Jan 16, 2017, 6:55 am
Last edit by: storewanderer
Older (archived) threads: 2014-16
- - - - - -
- What is EMV contactless?
EMV contactless is a form of contactless/NFC that uses the same security and encryption that is used when inserting a chip card into an EMV-enabled terminal. Other than not having to sign/enter a PIN for smaller transactions, the security is effectively the same as chip and PIN/chip and signature.
In contrast, MSD contactless is an older version that is designed just and only for the United States. This effectively uses much the same flow as a swiped card transaction with the same rules.
- What is CDCVM?
CDCVM stands for Consumer Device Cardholder Verification Method. It's a method of telling the terminal that the customer verified their identity using their mobile device. Terminals that support it will waive the signature/PIN requirement typically in place for larger transactions, potentially saving time at checkout.
More info: https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT202527
- Does EMV contactless need to be supported to support CDCVM?
Typically, yes. (However, there are some exceptions below.)
- Why can't I tap my foreign-issued contactless card at most places in the US?
This is likely because the store does not support EMV contactless. Foreign issued contactless cards typically do not support MSD contactless since other markets have had EMV for quite some time. In contrast, most stores in the US have yet to get the necessary certifications/software for EMV contactless so they are typically MSD-only--if contactless is enabled at all. (See below for a list of stores where your card will likely work.)
- I paid for a purchase with Apple/Android/Samsung Pay and still had to sign for it.
Most likely, the store in question does not have EMV contactless enabled (see above question). However, there are instances where CDCVM does not work even with EMV contactless enabled. Restaurants that allow tip adjust, for example--where the tip amount is written on a paper receipt and entered by the staff later--cannot support CDCVM. It may simply be a matter of the merchant's processor or the POS software in use not supporting it too.
Another common reason is if you used a US-issued AmEx card with a mobile wallet. AmEx currently does not allow EMV contactless support in mobile wallets for these cards, so they always run as MSD contactless. Because of this, CDCVM is not supported (with very few exceptions, as noted below).
Note: if you used Samsung Pay, you may have paid with MST instead of NFC. Since MST emulates the magnetic pulses that the terminal receives when swiping a regular card, the normal magstripe rules apply.
- How can I tell whether EMV contactless was used?
An easy way to tell if you have Apple Pay is to pay with a Visa or MC while in airplane mode. Wallet will then show a transaction amount next to "Payment" for the card that was used. Alternatively, EMV-related information will typically print on the receipt (AID, etc.) if EMV contactless was used.
(Non-exhaustive) list of EMV contactless supporting merchants in the US:
- 7-Eleven
- 99 Ranch
- Albertsons (Safeway, Vons, Pak N Save, Jewel, Acme, Shaws, Star, Carrs, Randalls, Tom Thumb, Haggen, Eagle, Lucky UT/SoCal)
- Apple Store*†
- Athleta
- Auntie Anne’s Pretzels
- Banana Republic
- Costco Wholesale
- CVS
- DuaneReade*
- El Pollo Loco
- EG Group US (Quik Stop, Kwik Shop, Tom Thumb, Turkey Hill) Note: cashier must press "Electronic Payment" to activate NFC
- Five Below*
- Five Guys
- GAP
- Grocery Outlet*
- Harmon's Grocery
- H&M*
- Jolibee
- Kohl's*
- Lush Cosmetics*
- Maverik
- McDonald's*
- Meijer
- Old Navy
- Panera Bread
- PetSmart
- Ray's Food Place
- Round Table Pizza
- Royal Farms
- Red Ribbon Bakeshop
- Sheetz
- Sherm's Thunderbird Discount Markets Inc.*
- Sprouts
- Staples*
- Starbucks*
- Subway
- Walgreens*
- Weis Markets
- All businesses that use Square and support contactless*
- All businesses that use Clover and support EMV†**
- All businesses that use First Data standalone terminals (e.g. FD100+FD35, FD130) with EMV enabled**
* CDCVM support confirmed
** CDCVM support depends on store/restaurant
† CDCVM supported in MSD mode
USA contactless credit/debit/transit (2017 - 2021)
Mar 30, 2018, 4:03 pm
#3706
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 1,723
Here are a some notable additions around me. It looks like a local Toshiba grocery store chain may have upgraded to chip/contactless but I'm sure the latter will end up being like Family Fare or Safeway so very borked. Olive Garden is on the ctls locator as expected and so is Krispy Kreme. Some closer BK's(Non-NCR) are as well but has anyone ever seen an NCR Aloha BK with VX820's because all NCR locations I've seen still do not have pinpads.
