Mar 11, 2020, 10:13 am
Last edit by: Ocn Vw 1K
In order to reduce noise in the Coronavirus / Covid-19 : general fact-based reporting thread, and to create a central place to invite any member to ask a basic question about the impact of COVID-19 on travel, your moderators have decided to open this separate "lounge" thread for related discussion that isn't strictly fact-based reporting.
Any member who can provide a constructive, helpful answer to a question; or post constructively in reply to a member's point-of-view, is welcome to post.
All FT rules apply, including avoiding personalized, snarky, political, other off-topic, commercial, and repeatedly disruptive content.
Discussion of general economic impacts of Covid-19 belongs in the OMNI forum, not here.
Discussion and critique of political/government actions to aid the economy or which is far more political than related to COVID-19 is for the OMNI/PR forum, not here.
This is a protocol for posting adopted by the forum Moderator team:Please follow this protocol, based on FlyerTalk Rules and long-standing FlyerTalk best practices. Doing so will help keep the thread open, and allow our moderator team to aid members, rather than having to resort to discipline.
•Constructive, respectful posts, views, opinions, questions, and replies, related to the topic are welcome. Avoid commenting on members personally, or posting off-topic or political messages.
•While respectful disagreement of a posted view is allowed, don’t call-out posters to prove their points. FlyerTalk has never required discussion standards at the level of a Ph.D. dissertation defense, or a trial court witness cross-examination.
•After a reasonable exchange of views on a point, please yield the floor so that others may bring up different topics, questions or points.
•Especially important in this time of pandemic, when normal life and travel have been upended: please take regular breaks from the thread.
Please stay healthy,
your FT Coronavirus and Travel Moderator Team.
Any member who can provide a constructive, helpful answer to a question; or post constructively in reply to a member's point-of-view, is welcome to post.
All FT rules apply, including avoiding personalized, snarky, political, other off-topic, commercial, and repeatedly disruptive content.
Discussion of general economic impacts of Covid-19 belongs in the OMNI forum, not here.
Discussion and critique of political/government actions to aid the economy or which is far more political than related to COVID-19 is for the OMNI/PR forum, not here.
This is a protocol for posting adopted by the forum Moderator team:Please follow this protocol, based on FlyerTalk Rules and long-standing FlyerTalk best practices. Doing so will help keep the thread open, and allow our moderator team to aid members, rather than having to resort to discipline.
•Constructive, respectful posts, views, opinions, questions, and replies, related to the topic are welcome. Avoid commenting on members personally, or posting off-topic or political messages.
•While respectful disagreement of a posted view is allowed, don’t call-out posters to prove their points. FlyerTalk has never required discussion standards at the level of a Ph.D. dissertation defense, or a trial court witness cross-examination.
•After a reasonable exchange of views on a point, please yield the floor so that others may bring up different topics, questions or points.
•Especially important in this time of pandemic, when normal life and travel have been upended: please take regular breaks from the thread.
Please stay healthy,
your FT Coronavirus and Travel Moderator Team.
COVID-19: Lounge thread for thoughts, concerns and questions
May 11, 2020, 12:32 pm
#2851
Join Date: Dec 2018
Location: PHX
Programs: Delta DM, Marriott Lifetime Titanium, HHonrs Diamond
Posts: 1,336
Any information on Antibody testing in either Wash DC or Florida? I need to (read: must) make multiple trips within the next 2 months and I would like to know if I have CoVid antibodies, it would allow me to somewhat relax on quarantine restrictions and interact with older family members as well as finalize some documents under deadline with embassies.
I was affected with a respiratory illness in February for 3 weeks after an international flight, and just 2 weeks I had a 6-week respiratory illness (resulting in needing a Zpack, Albuterol inhaler, etc) after yet another flight. I am thinking that might have been the virus all along.
Thanks for any info.
I was affected with a respiratory illness in February for 3 weeks after an international flight, and just 2 weeks I had a 6-week respiratory illness (resulting in needing a Zpack, Albuterol inhaler, etc) after yet another flight. I am thinking that might have been the virus all along.
Thanks for any info.
The tests are not specific enough and you don't know what antibodies they look at.
Moreover, exposure, which the tests can assess, is not immunity. They are OK to determine population exposure but not good enough for individuals.
Soon we will have tests that look for the neutralizing antibodies and give a titer (level) of such to confirm immunity better.
