I don't think the eu doesn't have the right to regulate how credit cards are accepted within its domain...things like this are done all the time.

There have been deadlines for acceptance of numerous payment system standards in the EU and elsewhere. Without digressing into technical irrelevancy, account numbering conventions were mandated and have been adopted, large numbers of Euro-zone standards have been mandated and adopted. If the EU mandates that precise thing they can. If you want to see what the European Central Bank says about these issues go here:
http://www.ecb.int/paym/sepa/about/i.../index.en.html

The graphs and statistics can make you go almsot crazy, but the obvious conclusion is that non-emv card transactions are unwelcome in the Euro-area. From their perspective it is simple. The US, Russia and Equador are holding up Euro area standards. Equador is only a factor for Spain but it is important there. The US and Russia are ubiquitous. Many Russian banks are beginning to issue chip/pin international cards and the US is slowly creaking to the same end.

What happens if Europe says enough is enough? First MasterCard and Visa will cheer loudly. Second, a handful of card manufacturers will have a windfall like nobody has seen as the US converts en-mass.

It is the US massive investment and scale of conversion that holds people up. The easiest analogy is to the metric system. An installed base so huge does not easily convert. The US is not so very antiquated in thinking, it just was the first huge adopter so has the greatest difficulty to change.

Why would USA issuers need to convert domestic card networks to EMV to accommodate international travelers? If the typical household has a half-dozen credit or debit card accounts, they only need one or two with EMV capability to use abroad. It seems no different than Verizon and Sprint offering a small number of GSM compatible handsets for use in Europe, while continuing to use CDMA for domestic service.

For that purpose, I agree they would not. However there are many more Europeans visiting the US than there are US visiting Europe IIRC. The lack of EMV universally at POS in the US inhibits system integrity and exposes systemic fraud. In effect, bad money drive out good and fraud goes to the weakest link.

All the data suggests that has not yet happened. Personally I expect it to very quickly. Then the US will need to convert to close the two major open gaps in the system. There are fairly strong forces moving in that direction anyway IMO.

BTW, only at FlyerTalk has this conversation been this detailed in my experience. Usually this debate happens only with a roomful of industry executives armed with tons of graphs, charts, trend lines and risk data.

This conversation is more fun than the other ones but I am well paid for those. Some would say overpaid. :eek:

Of course the USA sees no problem in being contrary minded in so many respects which in the end makes it citizens very poor travellers. Why is the USA still on the antiquated Farenheit thermometer scale? The imperial measurement system? Why dos the USA use different frequencies on its mobile phone networks and even different technologies? Is it arrogance? Is it ignorance?

Why does the USA continue to drain its treasury albeit not the biggest problem with its deficit with his continued insistance of issuing paper money for amounts as trivial as $1? The europeans saw the folly in that and the smallest paper money in euroland is €5 with coins for €1 and €2. The same is true in Britain. No paper currency for £1 ir £2; just nice solid coins. Canada has long had a looney and a twoney. I don't get it.

Doesn't the USA consider itself part of the same world as everybody else? Just asking.

;Been to Scotland ;) ?

Mia..I think that was true until very recently but I don't believe any of the Scottish banks are currently issuing £1 banknotes; at least I didn't see any during my last trip to Scotland in August.

The US continuing to issue $1 bills does have its positives when travelling abroad and making exchanges for local currency and back again. Not many exchangers and banks stock up on the major currencies' coins, only the bills.

Hence an American who just arrived in Korea could change USD 137 and the Korean bank will accept the hundred dollar bill, the twenty, the ten and the seven one dollar bills. But if a person from Europe tried to exchange EUR 137 and if the 7 EUR was only available in 1 or 2 EUR coins, the max the Korean bank would accept is the EUR 130 that are in notes only.

Works the other way around too; if you finished your business in Korea and decide to exchange back say 100,000 KRW back into USD, you get the full 89 bucks back in bills (probably a fifty, a twenty, a ten, a five and four ones). But try to do it into EUR, since the Korean bank doesn't stock up on EUR coins, you probably end up only with 60 EUR and the remaining in small Korean change that you probably don't know if you're going to use again (though it does make good change for those UNICEF rounds during the return flight)

Considering that the USD is still the largest traded currency in the world, it makes sense for the US Treasury to continue printing $1 bills. Plus, people in developing countries still prefer the $1 bill for small tips; as with the rationale above that banks overseas don't accept foreign coins, it makes them much easier to convert to local currency over tipping them with four quarters or the Sacagawea dollar coin.

Until inflation hits 500% in the strip dancer entertainment industry, we need $1 notes :D

Is the US ready to give up strip dancer entertainment?

Way-y-y underpaid strippers!
 

Are you implying there are no strip clubs in Europe???

;-D

Only a cheapskate American would count it a good thing that our $1 paper money allows our strippers to be the most underpaid in the world!

... But if we did phase out $1 bills, the solution to that non-problem is easy: casinos sell stacks of chips; why shouldn't strip clubs sell stacks of "stripper bills"?

Salut!

-- C

They make up for it by charging a substantial cover fee. Then there is generally very little tipping, and little incentive for the dancers to please the clients, I hear. Some clients will supposedly toss fives around, but I suspect it's atypical to way overpay the dancers like that.

Tip your dancers better!
 

Well, I must admit my experience is limited. As a straight woman, I've only ever gone to strip clubs in mixed company... and the presence of other women who are not strippers may affect the tipping behavior of gentlemen.

However, my friends and I were never so cheap as to ONLY tip $1 bills. Both sexes enjoyed making the dancers smile!

;-D

Salut!

-- Claudia

Moderator observation
 

Discussion has drifted too far afield, please return to the EMV topic.

Many thinks for your most helpful replies. Sounds as if we should be okay in Spain, but I'll make sure I get a good number of euros at the airport when we arrive.

I do wonder about train tickets. In Italy many train kiosks only take EMV cards and the lines at staffed windows were often long. With luck I'll be able to buy tickets for Spanish trains online.

A bit off topic, but yesterday, I was able to top-up a tmobile uk sim online with a US issued amex card (MC and V wouldn't work). Last time I tried, no US card worked.

Are you serious? The first paragraph, I can see your point. I don't necessarily agree, but those are valid positions. But the second? You can't be serious. Coins are the most awful thing ever created. They are unuseful, they are space consuming, they are heavy, they damage everything in your pockets, this list is endless. THe cost of paper money is the price you pay for having a more useful physical product. I literally give away most of my change these days because it is so awful to carry. Thankfully I use a debit card for 99% of my transactions, so it's not putting me in the poorhouse. If the US switched to coins for small dollar denominations, I would probably end up 100% debit/credit. And anyone like a Valet would not get a tip.