Woman is fined $500 by customs officials for carrying an APPLE
Apr 22, 2018, 8:27 pm
#61
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My thoughts.
1. In strict terms, only two parties to this encounter are in violation of anything.
--- Passenger: failure to declare
--- Officer: failure to adhere to courtesy and professionalism which CBP nominally requires of its officers
------ What's wrong with saying, "Ma'am, there's an apple in your bag, but your declaration says you are carrying no fruit. Unfortunately that requires me to fine you $500."
2. In practical terms, it's foolish of an airline to hand out contraband on arrival. Even if declared, the apple will need be thrown away.
3. Also in practical terms, it's foolish of a government to enforce customs at passenger points of entry.
--- Customs is meant to protect trade and agriculture. Shiploads of parasitic apples from a commercial importer has a low but meaningful chance of harming US agriculture. An apple in your bag is as likely to harm US agriculture as I am to marry Taylor Swift.
1. In strict terms, only two parties to this encounter are in violation of anything.
--- Passenger: failure to declare
--- Officer: failure to adhere to courtesy and professionalism which CBP nominally requires of its officers
------ What's wrong with saying, "Ma'am, there's an apple in your bag, but your declaration says you are carrying no fruit. Unfortunately that requires me to fine you $500."
2. In practical terms, it's foolish of an airline to hand out contraband on arrival. Even if declared, the apple will need be thrown away.
3. Also in practical terms, it's foolish of a government to enforce customs at passenger points of entry.
--- Customs is meant to protect trade and agriculture. Shiploads of parasitic apples from a commercial importer has a low but meaningful chance of harming US agriculture. An apple in your bag is as likely to harm US agriculture as I am to marry Taylor Swift.
Apr 22, 2018, 9:04 pm
#62
Join Date: Jan 2017
Programs: UA
Posts: 324
I was lucky enough to be forewarned by a Canadian coworker who told me about a hefty fine and the revocation of his Nexus card for carrying an apple out of a lunch box through customs at YYC airport. I wouldn't have thought it would have been an issue, but I was lucky enough to have the warning. Delta should warn their customers. I don't take ANY food through customs -ever. I don't think that the aircrews have any clue as I suspect they don't get the same scrutiny. I had an Air Canada crewmember ask me why I was leaving a bag of candy on the plane. I told her, "I'm not bringing so much as a grain of rice off the airplane, even to the garbage can at the end of the airramp". They looked at me like I was crazy. Apparently, I wasn't crazy.
I think a warning by the aircrew "Please note that if you're bringing food, including food from the plane through customs, you must declare it". I suspect that the airlines don't want to deal with the extra garbage though.
I think a warning by the aircrew "Please note that if you're bringing food, including food from the plane through customs, you must declare it". I suspect that the airlines don't want to deal with the extra garbage though.
Apr 22, 2018, 9:07 pm
#63
Join Date: Jan 2017
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If a CBP officer is selectively enforcing the law because of his prejudices and how much 'respect' he gets, he should be fired. CBP and ICE are there to fairly and evenly enforce the law, not go on power trips.
Apr 22, 2018, 9:20 pm
#64
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And then there’s reality.... If you argue with a cop when they pull you over, they are more likely to write you a ticket versus giving you a warning if you’re polite and respectful. Doesn’t mean you won’t get a ticket if you’re respectful but I’m sure it factors in. I would hardly think CBP Officers would be much different.
Apr 22, 2018, 9:22 pm
#65
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No one said anything about respect. However when you want someone to use their discretion in your favor you don't act pissy to them. This lady has blamed everyone but herself and has taken zero responsibility. Full fine is in order. I worked CS for few years . The customer who acted like a human generally got what they wanted. The one that acted like a jerk got nothing but by the book action.
Apr 22, 2018, 9:25 pm
#66
Join Date: Mar 2010
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I also have done CS, and this was true most of the time. I also had some co-workers who were just jerks. Or were having a bad day, or treated certain people differently. And all of this aside, $500 is just crazy. A speeding ticket is much less, and speeding could actually injure or kill people. We're talking about not declaring an apple!
