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Old Jan 19, 2017, 8:44 pm
FlyerTalk Forums Expert How-Tos and Guides
Last edit by: StartinSanDiego
Please read this Wiki before posting questions in the thread.

Do not post offers or requests for referral links in this thread! The proper thread for referral offers is here.
All Chase issued cards are here: https://creditcards.chase.com/sitemap

This thread--a continuation of previous discussions through May 2015 and December 2016--focuses on general Chase policies & practices for new applications. For information on specific Chase cards and their bonuses/terms/benefits, see the following threads and their associated wikis: Table of Contents
  1. Does Chase have a limit on the number or frequency of applications like Citi's 8/65 rule?

  2. What's this I hear about Chase denying applications to people who have recently opened a lot of credit cards?

  3. Does the 5/24 rule apply to applications for all Chase cards?

  4. How does Chase calculate the number of an applicant's new cards for purposes of the 5/24 rule?

  5. How does Chase calculate the relevant 24-month period? By calendar months? By exact days?

  6. Can I get around the 5/24 policy by closing cards I've opened in the past 24 months?

  7. Is there any way around the 5/24 policy (targeted mailers, pre-approvals, Chase Private Client status)?

  8. Can I apply for a specific Chase card and earn the bonus again after doing so previously?

  9. I'm an authorized user for a card issued to my spouse/parent. Does that prevent me from signing up for the same card and earning a bonus?

  10. I already have several Chase cards with a substantial aggregate line of credit. Will it improve my odds if I close an existing account (or lower its credit line) before applying for another?

  11. I wasn't auto-approved. Should I call in?

  12. How can I determine the deadline for meeting the spend requirement to earn the signup bonus?

  13. Once I meet the card's spend requirement, how soon will I receive my signup bonus points?

  14. Should I downgrade or cancel my existing cards before applying?

  15. Useful Chase telephone numbers

Does Chase have a limit on the number or frequency of applications like Citi's 8/65 rule?
Chase does not have a known limit. However, several reports (for example) indicate that Chase is highly sensitive to multiple applications within a short time period, and that the second (or subsequent) applications run a substantial risk of being denied. In many cases, this is likely related to Chase's practice of allocating a large credit line (up to an applicant's personal maximum) when approving a new card such as the first application in a series. (See also the discussion below concerning aggregate Chase credit lines.)

What's this I hear about Chase denying applications to people who have recently opened a lot of credit cards?
Starting in May 2015, Chase began denying applications for its own personal cards (e.g., Sapphire Preferred, Freedom, Slate & Freedom Unlimited) if the applicant's credit report shows that she or he opened 5 or more credit cards with any card issuer in the prior 24 months ("the 5/24 rule").

For a few days in early September 2016, Chase included explicit language ("You will not be approved for this card if you have opened 5 or more bank cards in the past 24 months") on the application page for the Sapphire Reserve card--and then promptly removed it. The absence of this language on landing/application pages for the CSR or any other Chase card is not a reliable indicator of whether the 5/24 policy applies.

See the next section for co-branded cards exempt from the 5/24 policy, and the later section discussing potential ways around 5/24.

Does the 5/24 rule apply to applications for all Chase cards?
Previously the rule did not apply to applications for the Ink Plus business card or to co-branded cards such as United, Hyatt, IHG, etc. However, on May 22, 2016 Chase extended its 5/24 rule to cover Ink business cards and some co-branded cards. (Note that there were premature reports that Chase Ink Plus would be made subject to the rule in March 2016 (which did not happen), and that all co-branded cards would follow in April 2016 (also did not happen).)

Although we had numerous reports of applications prior to May 22 being denied for a United/Hyatt/IHG/WN card by a CSR citing the 5/24 rule, the available evidence strongly suggested that those applicants had other serious issues--multiple Chase applications in a short period; large existing Chase credit line--and that overzealous CSRs gratuitously (and erroneously) invoked the 5/24 rule in the past as an additional supposed justification for the denial. Thus, it is difficult to separate such false positives from any change in Chase policy.

Instead, the most useful data points are those where an applicant is approved for a Chase card despite being over 5/24. Since May 22, 2016, we have such reports for these co-branded cards (in order from oldest to newest for each card):
For a longer list of cards apparently not subject to 5/24, check this link:
In November 2018, Chase seems to have possibly expanded 5/24 to more cards, possibly including some mentioned above. See this link:
Please follow discussion in the thread for current updates.

