Feb 12, 2016, 8:56 am
Last edit by: beltway
This is the general 2016-2019 thread for weighing the relative merits
of keeping, downgrading, or canceling Chase-issued credit cards.
Post-2019 discussion continues in this thread.
of keeping, downgrading, or canceling Chase-issued credit cards.
Post-2019 discussion continues in this thread.
What's the main reason people product change (PC)?
The benefits offered by a particular card, might suit you better than the card you are holding. Many people, unable to qualify for a new Chase Sapphire Reserve application, upgraded from the Sapphire Preferred to the Sapphire Reserve, because the benefits of the CSR's cash reimbursements made the annual fee a nominal difference the first year. And vice versa- the onerous $450 yearly fee of the CSR makes an appealing case to downgrade to the Sapphire Preferred, and eventually to the no-fee Sapphire or a Freedom card.
Many people product change to avoid the annual fees on the premium versions of the card. Keeping the card open, via a product change, keeps the account open. This allows you to retain the seasoned account, and the banking relationship that the older card has established with Chase.
Why not just cancel the card and be done with it?
This may be the right choice for you, but others want some of the card benefits without having to reapply. Also, Chase has become very restrictive for new card applicants. For Chase cards, you must wait 24- 48 months since the last time you received a bonus before reapplying. Please see the threads on the individual cards for updated overlay rules.
An additional (and more stringent) overlay is the infamous 5/24 rule, which Chase instituted in May 2016 as a counter-measure against churning, or, as they refer to it, "Serial Starters." The 5/24 rule is that you won't be eligible for most Chase card products if you've opened more than 5 credit cards in 24 months. For more on this and other application-related issues, see the current "Applying for Chase Credit Cards " Master thread.
Finally, canceling certain cards--those earning Chase Ultimate Rewards--may deprive you of the ability to exchange UR for miles/points in air & hotel programs. See Ultimate Rewards transfer partners, times & rules.
Is there any way I can keep a card without paying the annual fee?
See Chase Retention Bonuses: June 2015-Present
Are there any restrictions on product changes?
Product changes are only allowed within the same card "family," and are not permitted between business and personal cards. Also, Chase cites the federal CARD Act to deny product changes on any account less that one year old.
Will a product change count as a new card?
No, you will keep your same card number, "opened on" date, credit line, automatic payment arrangements, etc. A product change does not count against Chase's 5/24 limitations on new cards.
Will I get a signup bonus when I change?
No, product changes do not result in point bonuses. Signup bonuses are reserved for new applicants only. For the complete list of public sign up offers, check the Chase sitemap here: https://creditcards.chase.com/sitemap
Is there a place I can look to compare cards?
Go here: https://creditcards.chase.com/credit...D=177087865887
Click: All cards
Place a checkmark in the Compare box for up to three cards.
Click: Compare cards...and you should see a side-by-side display.
I've figured out what I want to switch to. How do I product change my card?
Call the number on the back of your card.
Product changes for the Ultimate Reward Business and Personal Card Family
The UR family of cards includes the Chase Ink business cards, the Freedom Unlimited, the Freedom Card, and the Chase Sapphire Preferred, Reserve and Sapphire.
The Slate (personal) card is also available to downgrade to. It has no annual fee and does not earn any type of reward points. It offers a low fee (currently 0% for the first 60 days) balance transfers and APR.
Personal Cards
- Freedom: 5X points in rotating quarterly categories up to $1500 spend per quarter. If you max out the $1500 every quarter, it totals 7500 UR per quarter, or 30,000 UR per year.
- Freedom Unlimited: 1.5X for all spending, no bonus categories. $20,000 in spend would net 30,000 UR per year.
- Sapphire Reserve: $450 annual fee, $300 annual travel credit, 3X points for travel and dining. Books travel through the UR portal for 1.5 per dollar. Lounge access and other goodies. See the thread here for details.
- Sapphire Preferred: $95 annual fee, 2X points for travel & dining
- For discussion specific to the Sapphire Preferred Card, see Chase Sapphire Preferred - Keep, Downgrade, or Cancel?
