>>Because it's your freaking job and I (as a traveler) am paying your freaking salary.<<

I have heard this in many civil service jobs. Since we are also taxpayers, actually you only pay about half of our salaries so you get what you pay for.

I don't suppose you pay the 9/11 "security fee" when you go to work? This is a security fee which is added into the taxes of airline tickets which goes to pay the TSA (and your salary). This fee was suspended over the summer to help the airlines, but to the best of my knowledge it is being collected again.

The following are examples of taxes paid on two recently purchased airline tickets:

Example #1:
Fare: $233.48 Tax: $39.52 PFC: $15.00
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Example #2:
Fare: $338.00 Tax: $79.11 PFC: $12.00
Customs Fee: $5.00 Immigration Fees: $7.00 Aphis Fee: $3.10
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While the "Tax" is not broken out, it includes a security fee which we as passengers pay. In additional to the security fee are federal taxes collected on airline tickets. As such, air travelers do generate additional federal taxes and fees which pay for TSA services.

Just because you're a taxpayer doesn't mean you pay half your salary. Traveler's who purchase airline tickets (and thus pay fees/federal taxes) contribute a great deal to it.

The airline passenger is the TSA's customer and is to be treated with courtesy and respect.

SDF_Traveler

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"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." -- Ben Franklin

No, I pay your salary in the form of the $5/segment security fee. Unless you are getting charged $5 every time you go to work, we are not sharing the burden.

So, for those of you in the back who missed it, it's your freaking job and I (traveler) pay your salary for you to harass me in a manner which has been proven ineffective (see the Southwest bleach and play-dough tour of the world). That's why you get to listen to people complain.




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Don't feed the trolls.

all is lost

[This message has been edited by Fenito (edited Dec 21, 2003).]

With all due respect, Fenito, I find the TSA as an organization un-American in several aspects. First and foremost is the lack and disregard of passenger privacy. From time to time the TSA documents things such as false alarms, or even 'SSSS' pax -- items such as boarding pass, ID, etc., is requested -- information is taken down and the passenger has no idea where it goes. The TSA provides no clear answers, nor does it have any type of privacy policy. While individuals such as yourself have provided some answers, you know as well as I know procedures are different everywhere; there is no clear privacy policy I am aware of.

The TSA has been around for awhile and something as simple as a universal privacy policy when it comes to passenger information is something that should of been addressed a long time ago.

CAPPS II is what really scares me and is what I find extremely appalling and un-American. See:

www.dontspyon.us (if you haven't already).

CAPPS II and several of the goals of the TSA are the equivalent of internal border controls with-in the United States. I'm sorry, but this is not American.

Next are several issues related to screening. Screeners should only be screening for (real) dangerous objects and threats. It's not the duty of the TSA to bust people for drugs (as an example) or anything else they may have in their luggage or on their person unless it is a threat to aviation security. I'm not a drug user, nor do I carry anything illegal, but I'm a firm believer in the 4th Amendment.

I even see the ID checks required by the government as un-American. If the airline wants to check my ID for revenue control purposes, fine -- but ID checks do nothing for security and it's none of the government's business where I travel within the USA, IMHO.

I don't see anything selfish, greedy, or ignorant with my beliefs as stated above.



It's not the responsibility of the passenger to come up with solutions. If, 99% of the time, you only hear complaints, that would indicate to me something is wrong and a solution needs to be found. I've personally provided ideas/solutions to the TSA when I've had specific complaints, only to have them disregared. Unfortunately, with the TSA beauracracy, I'm not sure what it takes for someone to implement a solution to a problem??



Just how much time does it take? The TSA has had a couple of years now. When there are problems in private organizations, typically they're corrected promptly. You know just as well some of the policies are BS; but do you, personally, see them changing anytime soon?

As far complaining to screeners, it's easiest for people to do. Try contacting the TSA higher-up, it's nearly impossible. Send an email, get a canned response that has nothing to do with your original message. Call the hotline and get canned responses as well with no real answers or no real help.

Passengers complain because they're unhappy with something. As a screener, you're a front-line employee, and unfortunately, it is your job to have patience in regards to the complaints (especially if management is not going to support you or make the necessary changes to eliminate the complaints). I'm sure it sucks to get complaints, but front-line employees are often where complaints are directed at.

I spent time doing customer service work when I was in college and I dealt with a lot of complaints -- it sucked, but it was part of the job. Luckily my employer worked with the front-line employees to solve the complaints -- something I just don't see happening with the TSA.



I've come across many great TSA employees who do their job & do it well. Unfortunately I've come across many who don't give a rat's a$$ about their job or the passenger. As a frequent traveler, I fly to/through many airports and see a lot when it comes to the TSA and different checkpoints.

I would suspect many TSA employees would not only be shocked, but frusterated if they were in my shoes, dealing with multiple airports, different checkpoints, different procedures, rude treatment, etc., on a regular basis.

