[ARCHIVE to 2018] American Express Announces Two New Hilton Credit Cards
#286
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Toledo, OH
Programs: Delta DM & MM, Hilton DM, Marriott gold, Hyatt Globalist, Alaska 75K, Wyndham Diamond,
Posts: 15,401
I would like some insight from those with Priority Pass experience as to how redeemable this "benefit" might prove to be in practical terms. I paid a rare visit to the main SEA Boardroom last week and it was SRO.
I fear this offer might be along the lines of "Here's ten passes, good luck trying to use them," with low confidence of success, sort of like UA RPUs -- exciting to receive, infuriating to try to use, until you eventually stop caring / trying.
$450 is one night in New York City, so by giving out Diamond for a $450 fee they are essentially freeing road warriors to stay wherever they like -- which is easy because Diamond "benefits" on-property are usually unremarkable, in the US anyway.
If I were engineering a loyalty scheme I would make the top tier more remarkable and harder to obtain, not incent people to buy it for a pittance then go stay at whatever other hotels are cheaper / nicer. This seems like a calculated strategy to destroy loyalty, and eventually the integrity of HHonors, for a few extra short-term dollars. But that's just me.
I fear this offer might be along the lines of "Here's ten passes, good luck trying to use them," with low confidence of success, sort of like UA RPUs -- exciting to receive, infuriating to try to use, until you eventually stop caring / trying.
$450 is one night in New York City, so by giving out Diamond for a $450 fee they are essentially freeing road warriors to stay wherever they like -- which is easy because Diamond "benefits" on-property are usually unremarkable, in the US anyway.
If I were engineering a loyalty scheme I would make the top tier more remarkable and harder to obtain, not incent people to buy it for a pittance then go stay at whatever other hotels are cheaper / nicer. This seems like a calculated strategy to destroy loyalty, and eventually the integrity of HHonors, for a few extra short-term dollars. But that's just me.
Some lounges that partner with airlines won't admit PP holders during their peak times with partner airlines like the KE lounge at LAX. The Escape clubs no longer accept PP and I was told it was due to all the new members in PP thanks to the Chase Saphire Reserve (which is how I have my current PP membership). What PP is doing at some airport is partnering with a vendor and giving PP members a credit. Since Escape is no longer a member at MSP they are partnering with the PGA lounge and you can get a credit for golf or a credit for the bar/food (which is nice seeing how crowded the MSP skyclubs are, they can literally be SRO only and they will continue to admit people). I was at the Sumaq lounge in December at Lima and I heard them tell the person in front of me they couldn't enter with a PP between 10 p.m. and 1:30 a.m. due to capacity issues and told her where another PP lounge was and after I entered and saw how packed the club was I was glad they were denying entries.
If you go on the Chase partner forum there is a thread about the PP lounges (I'm assuming this benefit will be like the one that comes with chase cards except it's limited to 10 visits) and there's a thread on FT about PP holders getting turned away at the Board rooms.
As far as loyalty Hilton needs to add another tier above diamond or have a special diamond level like Delta has Diamond 360. I used to be a diamond through Hilton activity and will be a diamond through credit card use (probably from now on as long as Hilton make it so easy to give status) and I think it's only fair someone that is staying over two months out of the year with Hilton gets the one last remaining exec floor or suite upgrade over me. But with me Hilton is only getting my personal (which is usually cheap) rates and very few business rates. Most of my business stays are going to Hyatt if there is one in the area or SPG. With Hyatt it's because I get treated a lot better (things like a hot breakfast if no lounge, 4 p.m. checkout and I never have an issue with premium wifi unlike Hilton). With SPG I get a 4 p.m. checkout due to being a Delta diamond.
I can just imagine the outrage from top tier flyers if they partnered with a credit card giving top tier status for only $450 (or even $1,500) a year
#287
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: CO Plat (former), US Gold (former), Hilton Diamond, Marriott Silver (former)
Posts: 75
Lauren,
For the: For those of us who already have the Surpass Card do we get 10 free Priority Pass™Lounge passes to ease the airport experience? If so, when can we start using this perk?