But many others recover with no neutralizing antibodies but virus-specific T-cells.
If you are curious and want to do the test, then do it, but it should not change anything you do with regard to mask wearing and personal hygiene. And if you get a fever and cough, then get a CV-19 PCR test and if +, you never had it before and the antibody test was wrong.
May 11, 2020, 12:33 pm
#2852
Suspended
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Bay Area
Programs: DL SM, UA MP.
Posts: 12,729
Renowned virologist Peter Piot had the infection from March and April. This is his account.
But he issues a warning about long-term effects, which may be as consequential as the IFR.
https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2020...death-covid-19
But he issues a warning about long-term effects, which may be as consequential as the IFR.
Many people think COVID-19 kills 1% of patients, and the rest get away with some flulike symptoms. But the story gets more complicated. Many people will be left with chronic kidney and heart problems. Even their neural system is disrupted. There will be hundreds of thousands of people worldwide, possibly more, who will need treatments such as renal dialysis for the rest of their lives. The more we learn about the coronavirus, the more questions arise. We are learning while we are sailing. That’s why I get so annoyed by the many commentators on the sidelines who, without much insight, criticize the scientists and policymakers trying hard to get the epidemic under control. That’s very unfair.
May 11, 2020, 12:35 pm
#2853
Suspended
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Bay Area
Programs: DL SM, UA MP.
Posts: 12,729
Meanwhile regarding flying, you can make plans to minimize chances of exposure but you could face this.
So, for instance, fly premium cabin, in a 1-2-1 config vs. 2-2-2 or even worse 2-4-2? Of course such premium cabins imply a intercontinental flight of at least 7-8 hours or more.
So more space but longer exposure, more chances to be exposed from the bathroom.
So, for instance, fly premium cabin, in a 1-2-1 config vs. 2-2-2 or even worse 2-4-2? Of course such premium cabins imply a intercontinental flight of at least 7-8 hours or more.
So more space but longer exposure, more chances to be exposed from the bathroom.
May 11, 2020, 1:18 pm
#2854
Suspended
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 687
It's a shame. My 93 year old grandmother is still relatively healthy and independent but she has been confined in her small suite for 2 months now without any visitors or being allowed to go outside. That is a big routine change for someone who was used to going out for walks and shopping-restaurant outings. And despite all these measures, 98% of deaths in my province are in retirement homes. I wonder what is the point of everything we've been doing to ''save lives'.
May 11, 2020, 1:28 pm
#2855
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: RBKC
Programs: AA EXP and Eurostar Carte Blanche
Posts: 3,851
Don't do it. The tests are not specific enough and you don't know what antibodies they look at… Soon we will have tests that look for the neutralizing antibodies and give a titer (level) of such to confirm immunity better. But many others recover with no neutralizing antibodies but virus-specific T-cells.
May 11, 2020, 2:00 pm
#2856
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: May 2000
Location: أمريكا
Posts: 26,763
Any information on Antibody testing in either Wash DC or Florida? I need to (read: must) make multiple trips within the next 2 months and I would like to know if I have CoVid antibodies, it would allow me to somewhat relax on quarantine restrictions and interact with older family members as well as finalize some documents under deadline with embassies.
I was affected with a respiratory illness in February for 3 weeks after an international flight, and just 2 weeks I had a 6-week respiratory illness (resulting in needing a Zpack, Albuterol inhaler, etc) after yet another flight. I am thinking that might have been the virus all along.
Thanks for any info.
I was affected with a respiratory illness in February for 3 weeks after an international flight, and just 2 weeks I had a 6-week respiratory illness (resulting in needing a Zpack, Albuterol inhaler, etc) after yet another flight. I am thinking that might have been the virus all along.
Thanks for any info.
May 11, 2020, 3:18 pm
#2857
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Madison, WI, USA
Posts: 14,162
Fortunately I won't need to travel internationally until the end of September when my visa expires, but I expect I might travel within Vietnam sometime before that. I read that people are already going to Hoi An for site-seeing. I usually fly coach for the short trips, but I will pay extra for business and hope there's no one next to me. Mask, wipes and sanitizer, of course. If there is a return of community transmissions here, I won't travel.