How does Chase calculate the number of an applicant's new cards for purposes of the 5/24 rule?
The 24-month count includes personal cards opened at other banks, and even cards on which the applicant is only an authorized user and not the primary cardholder. Chase has been extremely inflexible with this policy, with agents stating that there is nothing they can do to circumvent this restriction. However, in some cases Chase may reconsider a denial if the applicant has <5 new cards excluding cards on which s/he is an authorized user. You may need to escalate to the next level of customer service agent, as many front-line agents seem to be unable or unwilling to remove the authorized user accounts from the count.

Note:

How does Chase calculate the relevant 24-month period? By calendar months? By exact days?
In February 2017, a FTer reported a successful application a day or two after dropping from 5/24 to 4/24. However, because Chase sometimes approves applicants who are at 5/24 exactly (see above), this data point does not conclusively prove that Chase drops cards from its calculation on the exact 24-month anniversary of the previous bonus.

Can I get around the 5/24 policy by closing cards I've opened in the past 24 months?
No. Chase uses the information from your credit report, and closing an account doesn't make it disappear.

Is there any way around the 5/24 policy (targeted mailers, pre-approvals, Chase Private Client status)?
As to targeted mailers, we have insufficient anecdotal evidence to reach any reliable conclusions. (Reports suggesting no exemption from 5/24 here and here.)

There have been reports of people with more than 5 cards opened in the last 24 months being successful if they are already pre-approved for the card in question. To find out if you are pre-approved, you can call or go into a branch to ask. Success stories appear to be connected to Chase Private Client (CPC) status and the rollout of the Chase Sapphire Reserve card. In-branch pre-approvals (showing a green screen on the banker's computer) result in automatic approvals. Some (but not all) CPC clients had success in recon calls[[I]citation needed].

Can I apply for a specific Chase card and earn the bonus again after doing so previously?
It depends. A Chase card may be "churned" when an entirely new version becomes available. For example, business cards are distinct from personal/consumer cards. Note that simple variations among bonus offers do not amount to new versions/products for purposes of this rule.

Beginning in 2014, Chase began including explicit language in most of its offers, such as the following:
This new cardmember bonus offer is not available to either (i) current cardmembers of this consumer credit card, or (ii) previous cardmembers of this consumer credit card who received a new cardmember bonus for this consumer credit card within the last 24 months.
Effective August 2018, Chase imposed stringent additional restrictions on receiving the signup bonus for any version of the Sapphire card. See Sapphire (CSR & CSP) 48 months between bonuses, August 2018 and the master threads for each card (listed above) for details and discussion.

There are four key considerations in determining whether you can churn a given card:
  • The 5/24 policy discussed in detail above.
  • The 24-month bonus waiting period--in the case of Sapphire cards, the collective 48-month period--is measured not from the date of your previous application (or approval date, if different), but instead from the date you received the signup-related bonus on the previous card, which may be 3-4 months later than the approval date. The same rule applies regardless of the type of signup bonus received (points, miles, or free-night certs); anniversary benefits unrelated to spending requirements, such as annual IHG & Marriott certs, do not count as signup bonuses.
  • If you still have your old card of the same type, you're ineligible.
  • Chase's policy does not indicate whether there is also a minimum waiting period between cancellation and reapplication, and there is not yet sufficient anecdotal evidence from FTers to draw firm conclusions. At a minimum, a prudent churner will wait at least a week or two after cancellation before reapplying so that all of Chase's systems fully reflect that closure. (See first bullet point above.) At least one FTer has reported re-applying successfully 14 days after canceling the previous card.
Finally, note that if you reapply too soon, Chase may still issue you the new card. (This differs from some other card issuers, which may deny such applications outright.) In this case, Chase typically notifies you by letter within a month or two after approval that, as a previous cardholder, you will not receive the bonus a second time.

I'm an authorized user for a card issued to my spouse/parent. Does that prevent me from signing up for the same card and earning a bonus?
No. Being an additional user on someone else's account poses no bar to applying for that same card & bonus, except insofar as such cards may count toward the 5/24 rule (as discussed above).

I already have several Chase cards with a substantial aggregate line of credit. Will it improve my odds if I close an existing account (or lower its credit line) before applying for another?
Yes.