- Sapphire: Not available to new applicants. Available as a product downgrade/change only, must tier down from the Sapphire Reserve to Sapphire Preferred to Sapphire or Freedom cards. No annual fee. Some Customer Service Reps are citing that the original product (i.e., the CSR), must be held for one year before downgrading. Please provide data points in the thread if this happens to you.
Business Cards
- Ink Plus: $95 annual fee, 5X office supplies, 5X cellular/landline/cable; 2X gas and hotels
- Ink Preferred: 3x on travel, shipping, internet/phone/cable, & some online advertising.
- Ink Cash: No annual fee, 5X office supplies, 5X cellular/landline/cable; 2X gas and restaurants
If you still have a legacy Ink Classic or Ink Bold business card, neither of which is available for new signups, you can product change to one of the other Ink cards.
Considerations for downgrading/upgrading:
Can I combine my UR points?
Yes, UR can be combined freely across the cardholder's own personal and business accounts.
What about transfering my UR to another person's Chase UR account? To their air/hotel partner account?
With restrictions, UR from a personal card can be transferred to a person living at the same address. Business cards allow transfer to owners of the company listed as authorized users.
However, be warned that there are transfer restrictions. Unauthorized transfers have resulted in shut-downs. Review the Chase T&C for details before planning a transfer. For discussion, see http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/chase...-accounts.html.
The Freedom cards, no-fee Ink Cash, and no-fee Sapphire cards do not allow UR transfer to airline/hotel partners. If you are downgrading from a premium UR card and will only have no-fee cards left, it may be prudent to transfer your points to the partner of your choice beforehand.
I know I can use UR to pay for travel directly (as opposed to transfering points into a travel partner program). Do the Chase UR cards differ on this?
Only the Sapphire Reserve books travel on the UR portal for 1.5. So you can stack your card bonus opportunities when your UR points are combined into your CSR account and used for booking travel. If, for instance, you earned 5x on your Ink Plus on your phone bill, and combine those 5x Ink earned points into your CSR's UR account, you'll now get an additional .5 in value when you redeem them on the travel portal.
Product Changes for United Airlines Cards
There are options to downgrade or upgrade UA cards.
- United Mileage Plus Card- no annual fee, 1 UA mile per $2 in spend
- United Mileage Plus Explorer Card- $95 annual fee, 1 mile per dollar earning, additional award inventory on UA, free checked bag, 25% bonus on the shopping portal.
- United Plus Club Card- $450 annual fee, 1.5 miles per $1, many additional premium card benefits
- Business Cards for the Mileage Plus and Club Card give you a choice to upgrade or downgrade between those two.
Southwest Airlines Cards
The difference here is a nominal $30/3000 points per year.
Personal cards
- Plus Card- $69 annual fee, 3000 bonus points upon renewal
- Premiere Card- $99 annual fee, 6000 bonus points upon renewal
Chase Product Change/Card Conversion: Downgrade, Upgrade, Keep or Cancel? (2016-2019)
Jun 8, 2016, 2:16 pm
#121
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Traveling some where hopefully
Programs: AS, AA Gold, and Hilton
Posts: 1,954
You also list this card as one you have?
Last edited by jjmiller69; Jun 8, 2016 at 9:19 pm
Jun 8, 2016, 7:01 pm
#122
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: IAH
Programs: DL DM, Hyatt Ist-iest, Stariott Platinum, Hilton Diamond
Posts: 12,792
Jun 8, 2016, 7:29 pm
#123
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: home = LAX
Posts: 25,934
So it doesn't seem to fit the OPs quest, for 5x "miles".
So unless the OP is going to be just as happy with 5% cashback as 5x miles (possible, given their listed collection of cards), the true answer to the OP's original question (in the thread title) seems to be "no such card exists", right?