Yes, those will begin on January 18, 2018.
How will that happen? I will be traveling on Jan 18th and it would be useful to use. Will the priority pass automatically recognize that I now have this benefit
?
The 10 passes are they for just myself or can I use 4 of them for companions at 1 visit?
Thanks
For the: For those of us who already have the Surpass Card do we get 10 free Priority Pass™Lounge passes to ease the airport experience? If so, when can we start using this perk?
Yes, those will begin on January 18, 2018.
How will that happen? I will be traveling on Jan 18th and it would be useful to use. Will the priority pass automatically recognize that I now have this benefit
?
The 10 passes are they for just myself or can I use 4 of them for companions at 1 visit?
Thanks
#288
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 1999
Location: ORD/MDW
Programs: BA/AA/AS/B6/WN/ UA/HH/MR and more like 'em but most felicitously & importantly MUCCI
Posts: 19,719
Originally Posted by jamesteroh
Hilton needs to add another tier above diamond or have a special diamond level like Delta has Diamond 360... Hilton is only getting my personal (which is usually cheap) rates and very few business rates. Most of my business stays are going to Hyatt if there is one in the area or SPG.
Originally Posted by jamesteroh
I can just imagine the outrage from top tier flyers if they partnered with a credit card giving top tier status for only $450 (or even $1,500) a year
#289
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: MCI
Programs: AA Gold 1MM, AS MVP, UA Silver, WN A-List, Marriott LT Titanium, HH Diamond
Posts: 52,587
My gameplan will probably be to chill with two Ascend cards, make sure my anniversary free night posts from my existing Citi account (March), and wait/watch for any good up-gauge offers. I bet we get something.
#290
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: LAX ⇄ JFK
Programs: Delta Diamond, Hilton Diamond, Marriott Platinum
Posts: 219
I would like some insight from those with Priority Pass experience as to how redeemable this "benefit" might prove to be in practical terms. I paid a rare visit to the main SEA Boardroom last week and it was SRO.
I fear this offer might be along the lines of "Here's ten passes, good luck trying to use them," with low confidence of success, sort of like UA RPUs -- exciting to receive, infuriating to try to use, until you eventually stop caring / trying.
I fear this offer might be along the lines of "Here's ten passes, good luck trying to use them," with low confidence of success, sort of like UA RPUs -- exciting to receive, infuriating to try to use, until you eventually stop caring / trying.
#291
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Toledo, OH
Programs: Delta DM & MM, Hilton DM, Marriott gold, Hyatt Globalist, Alaska 75K, Wyndham Diamond,
Posts: 15,401
Thanks for your PP insight and field reports. I have no direct experience with PP. I got into the SEA BR because my wife and I were flying first class and I had a couple of admission codes as an MVPG bennie.
Agreed. With the Citi Reserve Visa I have actually eased up on Hilton stays the last few years, knowing I'll remain Gold whether I hit 20 or not. I prefer Hyatt properties anyway; they're just not thick enough on the ground. These card deals have the perverse effect in some cases of making people less loyal. As a cardholder I can stay at La Quintas or use Priceline without jeopardizing my Hilton status, and non-cardholders start to feel like idiots for working / spending to qualify the old-fashioned way.
If a random person could buy AA EXP, BAEC Gold, or UA 1K for $450, those programs would obviously self-destruct overnight, and the airlines would hemorrhage loyalty-driven premium revenue. Hard to believe Hilton doesn't see some lesson in there somewhere.
Agreed. With the Citi Reserve Visa I have actually eased up on Hilton stays the last few years, knowing I'll remain Gold whether I hit 20 or not. I prefer Hyatt properties anyway; they're just not thick enough on the ground. These card deals have the perverse effect in some cases of making people less loyal. As a cardholder I can stay at La Quintas or use Priceline without jeopardizing my Hilton status, and non-cardholders start to feel like idiots for working / spending to qualify the old-fashioned way.
If a random person could buy AA EXP, BAEC Gold, or UA 1K for $450, those programs would obviously self-destruct overnight, and the airlines would hemorrhage loyalty-driven premium revenue. Hard to believe Hilton doesn't see some lesson in there somewhere.