In the past, the conventional wisdom among FTers was that you were more likely to hurt your chances by closing an account or reducing CL unilaterally. However, substantial evidence from 2014 onward strongly indicates that Chase is increasingly likely to reject applications (or at least not auto-approve them) where an applicant has an existing total credit line that is high compared to his/her income & spending patterns. (For many members, the threshold appears to be in the $45K-60K range, but that is highly speculative.)

Recent reports suggest that closing accounts and/or voluntarily reducing credit lines increases the odds of auto-approval or in-branch pre-approval. (You can do either by calling or simply sending a secure message through your Chase online account. You do not need to provide a reason for the request.) For best results, keep at least $5K-10K in excess credit; if your application is not approved, you can always contact the reconsideration department and offer to reallocate that portion of your existing credit line. Note: despite allowing credit line to be moved between personal and business accounts in the past, Chase is no longer permitting such reallocation in either direction.

With respect to timing, it is better to reduce any CL as soon as you can conveniently do so, e.g., after meeting the bonus spend on a card you do not plan to use regularly thereafter. (Do not reduce CL on a given card if it would increase your "credit utiilization"--that is, the ratio of outstanding balance to CL--above ~30%. A high credit utilization number is a red flag for banks and can adversely affect your credit score.) Waiting until one's next application to lower a CL is less than optimal, as the reduced CL is not immediately recognized by all of Chase's systems.

There is no known minimum wait between lowering a CL and having the freed-up amount become available for purposes of a new application. A prudent applicant will, as recommended above, plan well in advance; failing that, an applicant would be wise to wait at least 24 hours between lowering a CL and applying for a new card.

I wasn't auto-approved. Should I call in?
It may be better to avoid calling Chase unless your application is denied. Many recent calls on pending applications led to denials, and many people report having success letting applications work their way through the system. Be patient. Time is on your side; increasingly, Chase CSRs are not.

If you do call, expect extensive and possibly hostile questioning. Be prepared to answer questions regarding the need for more credit, past credit apps for both Chase and other banks, income, business finances, etc. Know your CLs with Chase before you call so you know which card/s you are willing to decrease the CLs on. If the app is for a significant other who dislikes such calls, they can authorize you to speak on their behalf and hand the phone over to you.

How can I determine the deadline for meeting the spend requirement to earn the signup bonus?
Just send Chase a secure message (SM) through your online account. Although the deadline should in theory be N months from the date of approval (not the date of application or card activation)--where N is the number of months specified in the offer--Chase typically pads this period to account for the time required to fabricate and deliver physical cards. For example, a recent "3-month" deadline was in fact 114 days, as confirmed by Chase's SM confirmation.

Once I meet the card's spend requirement, how soon will I receive my signup bonus points?
Bonus points typically accrue at the close of the billing period in which you incur the corresponding charges. Points should appear in your hotel/airline account within a few days thereafter.

NOTE: If you complete your required spending in the last 7-10 days of the statement period, the bonus may not post until the following month's statement, even if the regular per-dollar points post on the first statement. This is normal behavior for Chase and is not worth a phone call.

Should I downgrade or cancel my existing cards before applying?
Useful Chase telephone numbers
(800) 432-3117 – General Application Status Line, automated
(800) 436-7927 – Alternative General Application Status Line, automated
(888) 609-7805 – Alternative Personal Reconsideration line with live rep
(888) 269-8690 - Business Credit Card Application Status Line, automated
(800) 453-9719 – Business Credit Card Reconsideration Line with live rep
(800) 955-9900 – General Card Services and Application status, automated
(888) 298-5623 – Credit Reallocation Office (Personal cards)
(800) 453-9719 – Credit Reallocation Office (Business cards)
(888) 622-7547 – Executive Offices
(877) 470-9042 – Personal Application Verification line with live rep
Twitter: @ChaseSupport
Note: In the past, automated telephone status reports stating that Chase would notify you in 2 weeks often resulted in an approval, whereas the "7-10 days" telephone recording often indicated imminent denial. In 2016, this pattern became increasingly unpredictable, with many applicants receiving approval despite an earlier "7-10 days" automated telephone message. As a result, automated telephone responses should not be regarded as reliable indicators of an application's likely outcome.
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Applying for Chase Credit Cards, 2017-2019

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Old Apr 3, 2017, 6:20 pm
  #496  
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
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IHG card needed but over the 5/24

I want the IHG card but am over the 5/24 by one app., what are the odds of approval, have high FICA score?
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Old Apr 3, 2017, 7:23 pm
  #497  
 
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Isn't the IHG one of the cards immune from 5/24?
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Old Apr 3, 2017, 8:10 pm
  #498  
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 46
I am still confused about the getting the Marriott business card...

