So because they had their seats reclined we are to conclude that none of the passengers want lie flat seats. That makes sense.

Nobody said it was. The question is why not use seats that can be upright, reclined OR flat.

Nobody is suggesting not to make pistachio. But an ice cream stand that offered ONLY pistachio wouldn't stay in business long without a monopoly and or subsidies.

I think I'm getting brain freeze from being exposed to logic free arguments.... or maybe it's the pistachio ice cream.

More Gran Class photos to get us back on track (this time on the Hokuriku Shinkansen from Nagano to Tokyo - one of the shorter routes with full Gran Class service).

I don't want to go off topic, but I did not want to start the new thread. Shinkansen 100 Series cars which ran on Tokyo - Shin Osaka - Hakata between 1985 and 2004 had two double decker cars.

One of the double decker car was a dining car, upper floor was a dining area and lower floor was a galley (kitchen). Sorry, not inside photo of the dining car. Second double decker car was Green Car, upper floor was standard Green Car with 2x2 seating and lower floor was private room Green Car seats. There was not complimentary drink and food service in this private room Green Car.

Shinkansen 100 Series


Dining Car


Green Car


Green Car Private Room


Maximum speed or Shinkansen 100 Series was 230 km/hr (143 mph) and retirement of 100 Series was one due to make a way to faster Shinkansen train. Currently N700A Series trains run Tokyo - Shin Osaka in maximum speed of 285 km/hr (177 mph). Currently Utsunomiya - Morioka portion of Tohoku Shinkansen is run with maximum speed of 320 km/hr (199 mph). However, Tokyo - Shin Osaka portion of Shinkansen was built in '60s, service of Tokyo - Shin Osaka portion of Shinkansen started in 1964 for Tokyo Olympics. It is now difficult to increase the speed of Tokyo - Shin Osaka portion of Shinkansen by new faster trains. To further increase the speed of Tokyo - Shin Osaka portion of Shinkansen, upgrade of the track is also required and that means service disruption of Shinkansen. Now that JR Tokai is building new Linear Shinkansen (mag lev train) between Shinagawa-Nagoya- Osaka. It is possible that there will be no further speed increase on Tokyo - Shin Osaka portion of Shinkansen.

Also, why no private room Green Car currently on Shinkansen. During the bubble era of Japan, private room Green Car did well on Tokyo - Shin Osaka portion. However, once the bubble era burst, demand of private room Green Car went down. Also, private room Green Car did well at Tokyo - Shin Osaka portion but demand was never there on Shin Osaka - Hakata portion and private room Green Car was often empty on Shin Osaka - Hakata portion.

Used to use the Green Car private rooms all the time. The incremental charge was minimal, and they were great for sleeping, partying, working or having meetings.

Starting Oct. 1 there will be a choice of Western or Japanese meal in Gran Class. Currently there is no meal choice in Gran Class, although different meal is served on trains from Tokyo and to Tokyo.

No announcement in English yet, but Japanese announcement is out. First page of the announcement shows the picture of new meal choice. Left picture in white box is Western meal, and right picture in black box is Japanese meal. It looks like the content of the meal got smaller. Also, looks like same meals will be served on Gran Class from Tokyo and to Tokyo. The announcement calls those refreshment, not light meal. The announcement also indicates sweet (very small pound cake) will be by request only. Currently attendants ask passengers if they want sweet but starting Oct. 1 attendants will not ask passengers and sweet will be provided only if passengers ask for one. The announcement said to save food waste refreshment served from Oct. 1 will be previously frozen. Current light meal served in Gran Class is not frozen meal. Currently there are two attendants for Gran Class, which will be only one attendants for Gran Class starting Oct. 1.

Is this improvement...? Some are already saying that this is obvious operational cost reduction of Gran Class.

Gran Class Service from Oct. 1 (PDF file in Japanese)

From the reduction of cabin attendants it is clearly a cost cut

What is the width of the seat compared to the Green Car on the Nozomi? From the photos, it looks a little narrower.

Gran class: 520 mm
Green car: 490 mm

Does the Kagayaki train have full service? Planning a trip to Kanazawa and not sure which Shinkansen to choose.

It should. Only Hakutaka and Asama are without food on the Hokuriku line. But the food service is more of a snack than a full meal.
Having said that, I took Gran Class on a Hakutaka service and even without the snack and attendant, it is a very relaxing way to travel.

Our family of 4 (with two toddlers) just got back from vacation in Japan and we had GranClass seats on the Hakutaka train from Tokyo to Kanazawa. We got 3 seats (2 adult and 1 child fare) and it came out to $435 USD. I think the Green class fare was about $100 less and the standard fare was about $200 less. But for a 3 hour ride with kids the premium was definitely worth it.

We didn't have food service on the train, but we just bought bento boxes and drinks at the station before boarding. The GranClass cabin and seats are beautiful. Although the seats aren't fully lie flat, the fit and finish of everything inside the car are on par with a QSuite.

I would 100% recommend it if you are looking for a comfortable ride on a long route like ours.

Glad you enjoyed it. Those are some shockingly nice seats. Did you get a chance to use the Gran Class lounge at Tokyo Station? They even have children�s books and and snacks there for your toddlers.

FWIW - Four seats in the Green Car cost roughly the same as three seats in Gran Class. It may be a good option when you want a seat for each child. If you reserve two rows of two seats, you can turn one row to face the other. (Also possible in Gran, but costs more, obvs).

TBH, For a three hour trip, I think I'd be very happy with a group of four seats in ordinary class, but YMMV.

Considered taking Gran Class on the same Kanazawa-Tokyo route in May, but opted for a nearly empty green car instead, which was also a great ride. That said, sort of wish we had taken it while we had the chance. Glad you got to experience it!

Interested to know if anyone has information on whether other JR companies than JR East are thinking of implementing GranClass or some other first class cabin? As I'm sure there would be demand for it on other shinkansens as well, Tokaido/Sanyo especially.