It is worth it for me to pay $450 a year for diamond status and a free night since Hyatt and SPG doesn't have much of a presence in the areas I like to stay at outside of North America and there is considerable difference in treatment between gold's and diamonds at a few of the properties I stay at and I always get well over $300 value out of my free night certificate.
Speaking of airlines it's kind of ironic that Delta is raising the required spend for the MQD waiver for their diamonds next year 10 fold from $25K to $250K and then a month or so later Hilton announces you can get diamond status by simply having the right am ex card. Has me wondering if Am Ex working with Hilton to increase benefits has anything to do with the lost revenue they are going to suffer from Delta diamonds like myself. If I decide to drop to Platinum instead of doing the waiver they will lost $195,000 in spend plus the annual fee on three of the cards I'll drop.
One concern I had with the reserve going away was if I decide to go for the Delta $250K Am Ex spend was getting in another $40K in Am Ex spend to remain diamond with Hilton seeing how many places I use the reserve card at for the $40K spend this year don't accept Am Ex. Being able to get this card will take a lot of pressure off me to get spend requirements in if I decide to go for diamond again with Delta.
#292
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Cote d'Ivoire
Programs: OW Emerald - HH Diamond
Posts: 3,419
My plan:
No-fee HH Visa becomes HH Amex. Fine, keep. No fee and want to keep the credit line.
HH Reserve: just canceled.
AX Surpass: becomes Ascend, and then I'll upgrade to Aspire (in/around January 18).
No-fee HH Visa becomes HH Amex. Fine, keep. No fee and want to keep the credit line.
HH Reserve: just canceled.
AX Surpass: becomes Ascend, and then I'll upgrade to Aspire (in/around January 18).
#293
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 1999
Location: ORD/MDW
Programs: BA/AA/AS/B6/WN/ UA/HH/MR and more like 'em but most felicitously & importantly MUCCI
Posts: 19,719
One concern I had with the reserve going away was if I decide to go for the Delta $250K Am Ex spend was getting in another $40K in Am Ex spend to remain diamond with Hilton seeing how many places I use the reserve card at for the $40K spend this year don't accept Am Ex.
#294
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Toledo, OH
Programs: Delta DM & MM, Hilton DM, Marriott gold, Hyatt Globalist, Alaska 75K, Wyndham Diamond,
Posts: 15,401
Hi Lauren,
I have a question I'm hoping one of your Am Ex reps can answer.
The credit card reform act of 2009 prohibits a credit card company from raising an annual fee on a new credit card within that first year of having it. Even though the Aspire is offering a ore benefits than the Ascend, if someone has had the Ascend for less than a year American Express can't upgrade the card to an Aspire and the cardholder would have to apply for the Aspire card and then if approved and no longer wanted the Ascend close that out which means taking a hit on your FICO (which can be a big deal with Chase with their 5/24 rule).
If my Citi Reserve has been open for over a year and once the Ascend is issued by Am Ex will Am Ex consider the Ascend to be a new account with Am Ex thus making it ineligible to be upgraded to an Aspire for one year or will they consider they consider the date I opened the Reserve account to be the opening date (I tried calling Am Ex and they weren't sure and said I would have to wait until the new card was issued before they would have an answer). Also wondering if the date the Citi card was opened will show up on our credit reports after the takeover or if is going to show up as the Citi card being closed and the Am Ex card as being a new account.
I have the fee free Hilton Am Ex so I know I can easily convert that to an Aspire but I would rather have the Ascend card upgraded instead since I am a little nervous about the citi free night benefit not carrying over if I close the account out and I also have a lot more credit history with the Citi card than I do the Hilton Am Ex.
I have a question I'm hoping one of your Am Ex reps can answer.
The credit card reform act of 2009 prohibits a credit card company from raising an annual fee on a new credit card within that first year of having it. Even though the Aspire is offering a ore benefits than the Ascend, if someone has had the Ascend for less than a year American Express can't upgrade the card to an Aspire and the cardholder would have to apply for the Aspire card and then if approved and no longer wanted the Ascend close that out which means taking a hit on your FICO (which can be a big deal with Chase with their 5/24 rule).