I understand that if I am over 5/24, I can still get approved, but if I am at say 4/24, is Chase going to count it as card #5 and limit my ability to get another chase card before a prior one drops off my total?
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Old Apr 3, 2017, 8:15 pm
  #499  
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
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Originally Posted by go_hokies
I am still confused about the getting the Marriott business card...

I understand that if I am over 5/24, I can still get approved, but if I am at say 4/24, is Chase going to count it as card #5 and limit my ability to get another chase card before a prior one drops off my total?
Chase very likely will count it. I'd advise applying for whatever other card you want first. Then Marriott biz.
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Old Apr 3, 2017, 9:04 pm
  #500  
 
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I was able to get the CSR when I was already at 4/24 and also had recently gotten the Ink Preferred in addition to the other 4.
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Old Apr 3, 2017, 9:24 pm
  #501  
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Posts: 222
It has been my recent experience that some Chase credit analysts when calculating 5/24 only go straight off your credit report (and therefore miss all business cards including Chase business cards) where others credit analysts will check both your credit report as well as your associated business cards with Chase (and in that case will count all personal cards on your credit report plus all Chase business cards but NOT business accounts from other banks as they are not on your credit report).

The problem is not as simple as hanging up and calling recon again though as the more thorough credit analyst that does check both the credit report and Chase systems then often notates the application which generally prejudices it for any future recons.
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Old Apr 4, 2017, 2:20 am
  #502  
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: USA
Posts: 23
Originally Posted by Mancolt
If the alternative for you is waiting and then not hitting minimum spend, it may make sense in your case to call. The general advice for Chase business cards is not to call until they've declined you. I answered a call from them on my first application and was approved, however, contrary to the suggestions to avoid them until denied.

Unless I missed it somewhere, I don't think you told us what card you're applying for. Are you definitely under 5/24? Is this a business card?

If this is a personal card, I would call if I were you, given your circumstances. If business, you'll have to make a judgment call. In any case, if approved, you should ask to see if they'll expedite the card.
Thanks for the quick reply.

This is for a personal card, United MileagePlus Explorer. I'm 0/24, as I've not applied for any cards in the last 24 months. As of today, 4/4, the automated system still says notified in two weeks.
travelvinh is offline  
Old Apr 4, 2017, 2:24 am
  #503  
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: USA
Posts: 23
Originally Posted by SpammersAreScum
How long it takes will depend mainly on the USPS; everyone says 2 weeks because it does sometimes take mail that long. Figure a day or 2 for Chase to get from opening the account to creating and mailing the card. After that, if you typically receive non-local mail in only 3 days or so, you might actually receive it in 4 or 5. Where I'm at, I have to expect mail to take 5 days or so.

Depending on the card type, you might be able to talk Chase into overnighting it, as the post above me shows. Can't hurt to ask, as long as they haven't started the card creation process yet. If you wait, they might say they need to close the account and create a new one, for security reasons.
Thanks! I'll ask about expediting overnight should I end up talking to them. The next post seems to say to leave things be...
travelvinh is offline  
Old Apr 4, 2017, 2:30 am
  #504  
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: USA
Posts: 23
Originally Posted by RobertHanson
The best advice with Chase is always not to call. If they absolutely need some info, they will call you, or mail you a request. Otherwise let the process work thru on it's own. Assuming, of course, that you care if you are approved or not.

Why in the world would you not put everything, and I do mean everything, on your ccs?

Groceries, gas, insurance of all kinds, Costco,Target, Home Depot, utilities that don't charge a fee for ccs, everything I spend goes on a cc. BC every $ spent is at least a mile or a point, and sometimes as much as 5 per $. I pay things off before the charges post to a statement. And if the balance gets too high, I pay it off well before the statement, so I'm never in danger of suddenly finding a huge cc bill to pay off. It's really amazing how many miles and points build up that way, with no extra cost or bother.
I suppose I'm just trying to limit exposure? The big ticket items are worth the exposure for the number of points. Many smaller items means needing more scrutinizing of the statements. Big ticket is $100+, unless it's the mobile bill.
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Old Apr 4, 2017, 8:28 am
  #505  
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 86
When is it safe to apply again?

