Jan 16, 2017, 6:55 am
Last edit by: storewanderer
Older (archived) threads: 2014-16
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- What is EMV contactless?
EMV contactless is a form of contactless/NFC that uses the same security and encryption that is used when inserting a chip card into an EMV-enabled terminal. Other than not having to sign/enter a PIN for smaller transactions, the security is effectively the same as chip and PIN/chip and signature.
In contrast, MSD contactless is an older version that is designed just and only for the United States. This effectively uses much the same flow as a swiped card transaction with the same rules.
- What is CDCVM?
CDCVM stands for Consumer Device Cardholder Verification Method. It's a method of telling the terminal that the customer verified their identity using their mobile device. Terminals that support it will waive the signature/PIN requirement typically in place for larger transactions, potentially saving time at checkout.
More info: https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT202527
- Does EMV contactless need to be supported to support CDCVM?
Typically, yes. (However, there are some exceptions below.)
- Why can't I tap my foreign-issued contactless card at most places in the US?
This is likely because the store does not support EMV contactless. Foreign issued contactless cards typically do not support MSD contactless since other markets have had EMV for quite some time. In contrast, most stores in the US have yet to get the necessary certifications/software for EMV contactless so they are typically MSD-only--if contactless is enabled at all. (See below for a list of stores where your card will likely work.)
- I paid for a purchase with Apple/Android/Samsung Pay and still had to sign for it.
Most likely, the store in question does not have EMV contactless enabled (see above question). However, there are instances where CDCVM does not work even with EMV contactless enabled. Restaurants that allow tip adjust, for example--where the tip amount is written on a paper receipt and entered by the staff later--cannot support CDCVM. It may simply be a matter of the merchant's processor or the POS software in use not supporting it too.
Another common reason is if you used a US-issued AmEx card with a mobile wallet. AmEx currently does not allow EMV contactless support in mobile wallets for these cards, so they always run as MSD contactless. Because of this, CDCVM is not supported (with very few exceptions, as noted below).
Note: if you used Samsung Pay, you may have paid with MST instead of NFC. Since MST emulates the magnetic pulses that the terminal receives when swiping a regular card, the normal magstripe rules apply.
- How can I tell whether EMV contactless was used?
An easy way to tell if you have Apple Pay is to pay with a Visa or MC while in airplane mode. Wallet will then show a transaction amount next to "Payment" for the card that was used. Alternatively, EMV-related information will typically print on the receipt (AID, etc.) if EMV contactless was used.
(Non-exhaustive) list of EMV contactless supporting merchants in the US:
- 7-Eleven
- 99 Ranch
- Albertsons (Safeway, Vons, Pak N Save, Jewel, Acme, Shaws, Star, Carrs, Randalls, Tom Thumb, Haggen, Eagle, Lucky UT/SoCal)
- Apple Store*†
- Athleta
- Auntie Anne’s Pretzels
- Banana Republic
- Costco Wholesale
- CVS
- DuaneReade*
- El Pollo Loco
- EG Group US (Quik Stop, Kwik Shop, Tom Thumb, Turkey Hill) Note: cashier must press "Electronic Payment" to activate NFC
- Five Below*
- Five Guys
- GAP
- Grocery Outlet*
- Harmon's Grocery
- H&M*
- Jolibee
- Kohl's*
- Lush Cosmetics*
- Maverik
- McDonald's*
- Meijer
- Old Navy
- Panera Bread
- PetSmart
- Ray's Food Place
- Round Table Pizza
- Royal Farms
- Red Ribbon Bakeshop
- Sheetz
- Sherm's Thunderbird Discount Markets Inc.*
- Sprouts
- Staples*
- Starbucks*
- Subway
- Walgreens*
- Weis Markets
- All businesses that use Square and support contactless*
- All businesses that use Clover and support EMV†**
- All businesses that use First Data standalone terminals (e.g. FD100+FD35, FD130) with EMV enabled**
* CDCVM support confirmed
** CDCVM support depends on store/restaurant
† CDCVM supported in MSD mode
USA contactless credit/debit/transit (2017 - 2021)
May 1, 2019, 2:54 am
#6166
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 49
Speaking of NYC, this article makes it sound like all of the lines will get it this summer, not just the previously mentioned few.
What Cook actually said was "More and more transit systems are accepting Apple Pay and New York's MTA system will begin the rollout in early summer." The MTA's schedule for the subway is turnstiles at approx. 15 4/5/6 stations by the end of May, with 10-15 new stations coming online each month, eventually accelerating. The whole rollout is scheduled to take 18 months.There's more details here: https://new.mta.info/omny
May 1, 2019, 6:47 am
#6167
Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 201
So it seems that all of the Circle K's in my area (Arizona market) have been upgrading their older fleet of pumps now. They are in line with the new white ones they got that have EMV, and NFC readers, with NFC being the only thing that works. The EMV reader is unfortunately still not enabled yet. I am thinking that with the EMV reader upgrade going on all the older pumps, it is preparing Circle K now with a gas pump EMV rollout. No joke this one got upgraded this morning. On my way to work, it was the old b&w screen, and tonight, it changed, literally an overnight (overpay) changed.
May 1, 2019, 6:19 pm
#6168
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 1,723
Well I just went to Chick fil A and Google Pay Visa debit did not work anymore it just beeped at me and wouldn't go through but Amex tapped worked fine.