If my Citi Reserve has been open for over a year and once the Ascend is issued by Am Ex will Am Ex consider the Ascend to be a new account with Am Ex thus making it ineligible to be upgraded to an Aspire for one year or will they consider they consider the date I opened the Reserve account to be the opening date (I tried calling Am Ex and they weren't sure and said I would have to wait until the new card was issued before they would have an answer). Also wondering if the date the Citi card was opened will show up on our credit reports after the takeover or if is going to show up as the Citi card being closed and the Am Ex card as being a new account.
I have the fee free Hilton Am Ex so I know I can easily convert that to an Aspire but I would rather have the Ascend card upgraded instead since I am a little nervous about the citi free night benefit not carrying over if I close the account out and I also have a lot more credit history with the Citi card than I do the Hilton Am Ex.
#295
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Toledo, OH
Programs: Delta DM & MM, Hilton DM, Marriott gold, Hyatt Globalist, Alaska 75K, Wyndham Diamond,
Posts: 15,401
My Plan:
Citi Reserve becomes Ascend. If the credit card reform act of 07 considers the opening date to be that of the reserve for upgrading it will get upgraded to a an Aspire and I close the free Am Ex card. If they consider 1/31 to be the date the Ascend is open the free Am Ex Hilton gets upgraded and the Ascend gets closed.
Business stays will go to Hyatt if there is a Hyatt convenient and leisure stays in the US will go to Hyatt if there is a location that is convenient and the rate isn't much more than a Hilton. I can keep my top tier status that way with Hyatt. If I come a little short with stays with Hyatt I'll put $40K on their credit card for the extra night credits.
My stays outside North American with Hilton and Hilton will get my business for business stays where Hilton is the only choice and Hyatt isn't an option due to location and my leisure stays when Hilton is cheaper than Hyatt or there isn't a Hyatt conveniently located.
Citi Reserve becomes Ascend. If the credit card reform act of 07 considers the opening date to be that of the reserve for upgrading it will get upgraded to a an Aspire and I close the free Am Ex card. If they consider 1/31 to be the date the Ascend is open the free Am Ex Hilton gets upgraded and the Ascend gets closed.
Business stays will go to Hyatt if there is a Hyatt convenient and leisure stays in the US will go to Hyatt if there is a location that is convenient and the rate isn't much more than a Hilton. I can keep my top tier status that way with Hyatt. If I come a little short with stays with Hyatt I'll put $40K on their credit card for the extra night credits.
My stays outside North American with Hilton and Hilton will get my business for business stays where Hilton is the only choice and Hyatt isn't an option due to location and my leisure stays when Hilton is cheaper than Hyatt or there isn't a Hyatt conveniently located.
#296
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: ATL
Programs: DL - PM (Sky Priority);HH - Gold; Marriott - Silver; National - Executive; DL Reserve AMEX
Posts: 5,237
Did anyone else find out today via e-mail which card they are moving into? Apparently, I am already being assigned to the Ascend card. I'm not so sure I love the idea of them sending me from a no-annual-fee card to an annual-fee card without asking first. Maybe they will waive the annual fee the first year?
Does anyone know when we'll receive the new card and account number?
Does anyone know when we'll receive the new card and account number?
#297
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: San Diego, Ca
Programs: AA 2MM LT PLT; AS MVP Gold75k; HHonors Diamond; IHG PLT
Posts: 3,509
My Plan
AF was due this month on my Citi Reserve, easily cancellation yesterday, no offers or pressure to move to another card. Was used primarily for personal Hilton stays.
Wife did the 2-step Surpass first application earlier this year, added me as a user, replaced the Citi Reserve as the personal stay card.
I have had a Surpass for many years, used for business stays, earn Diamond on a regular basis.
With the continued devaluation of Hilton points, we use Citi and Chase private label cards to accumulate points for other purchases, generally to not meet min spend required for free weekend nights.
