...siest-airports

It's a staggering figure - third busiest airport in the world, 83,000,000 passengers last year. And, there's the usual figure that goes along with it of LAX being the busiest O&D airport in the world coupled with the fact that every single one of those passengers arrives and departs the airport in some motor vehicle conveyance. There is not one train/trolley/monorail/etc that moves passengers into and out of LAX off the road. Consider that a huge number of Atlanta's numbers come from Delta passengers transiting and they never leave the airport. Beijing has a train for access, which alleviates some of the motor traffic. Then, you have LAX - everyone arrives in a vehicle on the roadway with rubber tires.

Until something is built, we continue to grapple with the gridlock.

I noticed they didn't have a lot of police/parking enforcement shooing people who were waiting in cars idle. Maybe that could help a bit...

Is it possible for the parking structures to be used as early exits somehow, for traffic that has finished their business at the terminal curbside, to divert them from further blocking the upper roadway while trying to get out?

I will not go to the arrivals level. Period. I feel like I'm going to die down there trying to get in to the inner lanes.

I get off at Nash sometimes instead of Sepulveda. Maybe it doesn't save any time but I feel like I am moving at least.

A week ago, my daughter's flight arrived at T7 half an hour early at 8 am. Normally, I pick her up on the departure level. However, last Sunday traffic on the upper roadway was backed up so badly that Waze advised me that it would take 15 minutes to get to T7 from Sepulveda via Vicksburg Ave and the East Way cutoff. Instead, I kept to the right where Vicksburg Ave intersects with World Way and stayed on the lower level. It took only three minutes to drive around the airport and I got to T7 before she got off the plane (yes, I had to go around which took another five minutes).

Without a substantial change in how people get to the LAX complex (i.e. including the transit center) from the 105, it's probably going to have limited impact--that's become a severe bottleneck, and the layout of roads around the area doesn't help-- there aren't a lot of through roads that will get you to the lot C/transit center area by taking other exits off the 105.

I used to use the old lot B instead of C to avoid the slow trip through the tunnel. It was a little longer bus ride, but it was way easier to get to and the return buses from the terminal ran more often.

It does look like they might have finally improved the lot C bus situation - I didn't travel much last year out of LAX, but it had gotten bad enough that I could walk from T7 to Lot C faster than taking the bus. A few weeks ago it looked like they had a bunch of new buses and were actually using them.

Not form the upper level but the lower level has a service road in the middle of the loop. You don't need to go all the way around to the south side to exit.

This is part of the Landside Access Modernization Program: http://www.laxishappening.com/connecting-lax/

At the rate they are going, it could be 10-15 years out

2024 is the estimated completion of construction of the automated people mover and consolidated rental car facility.

http://www.laxishappening.com/assets...-Factsheet.pdf

That is way too long for a project like this - 3-4 years tops, and they've already overpaid on the estimate, let alone the final bill.

In that amount of time, they should be adding the seamless overlay onto the terminal buildings as well.

The Parking Spot is apparently feeling threatened by the plan.
Of note is that their attorney is a longtime friend.

CEQA lawsuits are routine in projects like this for opportunist to blackmail a settlement.

I'm sure Parking Spot's main objective here is to ensure it can still send its shuttles into LAX rather than forced to pickup and drop off at the transit center. And extract some cash out of LAWA while they are at it.

As a longtime and frequent Parking Spot renter, I can see why they'd be concerned (though not sure their lawsuit is valid). If, in the future, when I park at Parking Spot their shuttle van has to take me to the consolidated transit center, I don't see why I wouldn't just park at the municipal lots.

KPCC:

LAWA released a video showing how the automated people mover will connect consolidated car rental facility, the remote parking and the public transportation hub to the terminals:

So they are pretty much turning LAX into MIA. It would be nice if they added security in the consolidated facility so the people mover would run airside and incentivize passengers to use a kiss-n-fly drop-off at the consolidated facility vs driving to the terminals, as well as simplify transfers between the terminals and allow a more flexible allocation of gate space.

The Ren LAX is going to get a bit noisier than now with that path for the people mover. Also, Randy's Donuts is gonna get a lot of foot traffic in the future.

The biggest problem with all of the modernization elements is to make access to your terminal longer and longer. Who's going to want to take this mover to and from T4/5/6/7/8/9? I'll make the walk across the central area but larger groups and those with lots of luggage are gonna have challenges.

Edit: re-viewing the video shows that its really after T1 and T7 that the walk across the middle gets longer the way that they've routed the mover - too bad they didn't have it stop at the Theme Building.

David

Cool video!

But it'll still take 45 minutes to get in/out of the terminal, but psychologically it won't feel as bad because people will be walking or on the people mover for that period of time instead of waiting in traffic.... :rolleyes: </sarcasm>

More constructively, my guess is that there'll be a number of electric carts to drive people across the longer paths (eventually at least) & moving walkways. For example PVD has a long walk on a skybridge across the parking lot to their CRCF and SEA has a long walk through the parking structure to their light rail train. Both have an on-demand electric cart system for people with lots of luggage or who can't walk as easily.

(1) Just where is this T9? ;)
(2) What choice will people have? Order a for-hire vehicle from the rental lot?
(3) It will probably be no more difficult for those that already suffer a lower level drop off (who have to schlep from a center island, then get their luggage upstairs to find the check-in / bag drop).

