First KLM must announce the change officially and change the terms and conditions of the program. It'll take some weeks...

That is not possible.

I brought this up with some FD people several months back; there is interest within FD (as I recall) but KL is having none of it. I may not remember exactly, but it was something equally as ****ed up.

Haven't followed this in to much detail.... but this means upgrades are only available on KLM or AF and not on any of the ST members, e.g. Korean Air?

Which also means C to SGP and then upgrade to First on AF to Paris for 40,000miles or vice versa. Actually not too bad.... Especially since the QF Skybed is good enough for the 'short' stretch between Oz and SGP.... First is just marvelous......
Upgrade on LH would be 75,000.... But I think you are accumulating more miles with LH (more class and elite bonus)..... Its the same issue, you can"t upgrade the other *A airlines (e.g. Thai, which has terrible C between SYD and BKK). Hmmm, have to do the calcs...

Cheers.

C class bonus on LH is 100%, and there's a paltry 25% status bonus for both FTL and Senator members, but only on LH, LO and UA metal. So there your total accrual in C is 225% compared to 325% for PE's now, and putatively 250% under the new scheme. This applies to award miles. For status miles, IIRC, you still get the 225% with M&M on LH, while you'd only get 150% under the mooted changes, compared to 200% now.

[QUOTE=alanw]That is not possible.

LOL!!!!


But that said, let me reiterate that FD is saddled with a mish mash of software that is unwieldy to say the least. I think its important to SEPARATE criticism of FD staff, who are as only good as the systems that they operate versus criticism of KLM management which has chosen to chronically underfund FD software improvements.

The one thing that Cygnific seems to be very much in agreement on, is that F+ software will be a marked improvement for both customers and staff. Can't get much worse, thats for sure!!!!

Thanks for straitening me out.... That makes live easy.... Keeping status on either group is not a problem... Just have to get used to this Paris Airport, not my favorite one.

By the way, is it possible switch mileage collection 'on the way'? E.g. QF or BA miles SYD to SGP and FD miles SGP to Paris?

Cheers.

Probably not if your ticket says that it's an AF-coded flight. You'd have to get the QF segment showing as a QF-coded flight, in which case you'd be able to earn miles on all QF, BA and rest of oneworld. However, I don't know if you can book the flight (cheaply) this way.

Please re-read what I wrote: ".....they don't need that many UK-based clients....."
I NEVER said that KLM is planning to get rid of ALL UK-based clients, they are just re-balancing their passenger loads away from the UK. So indeed they can afford to have a few percentage-points fewer UK-based clients. Makes sense to me to diversify their client base a bit more.

The passionate hatred for all things KLM with some of the regulars here on Flyertalk is food for psychiatrists. If you don't like KLM, fine with me and use another airline. Or admit that you are a masochist and you actually enjoy being harrassed by the KLM lounge dragons.

Hi,

Ok so we all agree that we're not happy as frequent flyers. Maybe this is a time to start an action like an online petition and see if we can do something about it.

Cheers,

Brenno.

According to this thread on the AF Forum, F+ Rouge would be converted to Plat in the new program.
If that is so, I do not see how they can decently put FD GEs at anything less than Plat, given that, outside France, you need fewer miles to be F+ Rouge (40K/30segs) than to be FD GE (50K/40segs).

Sjoerd, this has to be the KL post of the year. This all makes such perfect sense now.
Some of us are so blinded by our prejudice and hate of KLM and our failure to keep appointments with our therapists to deal with that anger that we cannot see what must be obvious to objective and less screwed-up people: viz. that KL problem is that they have too many customers in the UK.
How can we be so dumb as to not realise the huge potential of the Dutch market, as yet untapped by KL? How can we be so stupid as not to realise that the lowering of KL's fares on the Dutch market is a sign of vitality and profit potential on that market?

Of course, if they want to lose UK customers, they could offer fewer services to the UK. The disadvantage of this, however, is that they would be lowering their operating costs. It is a far better strategy to keep the same number of flights with the same equipment but discourage some people from taking those flights. This way, you get the load factors down, keep your costs high while lowering your earnings, which is surely a very smart move if one takes into account the fact that the reason why KL needs to lose UK pax is that they make too much money. This way, it all makes sense.

May I suggest, to build on this logic, that perhaps KL should consider switching its 9 daily flights from LHR to EXT as a first step in the summer schedule, to be soon followed in the winter schedule by a switch from MAN to BLK and from GLA to BRR?

[edited for typo/grammar]

The only thing I see how to efficiently show the people in Paris how much we love the proposed changes to the FF program IMO is to walk away from KL/AF and book our tickets elsewhere.

If indeed V fares will not earn full miles any more, biz tickets will not have 100% COS bonus anymore and upgrades will only be possible from full fares that's it with KLM for me.

Every biz ticket I book in the future at LH and others will be faxed with a short statement to AF/KL FF headquarters in Paris.

I hope, others will do the same. Money is the only thing that seems to count for the new decission makers.

I will also encourage all the KLM flyers I know to do the same. And I'm very sure that most of them will be p***ed enough by the changes to jump ship, too. That will be quite some premium fare tickets to be lost I can assure you...

BTW: I still hope that the rumors are not true...

Another classic, that must be some spade your digging with there Sjoerd

It would be remiss of me not to kindly request a link to this revolutionary report that has 'allegedly' recommended this stuff. If you can remember where it was you read it of course .

Keep 'em coming....

The 'Lounge dragons' have always been nice and cheerful when I speak to them , maybe you should talk nicely to them , they are quite helpful

Before running away you could try and convince KL/AF otherwise. If they refuse that is a still an option. If you get a 1,000 customers that defect all at once that is surely news....