jkhuggins

You're assuming that Phil exercised poor judgment. Many folks here would strongly disagree with that assumption.

Dan_E

I am in fact asserting he exercised poor judgement, I have seen the video. What about those who may have been inconvienced by his refusals instead of complying with the instructions? I suggest there are many who disagree with his actions, not to mention the tax dollars wasted by his antics.

PhoenixRev

Why not just admit that you want capitulation from any citizen who is told by a government actor what to do even if the citizen has no obligation to do so?

PTravel

You were the one trying to distinguish between "not guilty" and "innocent." You are the one splitting hairs. Are you saying that Phil Mocek wasn't innocent of the charges brought against him? Before you answer, remember that posting with a screen name doesn't shield you from defamation liability.

Fine:

"The case stemmed from Mr. Mocek’s failure to cooperate with the instructions of Albuquerque police officers at the Albuquerque International Sunport Airport after interactions he had with TSA transportation security officers."

The case did not, "stem" from Mr. Mocek's failure to cooperate with the instructions of Alberquerque police officers. Cases are not brought for failing to cooperate with instructions. The case "stemmed" from a TSO's unfamiliarity with TSA policy regarding photography at checkpoints, apparent unfamiliarity with TSA policy regarding identification, and a police officer who was similarly ignorant of the law.

What he wrote was false.

Nope, I'm not. You are aware, are you not, that SSI restrictions apply ONLY to TSOs and other TSA employees? I can disseminate all the SSI information I want -- it's not against the law for me to do so, only you. SSI is NOT classified information.

If the passenger "must" sign it, then it's been disclosed to the passenger.

Once again, restrictions on SSI apply only to TSA employees. Phil was under no obligation, legal or otherwise, to safeguard SSI information. I'm reasonably familiar with U.S. secrets law because, for some time during the 1980s, I held a Secret-level security clearance, and before that, I had a Confidential clearance. Both levels preclude my showing protected material to anyone without a need to know AND who was similarly bound by the restrictions.

Like many FTers, I have a copy of TSA's SOP that was published around the internet last year, including the one that had the redactions removed. I'll show it to anyone I please and, guess what? I haven't violated the law, because there is no restriction on anything I want to do with something that's SSI. If you want me to sign a form and the form is SSI, I suggest you don't show it to me if you don't want its contents disseminated because there is absolutely nothing you, or anyone else in government, can do, legally, to stop me.

Incidentally, I would never sign the form, if asked, nor would I provide you any personal information. You have the legal right to ask. You have no legal right to demand.

Really? Care to the cite the law that provides there is a difference?

Wrong. "Interference with screening," can not, by law, be a judgment call because it would be constitutionally void for vagueness as applied.

No, Ron, once again you are playing at being a lawyer and, once again, you are totally and completely wrong.

As I said, I admire your consistency.

IslandBased

So you would like to have seen Phil Mocek brought up on some other trumped up charges? The jury decided that was exactly what had occurred.

His time was wasted as well.

pmocek

Everyone may have been inconvenienced. Based on your view from watching the video of what happened, does it seem that anyone was inconvenienced? If so, who?

Also, what refusals did you mean to refer to, and what instructions do you think I failed to comply with?

If anyone wasted tax dollars, it was those who caused me to be arrested, jailed, accused of things I clearly did not do, and conducted a jury trial for those things even after contradictory evidence became available.

Dan_E

Wow, I need the link to the translation device that my post was run through to interpret it that way, I need to to tell the programmer it needs an adjustment.

Not what I implied. I said that the weary traveler who refused to follow the requests exercised poor judgement.

"So Dan_E, have you stopped beating your wife, yes or no....?"

Dan_E

I personally believe a number of individuals flew that particular day and passed through the same checkpoint. They managed to do that by following certain norms, whether enjoyed/liked/approved of/etc.

I personally believe the weary traveler choose in advance to turn their trip into a spectacle. I based that not on the video, but the actions that started the moment the record button was pressed...and since then. Especially the activities on the internet (Flyertalk, blogs, other blogs, etc).

But these are only my gut feelings, those and 8 bits still wont buy a cup of coffee at my fav Green Bean coffee hut.

IslandBased

If I'm not mistaken, Phil has transited other checkpoints without ID prior to this incident. Some TSOs are better trained and more professional than others, I presume.

Dan_E

IB, I spoke of "norms" others who traveled that day followed to insure their trip would go off without a hitch. I suggest that the weary traveler could have breezed through the check point with a standard form of identification, just like the other 99.99% of the people.

Normal activity that day - bring an ID
Abnormal activity that day - not have an ID

I admit to being called "smarty pants," but I think most folks of average intelligence know your day is going to so smoother if you bring along a form of government ID.

pmocek

That is correct. I saw it happen.

We can only guess. I suspect most of them followed certain norms. I suspect that they would have flown that day even if they had not followed those norms.

Based on your view from watching the video of what happened, does it seem that anyone was inconvenienced? If so, who?

What refusals did you mean to refer to, and what instructions do you think I failed to comply with?

sirdatary

Had the TSOs/police officers not overreacted to Phil's recording, there would be no spectacle. I've seen many examples of police officers that have handled filming in a professional manner ("Sir, you can continue recording, but I need you to back away so I can do my job.")

Whether you agree with it or not, there is nothing illegal about filming people in a public place - and in the case of law enforcement and TSA, it serves a useful purpose to the general public.

PhoenixRev

And there's the rub.

You think not following "requests" equals poor judgment. A request is not incumbent upon anyone.

If the TSA wants to make producing ID mandatory in order to fly, then it is their responsibility to change their rules and scrap the exception that people who don't have an ID with them can be screened by alternative methods.

It is ridiculous to turn this around on the traveler, much like some people in this forum have criticized those of us who follow the rules and use our NEXUS cards as IDs only to be told to produce some other ID. When we don't, we are the supposed troublemakers.

TSA Website: "We accept a NEXUS card as ID."
TSO: "Do you have ID?"
Me: "Yes, here is my NEXUS card."
TSO: "Don't you have another ID?"
Me: "Yes, but your own website says you accept the NEXUS card."
TSO: "We don't, so you need to produce another ID."
Me: "Please call a supervisor immediately."
Flyertalk poster: "You exercised poor judgment in not producing another ID."

nachtnebel

should be he, not they.

Blogger Bob is a government employee working in his official capacity as TSA blogger. The most he should say is that he hopes passengers would cooperate with TSA to make the screening process go smoothly. PERIOD. Sour graping the trial results as he did makes the TSA look petty and unwilling to make improvements to their own personnel and processes.

Dan_E

I acknowledge your point. My first response is "What's wrong with a drivers license? Passport? Military ID? Resident card? But I got you, and hey, at least you were producing something, not to mention an approved form of ID. Again, norms. Us normal kettles have driver licenses and passports, that is how you make sure you get through the airport.

But are we still talking about Phil's situation here?