Subject to whatever upgrade promotions are offered next year, my current thinking is to move my Surpass to an Aspire, for personal stays, make a new application for the business card, wait for the anniversary on my wife's Surpass, some type of retention offer.
With guaranteed Diamond status, I will be free to maximize IHG quarterly promotions, which can be quite lucrative, particularly when points can be combined with Chase card free anniversary night at nicer properties (such as Venetian in LV).
Wife did the 2-step Surpass first application earlier this year, added me as a user, replaced the Citi Reserve as the personal stay card.
I have had a Surpass for many years, used for business stays, earn Diamond on a regular basis.
With the continued devaluation of Hilton points, we use Citi and Chase private label cards to accumulate points for other purchases, generally to not meet min spend required for free weekend nights.
Subject to whatever upgrade promotions are offered next year, my current thinking is to move my Surpass to an Aspire, for personal stays, make a new application for the business card, wait for the anniversary on my wife's Surpass, some type of retention offer.
With guaranteed Diamond status, I will be free to maximize IHG quarterly promotions, which can be quite lucrative, particularly when points can be combined with Chase card free anniversary night at nicer properties (such as Venetian in LV).
#298
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: ATL
Posts: 802
Thanks for your PP insight and field reports. I have no direct experience with PP. I got into the SEA BR because my wife and I were flying first class and I had a couple of admission codes as an MVPG bennie.
Agreed. With the Citi Reserve Visa I have actually eased up on Hilton stays the last few years, knowing I'll remain Gold whether I hit 20 or not. I prefer Hyatt properties anyway; they're just not thick enough on the ground. These card deals have the perverse effect in some cases of making people less loyal. As a cardholder I can stay at La Quintas or use Priceline without jeopardizing my Hilton status, and non-cardholders start to feel like idiots for working / spending to qualify the old-fashioned way.
If a random person could buy AA EXP, BAEC Gold, or UA 1K for $450, those programs would obviously self-destruct overnight, and the airlines would hemorrhage loyalty-driven premium revenue. Hard to believe Hilton doesn't see some lesson in there somewhere.
Agreed. With the Citi Reserve Visa I have actually eased up on Hilton stays the last few years, knowing I'll remain Gold whether I hit 20 or not. I prefer Hyatt properties anyway; they're just not thick enough on the ground. These card deals have the perverse effect in some cases of making people less loyal. As a cardholder I can stay at La Quintas or use Priceline without jeopardizing my Hilton status, and non-cardholders start to feel like idiots for working / spending to qualify the old-fashioned way.
If a random person could buy AA EXP, BAEC Gold, or UA 1K for $450, those programs would obviously self-destruct overnight, and the airlines would hemorrhage loyalty-driven premium revenue. Hard to believe Hilton doesn't see some lesson in there somewhere.
IMO, Hilton was probably in a superior negotiating position since Amex lost Costco to Citi.
Last edited by bigbuy; Nov 3, 2017 at 10:32 am
#299
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Toledo, OH
Programs: Delta DM & MM, Hilton DM, Marriott gold, Hyatt Globalist, Alaska 75K, Wyndham Diamond,
Posts: 15,401
And also with the recent announcement that Delta was raising the MQD spend waiver on American Express from $25,000 to $250,000 for diamond. Delta was really giving the middle finger to diamonds who rely on the MQD waiver. I know it's nothing like the Costco loss but a lot of the people that this will effect are going to be big Am Ex chargers. Some Diamonds spend $60K to $220K on their Delta Am Ex cards every year. That money is going to probably go on another card for a lot of those diamonds who depend on the waiver now that the MQM's won't be as valuable and 1 skypeso per $ charged is an awful return, much better credit card rewards out there.
#300
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Toledo, OH
Programs: Delta DM & MM, Hilton DM, Marriott gold, Hyatt Globalist, Alaska 75K, Wyndham Diamond,
Posts: 15,401
Does Am Ex give retention bonuses on the Hilton Cards? My plan is to cancel one of the cards after the deal but I will gladly keep the free card and store it in a drawer if I get some HH Points thrown my way.