May 11, 2020, 4:19 pm
#2858
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Long Island, NY
Programs: AA EXP, Hyatt Explorist, Marriott Gold
Posts: 732
Here in NYC, free antibody testing is now offered at a few locations. Managed to get an appointment this week. Will report back.
https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/loca...-test/2406407/
https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/loca...-test/2406407/
May 11, 2020, 4:41 pm
#2859
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: SFO
Programs: UA 1K, AA EXP, Hyatt Glob, Hilton Diamond, Marriott Plat, Total Wine & More Reserve
Posts: 4,528
That makes sense, yes.
The annoying thing is the use of 'face' when a news article includes the 'studies' that state how many times one touches one's face per hour.
I still touch my face often (
), but hardly ever my mouth, eyes, or nose. It's mostly chin, ears, forehead, hair.
The annoying thing is the use of 'face' when a news article includes the 'studies' that state how many times one touches one's face per hour.
I still touch my face often (
), but hardly ever my mouth, eyes, or nose. It's mostly chin, ears, forehead, hair.
May 11, 2020, 4:47 pm
#2860
Join Date: Dec 2018
Location: PHX
Programs: Delta DM, Marriott Lifetime Titanium, HHonrs Diamond
Posts: 1,336
Here in NYC, free antibody testing is now offered at a few locations. Managed to get an appointment this week. Will report back.
https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/loca...-test/2406407/
https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/loca...-test/2406407/
If it is the same one they used for the larger statewide studies, then it has a 4-5% false positive rate, which is huge.
Summary of antibody tests by vendor: https://www.centerforhealthsecurity....-COVID-19.html
May 11, 2020, 5:10 pm
#2861
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Truth or Consequences, NM
Programs: HH Diamond, Marriott Titanium, Hertz President's Circle, UA Silver, Mobile Passport Unobtanium
Posts: 6,195
See if you can find out which test they are using.
If it is the same one they used for the larger statewide studies, then it has a 4-5% false positive rate, which is huge.
Summary of antibody tests by vendor: https://www.centerforhealthsecurity....-COVID-19.html
If it is the same one they used for the larger statewide studies, then it has a 4-5% false positive rate, which is huge.
Summary of antibody tests by vendor: https://www.centerforhealthsecurity....-COVID-19.html
May 11, 2020, 5:50 pm
#2862
Join Date: Dec 2018
Location: PHX
Programs: Delta DM, Marriott Lifetime Titanium, HHonrs Diamond
Posts: 1,336
Also this...
- This test has not been reviewed by the FDA.
- Negative results do not rule out SARS-CoV-2 infection, particularly in those who have been in contact with the virus. Follow-up testing with a molecular diagnostic should be considered to rule out infection in these individuals.
- Results from antibody testing should not be used as the sole basis to diagnose or exclude SARS-CoV-2 infection or to inform infection status.
- Positive results may be due to past or present infection with non-SARS-CoV-2 coronavirus strains, such as coronavirus HKU1, NL63, OC43, or 229E.
May 11, 2020, 7:06 pm
#2863
Suspended
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: BOS
Posts: 15,027
Asymptomatic diplomats or even ill diplomats can get on any plane and infect thousands, thanks to their carte-blanche passport. Thus, if we really want to block/ban the spread of COVID-19 diplomatic passports need to be outlawed.
May 12, 2020, 12:59 am
#2864
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 1,756
- initially (next few weeks) open up their travel bubble only to safe countries (i.e. Australia), then later to other countries that also have very low COVID-19 rates.
- use a combination of testing at the border and intelligence (travel history and contact status), to reduce the number of imported infections as much as possible.
- use contact tracing within the general population to sweep up the cases that slip through.
I am quite jealous, as my elderly parents are stuck in the UK. In my opinion, it looks like countries that took early and decisive action are emerging much better off from shorter lockdowns (cases, deaths and economically). Hopefully your mother can go back to eating in the dining room in the next couple of weeks. The Economist estimated the COVID-19 victims in Europe have passed away an average of 11 years before they would have, and while the likelihood of catching COVID-19 is still relatively small I would much prefer it to be closed to zero as it is in New Zealand.
May 12, 2020, 1:27 am
#2865
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: where lions are led by donkeys...
Programs: Lifetime Gold, Global Entry, Hertz PC, and my wallet
Posts: 20,348
If no vaccine is on the horizon then how do countries get out of this lockdown? I have no clue as to what they will do, but I am not paid to. What I do know is that the financial apocalypse is scarier to me than the virus.