Points
 

Thanks Beckles for the info on points/dollar spend.

Obviously not all of us have all chains in our respective travel areas. SPG & Hyatt have less properties but the Hyatt promo for those who can take advantage of it, does look appealing for now. Of course, none of us know what will happen in 2010 with any program but Hilton how stepped up and announced their changes.

Im just taking a hard look at where I spend my travel dollars for the remainder of 2009 and into 2010 and I tend to think that you go with what promo is hot. For me personally, I want to build up points for Free Hotel/Resort stays. Others want to build up airline points and after I get my 7-10 free nights, I may too.

In the US, Stay Two get One Night Free is my favorite but it isn't offered as much these days and the redemption overseas usually costs more anyways.

hilton does have strenth in europe, a plus, but since you are into numbers, try these: If you stay at Hilton on the cheap, say a $100 room. 10pts for Diamond + 5pts for bonus + 5pts for points and points + 9 points for surpass = 2900 pts per $100 stay. or 17.24 nites to make 50k for a 1 nite award at the HHV. Which you could priceline for around $100. Why bother

To those (not me) travelling on the corporate/government dime I’m guessing it’s because they are travelling on the corporate/government dime.

Even if one is a business owner/self-employed, the tax implications might cut your example by as must as half. So, maybe eight or nine nights in a crappy hotel for a night in a nice place...maybe, particularly when you factor in that Diamond will get you a free breakfast.

It's pretty easy to find awards that are terrible values, it still doesn't change the relative earnings of the different frequent guest programs such as the example I used.

I'm using 40,000 points next year for two nights at the Hilton Garden Inn Omaha Downtown ... sound like a bad deal? Well, it's for Friday and Saturday nights during the Berkshire Hathaway annual meeting that I had to use the Diamond Force to even get. Suddenly not such a bad value, is it?

You're also overlooking the value a Diamond member receives on an award stay at the HHV compared to if they stay using Priceline, it still doesn't necessarilly make it a great use of points, but it is a consideration. You certainly don't have to preach the value of Priceline to me, I use it dozens of times a year for rooms for myself, co-workers, family, and friends.

Funny HHV devalued the breakfast, now you get toast and fruit, no more hot full breakfast, even for diamonds. Also, no more 00 or 01 corner rooms for UGs in the Rainbow tower, and no late checkouts. When I was there last april, on a priceline stay ($99) I got a Rainbow tower Diamond Head view room. so again why bother? In the words of flyertalk's posting legend " This game isn't as much fun as it used to be" :D

For now Hyatt seems to be where its at. Faster Free Nites promos a couple times a year adds up. 4 suite ugrades per year for Diamonds (up to 7 nites each) is also a plus. That's the direction i'm taking. BTW Beckles, you could get a Hiatt Diamond status match, sign up for the bigger better, make thirteen stays in Jan @ double stay credit + bonus points or free nites and be Hyatt Diamond too, til 2012 ;)

That would be an understatement. If you're a loyal follower of the IC promo thread you can vastly beat these numbers. Your 18 points per dollar figure is very very low in comparison to the possibilities. My earning rate amounts to an average of 54 points per dollar - that's right at 3x your estimate - so at my earning rate its $3703 to get to the 200K level. I grant that you have to be a promo hound to reach this level but I would offer that reaching this return is simply not possible in any other program. (to be fair Marriott does offer a couple of mega-bonuses a year so figure 50K off the 200K so its closer to 150K/20 = $7500)

In addition IC promos have earned me:
- 3 free nights during thier free night promo
- $40 gift voucher at MLB.com

Lastly they have the ultimate point relief valve - you can get Anyhotel gift cards with their points that gives you the net ability to earn Hilton points using PC points.

The PC program just has a better return possiblity.

That said I do have to be fair - PC doesn't have the greatest property portfolio. For someone like me on a $150/day hotel expense guideline HIEx and Hamptons are quite comparable (Hampton has better breakfast but HIEx has better room upgrade potential). However, most HIs and even a lot of Crowne Plazas are best avoided. The anyhotel card gives you and out on the redemption end but the earning side of the equation can be limited if you're inbetween HIEx and InterContinetals.

Hyatt's Gold Passport and InterContinental Hotel Group's Priority Club are the two major programs from which I am getting excellent value (although with ICHG PC the issue is they ordinarily don't like recognizing elite status on award stays).

As soon as I once again start paying a lot more attention to my hotel program guru, I'm sure I will find even more value elsewhere than I can find with Hilton next year if Hilton doesn't revise its course somehow.

