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-   Checkpoints and Borders Policy Debate (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/checkpoints-borders-policy-debate-687/)
-   -   Requirement for speaking your name? (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/checkpoints-borders-policy-debate/1398391-requirement-speaking-your-name.html)

yyzvoyageur Jun 10, 2012 7:25 pm


Originally Posted by WillCAD (Post 18733356)

Originally Posted by yyzvoyageur (Post 18732056)
No, the voice of reason.

Those who advocate surrender to authority, particularly when the authority is unreasonable, abusive, or illegal, often use that tired old line.

Although I don't have the guts to engage in these acts of civil disobedience myself, I applaud those who do. They are standing up for the rights and freedoms of all, at some risk to themselves. How is that "unreasonable"?

Just tell the guy your name is on the boarding pass (or identity document). That's what I'd likely do if they played this game in Canada. Don't engage in childish games by giving false names, etc. That's all I'm saying. Don't compare the TSA with Hitler. You lose all credibility.

mikew99 Jun 10, 2012 8:09 pm


Originally Posted by cottonmather0 (Post 18733111)
We had a 15 second silent staredown, then she sighed and gave me gigantic red squiggles and handed me my docs back. I think I could see the steam coming out of her ears when I tossed the BP in the trash bin next to her.

You are my hero.


Originally Posted by WillCAD (Post 18733356)
Although I don't have the guts to engage in these acts of civil disobedience myself, I applaud those who do. They are standing up for the rights and freedoms of all, at some risk to themselves. How is that "unreasonable"?

^

Michael El Jun 10, 2012 9:14 pm


Originally Posted by yyzvoyageur (Post 18733525)
Don't compare the TSA with Hitler. You lose all credibility.

The power grab of the DHS is how it starts. Please don't lose sight of that because history is bound to repeat itself.

cbn42 Jun 11, 2012 2:29 am

Every government has a list of some sort to keep track of people who are problematic. Your local police station likely has one. The FBI has had one for years. On one hand, I don't think that the absence of a watch list would have made any difference to the Holocaust, and on the other hand, I think it's ridiculous to say that the TSA should not maintain a list of people who deserve extra scrutiny.

Wally Bird Jun 11, 2012 8:06 am


Originally Posted by cbn42 (Post 18734577)
I think it's ridiculous to say that the TSA should not maintain a list of people who deserve extra scrutiny.

A list based on what?

Someone who is arrestable on sight should be on the FBI and police lists and subject to law enforcement, not the TSA. Otherwise the criterion seems to be "suspicious activity" which is a subjective and arbitrary determination. And contrary to the 5th Amendment, viz. ...nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law....

If individual airlines wish to bar people from availing themselves of their service due to past behavior, that's a civil matter; nothing to do with the government and certainly not the TSA.

The important point is that it simply does not work. No actual threat has been intercepted by the list. Ever. A number of suspected and even confirmed (Times Square bomber) terrorists have sailed through. If the screening is 100% effective then it really doesn't matter who is on the plane. If it's not 100% effective then fix it; which is the rub - it can't be done. A speculative, farcical list would just be a canard were it not an erosion of essential liberty.

MaximumSisu Jun 11, 2012 11:11 am


Originally Posted by yyzvoyageur (Post 18733525)
Just tell the guy your name is on the boarding pass (or identity document). That's what I'd likely do if they played this game in Canada. Don't engage in childish games by giving false names, etc. That's all I'm saying. Don't compare the TSA with Hitler. You lose all credibility.

As a loyal subject of the Queen, and without the Bill of Rights, that's what would be expected and required of you.

WilcoRoger Jun 11, 2012 11:12 am

From my 6th grade English class:

Name spelled: Ghoti

Name pronounced: Fish

???

"Gh" as in laugh, "o" as in women, "ti" as station

mikeef Jun 11, 2012 11:15 am


Originally Posted by saulblum (Post 18726471)
I look forward to the day that this guy is asked to play the name game.

There's a reason you never see Coach K on a commercial flight. ;)


Originally Posted by WillCAD (Post 18726606)
Holy underwear. I had to read that poor guy's name about 10 times before I got it.

Von... Haagen Dazs?

Van Den Haas. It's Dutch.

+1 for the LW2 reference.


Originally Posted by exbayern (Post 18727446)

I have been told many times that I did not say MY NAME correctly :rolleyes: by Americans, including TSA. Since I am fluent in German and in French, I will accept either from a German or a French speaker, and when in France will even pronounce my name in the French manner.

But I refuse to accept an American telling me that I do not know how to pronounce my own name, simply because they are ignorant.

I dunno, I think you might be to blame for this one. There's a large TSO population that barely speaks English. I can't imagine how you could expect them to speak French or German. ;)

Mike

WilcoRoger Jun 11, 2012 11:29 am

How should Finnish curling-world champion and MP, Mr Uuspaavalniemi pronounce his name to be let through? Or ex-Prime Minister Mrs Jäätteenmäki, whom even the BBC News called "Mrs Unpronounciable"?

Caradoc Jun 11, 2012 11:30 am


Originally Posted by mikeef (Post 18736822)
There's a large TSO population that barely speaks English.

Been through ATL lately? They barely grunt, let alone speak.

Wally Bird Jun 11, 2012 11:41 am


Originally Posted by WilcoRoger (Post 18736908)
How should Finnish curling-world champion and MP, Mr Uuspaavalniemi pronounce his name to be let through? Or ex-Prime Minister Mrs Jäätteenmäki, whom even the BBC News called "Mrs Unpronounciable"?

Or any number of Sri Lankans (see Jennifer Abeygoonewardana) or others from the Indian subcontinent.

Oh wait, they're "dusky" so they'll get the extra screening anyway :( .

saulblum Jun 11, 2012 11:46 am


Originally Posted by WilcoRoger (Post 18736908)
How should Finnish curling-world champion and MP, Mr Uuspaavalniemi pronounce his name to be let through? Or ex-Prime Minister Mrs Jäätteenmäki, whom even the BBC News called "Mrs Unpronounciable"?

If you have the Google Translate phone app, try putting in some names and "translating" to various languages, and then have the app read the name in the chosen language.

Imagine that: there's more than one way to pronounce a given subset of 26 letters!

WilcoRoger Jun 11, 2012 11:52 am


Originally Posted by saulblum (Post 18737037)
If you have the Google Translate phone app, try putting in some names and "translating" to various languages, and then have the app read the name in the chosen language.

Imagine that: there's more than one way to pronounce a given subset of 26 letters!

I know it, but obviously you should know how to pronounce those names in Texan or New Yorkian, depending on your departure airport.

If you take into account, that it is the English alphabet that has only 26 letters, whereas others have more (and I'm talking about languages using the Latin script) the prospects are mind-bogling. Think about all those àáâãäåæçèéêëìíîïðñòóôõöøùúûüýāăąćĉċčđēĕėęěĝğ 's facing a TSO :D

All this to get to a security checkpoint.

saulblum Jun 11, 2012 12:02 pm


Originally Posted by WilcoRoger (Post 18737083)
All this to get to a security checkpoint.

There, corrected that for you.

WilcoRoger Jun 11, 2012 12:07 pm


Originally Posted by saulblum (Post 18737149)
There, corrected that for you.

^


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