My understanding is that the APM will replace the car rental and the parking lot shuttles, and will provide easier access to bus and light rail public transportation. The plan does not call for the elimination of vehicular access to the central terminal area. The Landslide Access Modernization Program is projected to reduce traffic in the terminal area by as much as 27 percent, not eliminate it (source).

A part of United Airlines President Scott Kirby's plan to expand at LAX?

LAWA awarded contracts to construct the terminal buildings for the peoplemover train

LAX News Release: LAWA Authorizes $336-Million Design-Build Contract for Construction of Terminal Cores

http://images.benchmarkemail.com/cli...age5240535.jpg

http://images.benchmarkemail.com/cli...age5240536.jpg

Traffic likely will never get better at LAX because once you remove certain vehicles (e.g. rental car shuttles) from the ring road the excessive road capacity will be immediately filled by other vehicles currently avoiding that road. That's why highway and road expansion like the $1.5 billion I-405 widening a few years ago to "relive congestion" is a fools errand and wasted investment. The only way to relive congestion on ANY roadway is to properly charge for access - you need to levy a congestion charge (toll) to use the road if you want it to always be free flowing and easily accessible.

What the peoplemover will do is to provide alternative to people accessing the central terminal area (CTA) by vehicles, and that is a genuine access improvement. The vehicle access point now expands to the 3 peoplemover terminals outside the airport ring road, plus any of the Metro stations that can offer relative painless transfers to the peoplemover at the 96th street station. The whole point is to offer easy alternatives for you to get dropped off or picked up beyond the LAX CTA perimeter. The is no current alternative except by foot. Whether you drive, uber, rental car, taxi, or take the FlyAway or Metro, all involve getting on or off a vehicle inside the CTA ring road.

The last thing I ever want to do is relive the congestion around LAX, and building more lanes in and out will help do exactly that.

That's a very appropriate typo.

LAX people mover design unveiled in new video. Work could begin on the project this year

The video shows off the design of the shuttle, which will transport passengers between terminals, rental car centers, and the under-construction Crenshaw/LAX Line. Traveling along an elevated track, trains will arrive every two minutes and rides from the 96th Street Metro Station are expected to take under 10 minutes start-to-finish.

If they could improve road access to the people mover from the 105 (i.e some high-throughput exit that doesn't use the tunnel), that would be great.

Wow, talk about heavy LA 2028 in that video.

But, the good news is these projects will now finally happen with the Olympics coming for sure. It appears they were planned with the 2024 as the potential Olympics date.

I agree with the above that a better drop-off terminus outside the airport would be really smart.

Rasheed

https://www.lawa.org/News%20Releases...20Release%2008



Demolition of Burger King to make way for the APM. Construction of APM should start in a couple of weeks.

LAX Construction (2020 and onward)
 

FWIW, since I was picking up Zorak and DCAhome for the LAX meetup on Saturday (05 September 2020), took a few shots of the current state of construction from just outside Terminal 2 departures level:

Looking southeast-ish:

https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.fly...ae41faa175.jpg

Due East:
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.fly...ce831dd3b0.jpg

Terminal 1/2 connection + whatever DL has in store...
https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.fly...56c3a6cd28.jpg

Terminal 2, door L2-02:
https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.fly...07c8a40055.jpg

Don't usually hang out in front of T2 and hadn't been back at LAX since late July (and that was at night).

Lots more construction activity going on W. 98th, the former Lot C, the former areas bounded by La Cienega (east), Century Blvd (south), Aviation (west) and Arbor Vitae (east) as well as demolition of the old Western Airlines headquarters building just south and east of the Century / Sepulveda interchange.

David

Also, since I found a photo from LAWA of what will be the ConRAC (Consolidated Rent-A-Car facility) (the La Cienaga/Century/Aviation/Arbor Vitae construction mentioned in post 1), I'm posting it:

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.fly...461fd88be2.png

(click on the photo to open in another window and then expand accordingly - this place will be big.)

David

LAX just won't be LAX without the miserable wait for a rental shuttle. At least the surly service can continue in the new facility. ;-)

No more shuttles. We will have a $2 billion people mover. That will surely break down on a regular basis.

Lots of interesting details about the construction and what waits for us in the future at LAX here. https://labusinessjournal.com/news/2...cess-contract/

Some details on the plans for Concourse 0 and Terminal 9

https://urbanize.la/post/lax-expansi...s-step-forward

Concourse 0 target opening date is late 2026 and construction will coincide with North airfield improvements that will begin late 2021.

Terminal 9 target opening date is late 2027. Construction will begin in 2023 which will include a new in-fill APM station, MAJOR roadway reconfigurations around LAX.

Take it with a grain of salt... I think those dates estimates were reasonable pre-COVID. Terminal 9 in particular will draw lots of lawsuits from El Segundo and others.

Keep in mind, this doesn't include the planned Terminal 4 and 5 rebuild and MSC South... in another word, LAX will be under constant construction that began with TBIT rebuild, which overlapped with T4/TBIT connector, which overlapped the current MSC North, which overlapped with T1.5 and T2/3 rebuild, which overlaps with the APM, CONRAD, and two transit centers, which will overlap with MSC South, which will overlap with T4/5 rebuild, which will overlap with T0 concourse, which will overlap with T9.