Mar 30, 2018, 4:35 pm
#3707
Join Date: Oct 2014
Programs: Skymiles
Posts: 3,251
Remember just because a place falls off the contactless locator does not mean that it won't work. An example of this is Shell stations as many fall off or aren't on there yet they still work just fine if you tap.
Here are a some notable additions around me. It looks like a local Toshiba grocery store chain may have upgraded to chip/contactless but I'm sure the latter will end up being like Family Fare or Safeway so very borked. Olive Garden is on the ctls locator as expected and so is Krispy Kreme. Some closer BK's(Non-NCR) are as well but has anyone ever seen an NCR Aloha BK with VX820's because all NCR locations I've seen still do not have pinpads.
Here are a some notable additions around me. It looks like a local Toshiba grocery store chain may have upgraded to chip/contactless but I'm sure the latter will end up being like Family Fare or Safeway so very borked. Olive Garden is on the ctls locator as expected and so is Krispy Kreme. Some closer BK's(Non-NCR) are as well but has anyone ever seen an NCR Aloha BK with VX820's because all NCR locations I've seen still do not have pinpads.
Mar 30, 2018, 7:21 pm
#3708
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Northern Virginia
Posts: 1,592
Remind me to never move to San Diego. Lol. Jk.
I feel it seems it definitely depends the area we are in. Here in Phoenix emv acceptance seems sky high. And no cash only places I know of. And Apple Pay is making it so I can pretty much depend on it 80% of my day (95% phone acceptance as a whole thanks to Walmart/Target/CVS/LevelUp Pay)
I feel it seems it definitely depends the area we are in. Here in Phoenix emv acceptance seems sky high. And no cash only places I know of. And Apple Pay is making it so I can pretty much depend on it 80% of my day (95% phone acceptance as a whole thanks to Walmart/Target/CVS/LevelUp Pay)
Mar 30, 2018, 7:27 pm
#3709
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: RSW
Programs: Delta - Silver; UA - Silver; HHonors - Diamond; IHG - Spire Ambassador; Marriott Bonvoy - Titanium
Posts: 14,185
For those of you who are tracking the growth of contactless, would you consider it to be worthwhile to have contactless available, but up pops the paper signature slip? I ran across this at an Indian buffet recently, where the owner was all smiles that I was going to use the "easier" contactless. It may have been easier for him, but not for me in this case particularly. All about the tip line ... phone tapped on his FD 40 (looked as though it was in conjunction with a Clover setup?)
Mar 31, 2018, 12:35 am
#3710
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: San Diego, CA
Programs: GE, Marriott Platinum
Posts: 15,508
I feel it seems it definitely depends the area we are in. Here in Phoenix emv acceptance seems sky high. And no cash only places I know of. And Apple Pay is making it so I can pretty much depend on it 80% of my day (95% phone acceptance as a whole thanks to Walmart/Target/CVS/LevelUp Pay)
In general though, I imagine I may have a better experience if my spending habits were just a bit different. My current ones tend to be worse case (e.g. lots of restaurants).
Remember just because a place falls off the contactless locator does not mean that it won't work. An example of this is Shell stations as many fall off or aren't on there yet they still work just fine if you tap.
Here are a some notable additions around me. It looks like a local Toshiba grocery store chain may have upgraded to chip/contactless but I'm sure the latter will end up being like Family Fare or Safeway so very borked. Olive Garden is on the ctls locator as expected and so is Krispy Kreme. Some closer BK's(Non-NCR) are as well but has anyone ever seen an NCR Aloha BK with VX820's because all NCR locations I've seen still do not have pinpads.
Here are a some notable additions around me. It looks like a local Toshiba grocery store chain may have upgraded to chip/contactless but I'm sure the latter will end up being like Family Fare or Safeway so very borked. Olive Garden is on the ctls locator as expected and so is Krispy Kreme. Some closer BK's(Non-NCR) are as well but has anyone ever seen an NCR Aloha BK with VX820's because all NCR locations I've seen still do not have pinpads.
Also, Olive Garden doesn't show up here but I definitely know it's enabled.
I also don't remember having issues the last time I was there but I think that might have been just as the rules around minimums and surcharges were changing.
For those of you who are tracking the growth of contactless, would you consider it to be worthwhile to have contactless available, but up pops the paper signature slip? I ran across this at an Indian buffet recently, where the owner was all smiles that I was going to use the "easier" contactless. It may have been easier for him, but not for me in this case particularly. All about the tip line ... phone tapped on his FD 40 (looked as though it was in conjunction with a Clover setup?)