You hit the nail on the head -- there are so many breaches it isn't even funny, but yet I don't see the TSA (or the government in general) doing much about it. If the TSA were to eliminate a lot of the BS and stupid policies, they would have manpower and resources to spend on real threats, IMHO.

As you said (part of the text I clipped), it's likely you work at one of the better airports & things run great compared to other locations. The fact you will lock a passengers luggage after screening is just amazing. You won't find that in very many places.

Best,

SDF_Traveler

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"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." -- Ben Franklin

This same can be said to you. We are your CUSTOMERS. You'll pay with your job with this attitude.

Wahhh. Get over it. Life isn't fair. Even us terrorists know that the airlines will always overbook flights if people are paying. Duhhhh!!

I'll pass comment as you know my feelings re: TSA competency levels.


TOO LONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Until all cargo on passenger planes is screened and all ground persons with access to aircraft are screened every time access is granted you have no idea what is in the accurately named "sterile" area. So your smoke and mirror show for mom and pop and grandma and grandpa shouldn't take more than 10-15 mins. Tops!! Stop the farce. Provide "real" security or make it quick, hassle free security they could be the same thing of TSA understood what security is.....

It was mentioned above that when you complain to the TSA management all you get is a canned response. Trust me, I would be at least molified with that much of a response. For a year and a half I have brought safety issues up to management in writing. I have addressed these issues as far up as the FSD and even Washington D.C. I have gotten absolutely NO response from anyone. The only response (which I must admit was a quick one) was the morning that I emailed to the TSA Ombusdman and CC'd to the operations, AFSD and FSD at my airport. I asked the ombudsman one simple question. I asked :"If I were to quit TSA would I be legally free to go to the local media with my concerns?" That very same day when I walked into work the Operations manager was down at my checkpoint to talk with me for two and a half hours about my needing to support TSA management decisions, and the need to keep things within the TSA family.
A canned response? You got more than I normally get.

Your also paying people in DC to make laws that require you to divest. But it is easier to vent on a screener, that takes real balls.

quote:
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Originally posted by ClueByFour:
Because it's your freaking job and I (as a traveler) am paying your freaking salary. What a novel concept.


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And like I said before as long as you keep the complaints general you will have a sympathetic ear because there are policies and procedures that I don't agree with but have to carry out because thats the way management wants it. But when you start attacking me personally well all bets are off and so is the screening, you can talk with my supervisor and possibly a LEO. No one should be subject to verbal abuse no matter where they work and no matter if your paying my salary.

all is lost

[This message has been edited by Fenito (edited Dec 21, 2003).]

Yeah, and I let my elected representatives know exactly how I feel when they do things that I don't like. Your point?

You know what both groups (TSA and congress) share in common? I little motto of mine: "Those who can, do. Those who can't work for the government." It applies to politicians and screeners both, as it turns out.

Besides which, it actually does take a bit of cajones to unload on a screener. Typically, the power tripping shoe shizzies and wand wizards who provoke this type of response are all to busy to complain to the LEO present. I actually had that happen once in ORD--until the wand wizard in question realized that the watch commander from the CPD at ORD was getting friendly with the person who actually had the cajones to question him/her. Amazing what can happen when you have the professional part of airport security (eg, LEOs) on your side. I was told by this guy "if you question me or my supervisor, you will not fly today." I not only boarded the plane, but did so with the thanks of the CPD and American Airlines. Unlike the millitant wand wizards, who are willing to hide behind the "I have orders" defense (which, if you are student of history, kind of failed for the Nazi's) I am perfectly willing to take a stand for what I consider right and wrong.



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Don't feed the trolls.

"You will not fly today." That five word phrase would be enough for me right there to inform the TSA agent that our entire conversation was recorded on my PocketPC that was sitting on top of everything in my bag. (and yes, I do turn the record function on before I go through security) It would also be enough for me to insist that he get his supervisor's boss (not just his supervisor) over to handle the situation, along with a law enforcement official. I would want to ensure that my rights were not violated throughout the entire process.

People that are hard-nosed with me quickly learn that I can be just as (if not even more) hard-nosed right back at them.

BTW, such a phrase would also automatically generate a complaint against the screener, no matter whether s/he was in the right or wrong. The people on power trips need to be weeded out, as they are some of the folks giving the TSA a very, very bad public relations problem.

To generate (revenue), intimidate, and incarcerate. Sounds very typical of most "large" Law Enforcement Organizations. Most dress like SWAT members. Wonder how long it'll be before TSA uniforms start with this look? Combat boots, bullet proof vests, cargo pants, and all the trimmings of pepper spray, cuffs, nightsticks, etc..

What happen to "To protect and serve"? Gone with the rest of common sense?

But guess what? The TSA will do what it wants and this board and those who post here will never change that. Big Brother rules as he wishes so go ahead and let it eat you up fool.

That's what you think. You really believe it is a coincidence that a few thousand of your fellow wand wizards are no longer wanding?

Eventually, this stupidity will be overcome. Enjoy sucking at the teat of the taxpayer in the meantime.

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Don't feed the trolls.