Just applied for Marriott personal, got denied for 5/24 (I wasn't sure where we were at). Is it safe for me to turn around and apply for the IHG card and Marriott Biz?
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Old Apr 4, 2017, 8:40 am
  #506  
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
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Originally Posted by tscateh
Just applied for Marriott personal, got denied for 5/24 (I wasn't sure where we were at). Is it safe for me to turn around and apply for the IHG card and Marriott Biz?
I'm at 4/24 and applied for Marriott two days ago. Got the 30-day notice. Usually I get either instant approval or it shows up in my account with 1-2 days. Still no sign of it. Which notice did you get when you applied? 30 days or 2 weeks?
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Old Apr 4, 2017, 8:46 am
  #507  
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 86
It's been about a week, got the letter in the mail already, so I know for sure it was denied. ;-) We got the 30 days message, I believe, but don't quote me on that. That was my wife's; still waiting to hear on mine.
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Old Apr 4, 2017, 10:09 am
  #508  
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 47
I just got my chase ink annual fee, so I want to cancel it. What will happen to my ultimate rewards points?
Dubiox is offline  
Old Apr 4, 2017, 11:59 am
  #509  
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Posts: 159
Originally Posted by travelvinh
I suppose I'm just trying to limit exposure? The big ticket items are worth the exposure for the number of points. Many smaller items means needing more scrutinizing of the statements. Big ticket is $100+, unless it's the mobile bill.
What do you mean by this? Based on the 0/24, and that comment, I'm guessing you're relatively new to credit cards. I don't know if this discussion belongs in here, but I'd like to know what you're concerned about on credit cards. If you want to maximize your rewards, you really should be putting EVERYTHING on the card. In many/most cases, it's actually better to put things on credit than not, as they confer additional benefits than can be had by paying with cash or debit.

Originally Posted by travelvinh
Thanks for the quick reply.

This is for a personal card, United MileagePlus Explorer. I'm 0/24, as I've not applied for any cards in the last 24 months. As of today, 4/4, the automated system still says notified in two weeks.
Personally, I would call to check on the status. You'll have to Google for the right number, but there's no risk to calling the wrong department. I was in a similar situation but I had both a personal and business card pending. I didn't want to talk about the business card (the advice is to not call on business) but I did want to talk about the personal card and why it was pending/denied, so I had to dig to make sure I had the right number (I've since misplaced it).

I can't see them turning you down if you're 0/24. As long as you have reasonable income, good credit score, etc, you should be able to call and probably get a decision in a few minutes. There's nothing questionable that you'd really have to explain, like a lot of us do: "Why have you opened 10 cards in the last 6 months", etc.
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Old Apr 4, 2017, 12:51 pm
  #510  
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Originally Posted by tscateh
Just applied for Marriott personal, got denied for 5/24 (I wasn't sure where we were at). Is it safe for me to turn around and apply for the IHG card and Marriott Biz?
Have you read the wikipost atop this thread? Item #1 is:
Does Chase have a limit on the number or frequency of applications like Citi's 8/65 rule?
Chase does not have a known limit. However, several reports (for example) indicate that Chase is highly sensitive to multiple applications within a short time period, and that the second (or subsequent) applications run a substantial risk of being denied. In many cases, this is likely related to Chase's practice of allocating a large credit line (up to an applicant's personal maximum) when approving a new card such as the first application in a series. (See also the discussion below concerning aggregate Chase credit lines.)
Based on just that (and I myself know little more about it), it might be one thing to apply for one of those two soon, but probably very risky to apply for both one after the other (meaning you'd have 3 applications in very short order). And keep in mind to get the bonus you'll have to do minimum spend on each, so why stack those (so that you have to do the minimum spend concurrently) if that just risks getting denied?

(In case you're not familiar with the Citi rule mentioned in the quoted question: With Citi it's recommended that you wait about 8 days between your first and second application, and you have to wait about 65 days between your first and third application, whether approved or denied for your first one, or else you'll be denied for the second or third one. Cit has a well defined rule of "no more than two applications in any 60 day period", except they can't count, and so we make it 65 for safety. They don't have a well-defined rule for "more more than one application in any X day period", but some people get denied if they apply a second time too soon at Citi, so that's why the recommendation for 8 days there.)

Last edited by sdsearch; Apr 4, 2017 at 12:57 pm
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