Apr 22, 2018, 9:46 pm
#67
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Fort Lauderdale, FL
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One good example of problems imported fruits and vegetables can cause is the Mediterranean fruit fly outbreak during the 1980s. The outbreak cost the state of California and the federal government approximately $100 million to get rid of this pest. The cause of the outbreak was one traveler who brought home one contaminated piece of fruit. It is best not to bring fresh fruits or vegetables into the United States.
I grew up in Southern California in the 80s. I remember not being able to go outside some nights because they were spraying malathion to get rid of those insects.Here's another quotation from that website that I found highly interesting.
Note: The civil penalty for failing to declare agricultural items at U.S. ports of entry will cost first time offenders $300. The penalty for the second violation goes up to $500. To avoid receiving a penalty all agricultural items and present them to Customs and Border Protection for inspection so that an agriculture specialist can determine if it is admissible.
If the penalties are correct and the reporting is accurate, perhaps this was the second time this woman "forgot" to declare contraband fruit. Given that possibility, I'm not sure I'd rush to defend her without learning more about exactly what happened.Source for both quotes (click "Fruits and Vegetables" in the gray box): https://www.cbp.gov/travel/us-citizens/know-before-you-go/prohibited-and-restricted-items
Last edited by writerguyfl; Apr 22, 2018 at 9:52 pm Reason: The software "upgrade" does not recognize formatted text.
Apr 22, 2018, 9:56 pm
#68
Join Date: Jan 2017
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No one said anything about respect. However when you want someone to use their discretion in your favor you don't act pissy to them. This lady has blamed everyone but herself and has taken zero responsibility. Full fine is in order. I worked CS for few years . The customer who acted like a human generally got what they wanted. The one that acted like a jerk got nothing but by the book action.
I feel bad for many people who run afoul of this law. I think its poorly described to people. CBP could do a better of at informing passengers of the law.
Last edited by TominLazybrook; Apr 22, 2018 at 10:05 pm
Apr 22, 2018, 10:15 pm
#69
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Strict liability.
I want to see fines applied more consitently. If $500 is excessive, then the policy needs to be changed. This would be the only chance this perp has to get out of this fine.
Honestly I think the fine is very reasonable; deterrence is clearly the goal, and tossing a free apple would hardly have the corrective effect on the perp's behaviour than a reasonable fine would.
An overreaction would have been to send her to secondary for a more exhaustive search for other contraband, and question the purpose for her travel, etc... $500 is getting off light.
I am curious what lawyer convinced her to sign a retainer...
I want to see fines applied more consitently. If $500 is excessive, then the policy needs to be changed. This would be the only chance this perp has to get out of this fine.
Honestly I think the fine is very reasonable; deterrence is clearly the goal, and tossing a free apple would hardly have the corrective effect on the perp's behaviour than a reasonable fine would.
An overreaction would have been to send her to secondary for a more exhaustive search for other contraband, and question the purpose for her travel, etc... $500 is getting off light.
I am curious what lawyer convinced her to sign a retainer...
Apr 22, 2018, 10:18 pm
#70
Join Date: Mar 2010
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"this perp." omg. I've entered a different reality with crazy people.
Apr 22, 2018, 10:53 pm
#71
Join Date: Mar 2015
Posts: 1,989
This. I'm guessing there's more to the story around exactly how her interaction with the CBP agent went down. I wouldn't be surprised if she believed having GE made her special enough to skirt the rules.
It's likely those agents see innocent snacks and such all the time, usually followed by a quick explanation and confiscating/trashing the item in question. Those agents probably don't want to write up the citation/fine or whatever any more than a passenger wants to pay a fine.
It's likely those agents see innocent snacks and such all the time, usually followed by a quick explanation and confiscating/trashing the item in question. Those agents probably don't want to write up the citation/fine or whatever any more than a passenger wants to pay a fine.
I remember in my earlier trips to the US, I did not thought that the form declarations on food included airplane sandwiches.
Sometimes, I just was not hungry and saved them for the connecting domestic flights.
Then this 1 trip, I got a random check and was asked why did I lie on my declaration.
I explained (1) this was unintentional (2) this was airline food (3) I now know better and will not do it again. (4) apologised
The agent gave me a long lecture, a warning and let me off without a fine.
Honestly, being a work trip, I was less worried about a fine then being denied entry for this and subsequent visits.
I do not bring food into the US again, airplane stuff or not.