Mar 31, 2018, 10:13 am
#3711
Join Date: Oct 2014
Programs: Skymiles
Posts: 3,251
The Starbucks and 7-Eleven apps are about the only retailer apps I bother using, and I really only go into the former for reloads as the card itself is in Wallet. I don't go to Walmart or Target often enough to justify using their apps (despite the latter only being a couple of blocks from me).
In general though, I imagine I may have a better experience if my spending habits were just a bit different. My current ones tend to be worse case (e.g. lots of restaurants).
Of course, but if they're relying on use of contactless to determine whether a business stays on there, that doesn't bode well for its overall use.
Also, Olive Garden doesn't show up here but I definitely know it's enabled.
Speaking of NYC and card acceptance: https://www.nytimes.com/2018/03/30/b...cashless-.html
I also don't remember having issues the last time I was there but I think that might have been just as the rules around minimums and surcharges were changing.
Eh, it's borderline for me in that scenario. Faster than chip without signature, sure, but just barely.
In general though, I imagine I may have a better experience if my spending habits were just a bit different. My current ones tend to be worse case (e.g. lots of restaurants).
Of course, but if they're relying on use of contactless to determine whether a business stays on there, that doesn't bode well for its overall use.
Also, Olive Garden doesn't show up here but I definitely know it's enabled.
Speaking of NYC and card acceptance: https://www.nytimes.com/2018/03/30/b...cashless-.html
I also don't remember having issues the last time I was there but I think that might have been just as the rules around minimums and surcharges were changing.
Eh, it's borderline for me in that scenario. Faster than chip without signature, sure, but just barely.
Mar 31, 2018, 10:41 am
#3712
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: San Diego, CA
Programs: GE, Marriott Platinum
Posts: 15,508
Mar 31, 2018, 10:50 am
#3713
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: SJC
Programs: AA, AS, Marriott
Posts: 6,066
Speaking of NYC and card acceptance: https://www.nytimes.com/2018/03/30/b...cashless-.html
I also don't remember having issues the last time I was there but I think that might have been just as the rules around minimums and surcharges were changing.
I also don't remember having issues the last time I was there but I think that might have been just as the rules around minimums and surcharges were changing.
I did notice the cashless sign at the Dos Toros at Hudson Eats in Brookfield Place.
Mar 31, 2018, 12:09 pm
#3714
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: San Diego, CA
Programs: GE, Marriott Platinum
Posts: 15,508
Mrs. Majuki and I were there last weekend, and for almost everything I used cards. It also might be a self selection based on where we tend to go on this thread. I perceived contactless acceptance as being lower than in the Bay Area, but that's possibly because Bay Area businesses are more likely to have something like a Clover style setup.
I did notice the cashless sign at the Dos Toros at Hudson Eats in Brookfield Place.
I did notice the cashless sign at the Dos Toros at Hudson Eats in Brookfield Place.
Speaking of Clover, I tapped with Apple Pay this morning and got the "no cardholder verification" bit on the receipt again. The next customer appeared to insert and sign afterward (though I'm not 100% sure on that). I'm thinking they just fixed contactless and didn't bother with eliminating signature completely just yet.
Mar 31, 2018, 2:25 pm
#3716
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Northern Virginia
Posts: 1,592
Speaking of NYC and card acceptance: https://www.nytimes.com/2018/03/30/b...cashless-.html
I also don't remember having issues the last time I was there but I think that might have been just as the rules around minimums and surcharges were changing.
I also don't remember having issues the last time I was there but I think that might have been just as the rules around minimums and surcharges were changing.
Mar 31, 2018, 3:37 pm
#3717
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: San Diego, CA
Programs: GE, Marriott Platinum
Posts: 15,508
Clover/FD really should have enforced more consistency in their software from the start, but if getting rid of signature ends up becoming common this might not matter.
Apr 1, 2018, 6:53 pm
#3718
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: San Diego, CA
Programs: GE, Marriott Platinum
Posts: 15,508
...and it looks like JCPenney's charge from the other day posted twice, too, despite the contactless payment attempt supposedly declining. This should be fun to try to resolve tomorrow. 
Apr 2, 2018, 8:46 am
#3719
Join Date: Mar 2017
Programs: HHonors, TrueBlue, Delta SkyMiles, Hyatt Discoverist, Starwood Preferred Guest, American Airlines.
Posts: 2,035
Apr 2, 2018, 9:49 am
#3720
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: San Diego, CA
Programs: GE, Marriott Platinum
Posts: 15,508