I'd agree with this if they just had more coverage. If Hyatt Places existed in even 1/2 the places that Hampton Inn's and even HGI's exist, this latest devaluation would make the choice simple. Given my travel patterns, though, I'm worried that Hyatt has too many holes.

People also keep talking about PC. My problem has been where I would use my points. When I collect Hilton points, I can go to Barbados, the HWV, or some nice properties in Europe. I can't see telling my wife that we're going on vacation to a Holiday Inn, and there just aren't enough Intercontinentals. I must be missing something about this program.

Yep, in my example above it was $1724 for 1 nite at HHV, Ditzing around with a Mattress run in my local Seattle area in Jan at Hyatt, I found I could make Diamond til 2012, get 6 free nites, and do it for $200 less. Hey Hilton :p

Hey, I'm not saying that people shoud give them the heave ho. Just dont use them as a Primary choice. Use them to YOUR advantage when you need to. Europe for example, who needs the lounge??? Go to the grocery store :D @ 150 euro to the dollar Hilton does have good coverage in europe (even with less status and no UG) If I need to or want to go there, I can always swap my tons of AA miles 2/1 to get an award. That fills the holes. Hyatt is building lots of HPlaces and Summerfields too.

Point taken, but I think it's clear that many frequent "guests" are totally dissatisfied with this, and somebody will listen or Hilton will suffer. Us "proving" to them in advance that we're serious about moving our stays really doesn't mean anything, I think, because we just will and it's too late. I already did exactly that for my next 6 nights away from home.

I'm HH Gold for 2 years, but since PC has more ways to earn free nights...well, that's where I go. Hyatt's pretty appealing as well because Diamond there actually means something, but as many have said, far too few of those properties where they need to be.

Let's see where Hilton is at in a year...

I don't think Hilton management will listen (so as to reverse this customer-unfriendly course) when it's easy for Hilton management to cover up how Hilton will suffer.

In other words, Hilton management is counting on an economic recovery that will act as lipstick on a pig and hide the ugliness of what Hilton has done to customers with this devaluation of Hilton HHonors points. With the economic recovery and the fruits of the economic recovery, Hilton management will again find the validation it seeks in devaluing the program substantially yet again without the consequences resulting in a corporate culture shake-up. Lost customers and revenue numbers arising from this Hilton HHonors devaluation will be well hidden by the lipstick provided by an economic recovery for which Hilton management has no responsibility but the fruits of which Hilton management will claim credit anyway.

It really is all about the promos and bonuses. Sure, base point earns are lower with SPG, but bonuses can make it much, much higher on a per-stay basis, especially if you hop. On a one-night, $129 Aloft stay in September, I should earn 645 points, per that quite correct math above -- but in reality I earned 1895 due to promotions and amenities. By that math (which is admittedly on the other end of the spectrum), I earn that Paris stay for only $5443. (I am leaving aside the question of whether Hilton's current Cat6 is necessarily equivalent to Starwood's Cat6 -- I suspect the Prince de Galles would be a W=A if Hilton got its hands on it.)

I've already gotten about 15,000 Starpoints from promotions and amenities to date in 2009, plus three free night awards. (The free nights were 2x Cat5 and 1xCat6, so we could arguably call them 52,000 points.) That's well beyond anything Hilton has offered this year -- and I didn't do any mattress runs to accomplish it either. Pity, really; HH used to offer great promos.

me too.....
 

I'm another one who has taken his buisness elsewhere. I've been in the gold or diamond VIP ranks for 10+ years and diamond for the past 5. I've always made my diamond requal through 28+ stays, almost exclusively at Hiltons and Conrads.

This year, I did just enough nights to reup as gold, and I have given all my travel dollars to Hyatt since early summer (~20 stays so far). Also, I just booked 10 high priced stays around China, HK, and Taiwan for mid Dec. In the past,I have always stayed at the Conrad HK (~$300-400 USD/per night) 5-15 times per year, but no more - no matter how much I love the hotel.

In this economy, Hilton has cut the program and its benefits significantly and made the gold vs diamond bene's insignificant (in my opinion), but Hyatt has gone out aggressively to appreciate their diamonds even more than usual.

I have had absolutely wonderful stays, mainly in suites, at Hyatt's all over the US for months, and I am looking forward to a very nice Asia trip in Dec. Also, the amounts of bonus points, free nights, etc. at Hyatt this year has been terrific.

Sorry Hilton, my dedication to you over these years just isn't worth it any more. You've lost out on many thousands of dollars from me so far this year and will continue to next year.