Jun 8, 2016, 10:17 pm
#124
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: IAH
Programs: DL DM, Hyatt Ist-iest, Stariott Platinum, Hilton Diamond
Posts: 12,792
Jun 9, 2016, 11:46 am
#126
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 437
Whatever the card is called, it doesn't earn miles or transferable points, right?
So it doesn't seem to fit the OPs quest, for 5x "miles".
So unless the OP is going to be just as happy with 5% cashback as 5x miles (possible, given their listed collection of cards), the true answer to the OP's original question (in the thread title) seems to be "no such card exists", right?
So it doesn't seem to fit the OPs quest, for 5x "miles".
So unless the OP is going to be just as happy with 5% cashback as 5x miles (possible, given their listed collection of cards), the true answer to the OP's original question (in the thread title) seems to be "no such card exists", right?
Chase ink cash business does not pay 5x miles rather it pays %5 cash back.
If this is correct then there is no Chase card with no AF and pays 5x points in office supply stores.
Am I understanding correctly?
Jun 9, 2016, 12:54 pm
#127
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: home = LAX
Posts: 25,934
as to the possible future of those rotating categories themselves
.And, for completeness, the Chase rotating categories are capped at $1500 in spend per quarter. After you pass $1500 of 5x, the 5x drops to 1x if you spend further.
Oh, one more possible exception: If you look at it that way, a signup bonus on a card is even more than 5x. So in that sense, spending at office supply stores (or anywhere else) during the signup bonus spend gets you more than 5x. But only during that signup bonus spend (which is always limited in time). However, because of Chase's 5/24 policies (started in May 2015 and expanded in May 2016), if you got all or most of the cards you listed in the past 2 years, you are likely to be denied for any further Chase cards with a few possible exceptions.
Last edited by sdsearch; Jun 9, 2016 at 1:02 pm
Jun 9, 2016, 1:24 pm
#128
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: CLT
Programs: AA, UA, BA, Hilton Diamond, Marriott Gold, IHG Platinum
Posts: 2,074
However, if you also have Chase Ink Plus OR Chase Sapphire Preferred, you can transfer the points from Ink Cash to Ink Plus/CSP and transfer them to miles.
So, it's true that there is no Chase card that pays 5x miles at office supply stores with no annual fee, unless you have the Ink Plus/CSP as well.
Jun 9, 2016, 1:41 pm
#129
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: home = LAX
Posts: 25,934
Chase Ink Cash pays 5x points which are only able to redeemed as cash.
However, if you also have Chase Ink Plus OR Chase Sapphire Preferred, you can transfer the points from Ink Cash to Ink Plus/CSP and transfer them to miles.
So, it's true that there is no Chase card that pays 5x miles at office supply stores with no annual fee, unless you have the Ink Plus/CSP as well.
However, if you also have Chase Ink Plus OR Chase Sapphire Preferred, you can transfer the points from Ink Cash to Ink Plus/CSP and transfer them to miles.
So, it's true that there is no Chase card that pays 5x miles at office supply stores with no annual fee, unless you have the Ink Plus/CSP as well.
In that case, in a sense it is a no annual fee card that can earn 5x miles, because in theory you could have only it for 10 years, accumulate a bunch of UR points, and then one year (assuming you're not plagued by 5/24, that is) apply for a Ink Plus or CSP, transfer the points you earned in the past 10 years, and for 9 years you would have nothing but a no annual fee that was earning 5x points that could eventually be transferred to miles.
That's the same strategy I have with Freedom (assuming they don't get rid of the rotating categories as rumored). I don't have a CSP or Ink Plus yet, and may not for a few years, but I'm viewing my UR points from Freedom as "eventually transferable", even though right now all I can do is earn, not transfer.