Apr 22, 2018, 11:00 pm
#72
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 40
What could possibly happen with just a single apple? Well, Often1 gave the reason. Here's the example that Customs and Border Patrol give on their website.
Here's another quotation from that website that I found highly interesting.
Source for both quotes (click "Fruits and Vegetables" in the gray box): https://www.cbp.gov/travel/us-citizens/know-before-you-go/prohibited-and-restricted-items
One good example of problems imported fruits and vegetables can cause is the Mediterranean fruit fly outbreak during the 1980s. The outbreak cost the state of California and the federal government approximately $100 million to get rid of this pest. The cause of the outbreak was one traveler who brought home one contaminated piece of fruit. It is best not to bring fresh fruits or vegetables into the United States.
I grew up in Southern California in the 80s. I remember not being able to go outside some nights because they were spraying malathion to get rid of those insects.Here's another quotation from that website that I found highly interesting.
Note: The civil penalty for failing to declare agricultural items at U.S. ports of entry will cost first time offenders $300. The penalty for the second violation goes up to $500. To avoid receiving a penalty all agricultural items and present them to Customs and Border Protection for inspection so that an agriculture specialist can determine if it is admissible.
If the penalties are correct and the reporting is accurate, perhaps this was the second time this woman "forgot" to declare contraband fruit. Given that possibility, I'm not sure I'd rush to defend her without learning more about exactly what happened.Source for both quotes (click "Fruits and Vegetables" in the gray box): https://www.cbp.gov/travel/us-citizens/know-before-you-go/prohibited-and-restricted-items
She is making a stink about this being Delta's fault because she is looking for a payout. She can't sue CBP.
Last edited by ellenyc; Apr 22, 2018 at 11:07 pm
Apr 22, 2018, 11:13 pm
#73
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Yep. One of my favorite trips of all time. But, going through customs was quite memorable. First, they take my hiking sticks out and wash them since they were muddy. Then they x-ray all your baggage and ask me about the contents of my trail mix that is in my luggage. I was able to recite the ingredients (peanut brittle, dried fruit, nuts) and I was able to go. There was no random x-raying of baggage. They x-rayed everyone's baggage. But, OTOH, the customs agent was extremely nice and professional. I did appreciate that.
They also made several PA announcements warning you that there is zero tolerance for any fruit or dairy products and there would be instant fines if you were caught.
As an aside, my mother in law tried to send mini pumpkins to her daughter in Auckland for Halloween. The package was x-rayed and the pumpkins were destroyed and a note was sent back to my MIL that she was on a watch list.
They also made several PA announcements warning you that there is zero tolerance for any fruit or dairy products and there would be instant fines if you were caught.
As an aside, my mother in law tried to send mini pumpkins to her daughter in Auckland for Halloween. The package was x-rayed and the pumpkins were destroyed and a note was sent back to my MIL that she was on a watch list.
Apr 22, 2018, 11:27 pm
#74
Join Date: Nov 2013
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She has Global Entry, considered a trusted traveller to know and obey the rules. Claiming ignorance or forgetfulness doesn’t cut it as a trusted traveller. And blaming Delta because they shouldn’t have given her the apple that she neglected to declare? 
This whole culture of blaming others when one gets caught at something makes me crazy. Here’s a novel idea - how about adults (with Global Entry no less) taking responsibility for their actions?
This whole culture of blaming others when one gets caught at something makes me crazy. Here’s a novel idea - how about adults (with Global Entry no less) taking responsibility for their actions?
Apr 23, 2018, 1:00 am
#75
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Actually, if you read the post I quoted, you'll note it mentions 'disrespect'. And CBP having the attitude you described in your example is precisely what many fear from CBP/ICE. The job description of ICE/CBP or most Customer Service professionals is to NOT 'ignore the rules for people I personally like". If you're defending the CBP for 'punishing someone by going by the book' and rewarding 'nice' people by ignoring the book, then I'd have to disagree with you. CBP officers aren't there to interpret the law, but to enforce it equally. Perhaps the CBP officer was doing precisely that. I don't like the law, but if it is the law, the CBP should enforce it in all cases. .
I feel bad for many people who run afoul of this law. I think its poorly described to people. CBP could do a better of at informing passengers of the law.
I feel bad for many people who run afoul of this law. I think its poorly described to people. CBP could do a better of at informing passengers of the law.