May 1, 2019, 6:41 pm
#6169
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Looks like Visa is all in on EMV contactless. As per the latest Visa rules, MSD support needs to go away altogether after October of this year for US terminals (not just enable EMV contactless):
A few thoughts on this:
A few thoughts on this:
- If we're already having a hard time getting stores to enable EMV contactless, I'm not sure getting rid of MSD is going to do much better.
- Is six months really enough time? (Then again, perhaps it's just a configuration change and thus should be a lot easier to implement in a timely manner.)
May 2, 2019, 8:16 am
#6170
Join Date: Sep 2015
Posts: 53
MacRumors often has trouble with accuracy. What Cook actually said was "More and more transit systems are accepting Apple Pay and New York's MTA system will begin the rollout in early summer." The MTA's schedule for the subway is turnstiles at approx. 15 4/5/6 stations by the end of May, with 10-15 new stations coming online each month, eventually accelerating. The whole rollout is scheduled to take 18 months.
There's more details here: https://new.mta.info/omny
What Cook actually said was "More and more transit systems are accepting Apple Pay and New York's MTA system will begin the rollout in early summer." The MTA's schedule for the subway is turnstiles at approx. 15 4/5/6 stations by the end of May, with 10-15 new stations coming online each month, eventually accelerating. The whole rollout is scheduled to take 18 months.There's more details here: https://new.mta.info/omny
Interesting
May 2, 2019, 8:38 am
#6171
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May 2, 2019, 3:25 pm
#6172
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Looks like Arco fixed whatever the issue was that caused contactless to be disabled on the MX915s. The four tiny circles now appear at the very top of the display after the first item's scanned. (I don't know if anything else has changed, e.g. support for EMV contactless or Quick Chip, since I tend to pay cash there to avoid the 35c debit surcharge.)
Also, still no contactless at Taco Bell.
BTW: Fifth Third has contactless cards as well and Citizens Bank seems to be going to issue them soon per this article.
Also, still no contactless at Taco Bell.
BTW: Fifth Third has contactless cards as well and Citizens Bank seems to be going to issue them soon per this article.
Last edited by tmiw; May 2, 2019 at 3:34 pm
May 2, 2019, 4:17 pm
#6173
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Perhaps OT, but maybe not as it is contactless-related. Had the following offer on my Hilton Amex today:
Spend $5 or more, get $2 back, up to 5x
Apple Pay
Spend $5 or more, get $2 back, up to 5x
Apple Pay
EXPIRES
9/30/2019
May 2, 2019, 4:46 pm
#6174
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I don't see that on any of my AmEx cards. I'm probably not the target audience for that kind of deal though.
May 3, 2019, 12:17 pm
#6175
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Is it me or does contactless processing tend to go down in the UK an awful lot? For example: https://www.stokesentinel.co.uk/news...ken-uk-2826373
At least contactless problems in the US tend to be due to merchant software bugs and not system-wide outages. Which, of course, isn't good either, but most people still tend to have alternative merchants that they can go to.
At least contactless problems in the US tend to be due to merchant software bugs and not system-wide outages. Which, of course, isn't good either, but most people still tend to have alternative merchants that they can go to.
May 3, 2019, 1:14 pm
#6176
Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 201
Is it me or does contactless processing tend to go down in the UK an awful lot? For example: https://www.stokesentinel.co.uk/news...ken-uk-2826373
At least contactless problems in the US tend to be due to merchant software bugs and not system-wide outages. Which, of course, isn't good either, but most people still tend to have alternative merchants that they can go to.
At least contactless problems in the US tend to be due to merchant software bugs and not system-wide outages. Which, of course, isn't good either, but most people still tend to have alternative merchants that they can go to.
May 3, 2019, 1:19 pm
#6177
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I'm only spitballing on this, but I wonder if it has to do with how terminals in many other countries are deployed. Even at big retailers, they're leased from the processing banks, while in the US, they're purchased/leased and managed by the individual retailers (outside of smaller businesses that do lease from banks). In that case, it could be a particular processor having an outage and a number of stores are down.
However, I suppose it is possible that there are enough processors in the US such that one going down isn't going to have a large enough impact to be regional or national news. Have there been any outages in the recent past?
May 3, 2019, 1:26 pm
#6178
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I went to an Arco that takes credit cards (without extra fees, even). I tapped my Chase card on the MX915 while the cashier was ringing up my items; it then went to Approved immediately once she finished and I confirmed the amount. No EMV info on the receipt, nor did EMV work outside, so I'm thinking MSD only.
Also, the QSR that had the VIVOpay readers under the counter moved them on top and put Apple Pay stickers on them. I guess too many people got confused by the previous setup? No EMV info on the receipt either (nor were there chip terminals anywhere)--kinda like Tender Greens in that regard.
Anyway, hopefully this changes soon because I wouldn't be surprised if new contactless cards and mobile wallet adds stop getting MSD provisioned in light of Visa's rule changes.
Also, the QSR that had the VIVOpay readers under the counter moved them on top and put Apple Pay stickers on them. I guess too many people got confused by the previous setup? No EMV info on the receipt either (nor were there chip terminals anywhere)--kinda like Tender Greens in that regard.
Anyway, hopefully this changes soon because I wouldn't be surprised if new contactless cards and mobile wallet adds stop getting MSD provisioned in light of Visa's rule changes.
May 3, 2019, 8:49 pm
#6180
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Supposedly some of those are capable of EMV contactless but I'm not sure how likely that'll be.