Jun 9, 2016, 3:01 pm
#130
Moderator
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Miami, Mpls & London
Programs: AA & Marriott Perpetual Platinum; DL & HH Gold
Posts: 48,958
ALL of these cards earn Ultimate Rewards points. If you or your spouse hold ANY card from Group A you can also transfer points earned by cards in Group B with a two-step process:
A) Cards which are eligible to transfer directly to airline and hotel partners
A) Cards which are eligible to transfer directly to airline and hotel partners
Current
JPM Palladium
Sapphire Preferred
Ink Plus
Discontinued
JPM Select
Ink Bold
B) Cards which are NOT eligible to transfer directly to airline or hotel partners.JPM Palladium
Sapphire Preferred
Ink Plus
Discontinued
JPM Select
Ink Bold
Current
Freedom
Freedom Unlimited
Ink Cash
Discontinued
Sapphire
Ink Classic
Freedom
Freedom Unlimited
Ink Cash
Discontinued
Sapphire
Ink Classic
Last edited by mia; Jun 9, 2016 at 4:45 pm
Jun 9, 2016, 3:59 pm
#131
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: SFO
Posts: 3,881
That's worthy to be a sticky post.
Jun 9, 2016, 4:46 pm
#132
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: CLT
Programs: AA, UA, BA, Hilton Diamond, Marriott Gold, IHG Platinum
Posts: 2,074
http://onemileatatime.boardingarea.c...h-credit-card/
Jun 9, 2016, 11:59 pm
#133
Join Date: May 2015
Location: LAX, BUR
Programs: AS,AA,JB, HH Gold, Starriott Titanium Elite, Hyatt Explorist, Global Entry
Posts: 1,933
An Ink Cash can be PC'd to an Ink Plus.
A Freedom can be PC'd to a CSP.
So if after several years of earning and you find yourself with 200K or more UR points PC your way to a transferable card. You'd pay the AF of course.
If 5/24 is otherwise a stumbling block.
A Freedom can be PC'd to a CSP.
So if after several years of earning and you find yourself with 200K or more UR points PC your way to a transferable card. You'd pay the AF of course.
If 5/24 is otherwise a stumbling block.
Jun 11, 2016, 9:21 am
#134
Moderator: Travel Buzz
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Sunny San Diego
Posts: 3,099
ALL of these cards earn Ultimate Rewards points. If you or your spouse hold ANY card from Group A you can also transfer points earned by cards in Group B with a two-step process:
A) Cards which are eligible to transfer directly to airline and hotel partners
A) Cards which are eligible to transfer directly to airline and hotel partners
Current
JPM Palladium
Sapphire Preferred
Ink Plus
Discontinued
JPM Select
Ink Bold
B) Cards which are NOT eligible to transfer directly to airline or hotel partners.JPM Palladium
Sapphire Preferred
Ink Plus
Discontinued
JPM Select
Ink Bold
Current
Freedom
Freedom Unlimited
Ink Cash
Discontinued
Sapphire
Ink Classic
Freedom
Freedom Unlimited
Ink Cash
Discontinued
Sapphire
Ink Classic
I've added your nice write up to the Wiki in the "keep, downgrade or cancel" thread. Please follow this discussion as it moves to that thread.
Jun 11, 2016, 10:49 pm
#135
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: LAX
Posts: 3,267
I have a zombie Amazon.com rewards card, and I'm debating what to do with it. It's 13 years old and my 2nd oldest account, but it has my second highest credit limit @ $10000.
I have excellent credit and plenty of cards, but I'm low income and I think I'm starting to hit a ceiling (I'm still getting approved for new cards, but with low credit limits of $5k). I thought maybe I should do something about this card to free up some CL space.
My other Chase cards are CSP, Mileage Plus, and Ink Business Plus. I can't imagine a PC would benefit me.
The options are:
Keep, but ask for a lower credit limit.
Keep, don't rock the boat.
Close.
Any advice would be appreciated!
I have excellent credit and plenty of cards, but I'm low income and I think I'm starting to hit a ceiling (I'm still getting approved for new cards, but with low credit limits of $5k). I thought maybe I should do something about this card to free up some CL space.
My other Chase cards are CSP, Mileage Plus, and Ink Business Plus. I can't imagine a PC would benefit me.
The options are:
Keep, but ask for a lower credit limit.
Keep, don't rock the boat.
Close.
Any advice would be appreciated!