Last edit by: Calchas
As of 1 January 2017, CX will interline on separate tickets to their airline partners once again.
to 31 Dec 2016 CX Agents' advisory http://www.cxagents.com/cxa/gc/en_HK/ln2
from 1 Jan 2017 http://www.cathaypacific.com/cx/en_H...e-tickets.html
Ausbt article: http://www.ausbt.com.au/cathay-pacif...-baggage-rules
http://www.ausbt.com.au/did-oneworld...of-a-nightmare
http://www.ausbt.com.au/oneworld-air...ecting-flights
AA: will not check through separate PNRs (own or partner) https://ssc.aa.com/prmportal_enu/Age...%20Tickets.pdf
MH: still check through two PNRs (own or partner)
CX/KA: check through CX/KA separate PNRs. Will resume checking through to partners starting 1 Jan 2017 http://www.cathaypacific.com/cx/en_H...e-tickets.html
JL: Will through check. http://www.jal.co.jp/en/info/inter/161003.html
QR: will check through separate PNRs (own or partner) from 01 MAR. https://www.ausbt.com.au/qatar-airways-ditches-oneworld-s-restrictive-baggage-rules
QF: Will check through QF to QF separate PNRs, will not check through partner separate PNRs (from 1 Sep 2016)
BA: Will not check through partner or other airlines' separate PNRs. WIll not check through BA-BA on seperate PNR's (as of 15 Nov 16)
IB: Will check through IB to IB separate PNRs
LA: will not check through separate PNRs (own or partner)
AY: Will check through AY to AY separate PNRs, will not check through partner separate PNRs
to 31 Dec 2016 CX Agents' advisory http://www.cxagents.com/cxa/gc/en_HK/ln2
from 1 Jan 2017 http://www.cathaypacific.com/cx/en_H...e-tickets.html
Ausbt article: http://www.ausbt.com.au/cathay-pacif...-baggage-rules
http://www.ausbt.com.au/did-oneworld...of-a-nightmare
http://www.ausbt.com.au/oneworld-air...ecting-flights
AA: will not check through separate PNRs (own or partner) https://ssc.aa.com/prmportal_enu/Age...%20Tickets.pdf
MH: still check through two PNRs (own or partner)
CX/KA: check through CX/KA separate PNRs. Will resume checking through to partners starting 1 Jan 2017 http://www.cathaypacific.com/cx/en_H...e-tickets.html
JL: Will through check. http://www.jal.co.jp/en/info/inter/161003.html
QR: will check through separate PNRs (own or partner) from 01 MAR. https://www.ausbt.com.au/qatar-airways-ditches-oneworld-s-restrictive-baggage-rules
QF: Will check through QF to QF separate PNRs, will not check through partner separate PNRs (from 1 Sep 2016)
BA: Will not check through partner or other airlines' separate PNRs. WIll not check through BA-BA on seperate PNR's (as of 15 Nov 16)
IB: Will check through IB to IB separate PNRs
LA: will not check through separate PNRs (own or partner)
AY: Will check through AY to AY separate PNRs, will not check through partner separate PNRs
CX WILL interline to other oneworld airlines if travelling on separate PNRs
#46
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: London, UK and Southern France
Posts: 18,364
Very interesting. But the extract you posted only seems to refer to no through check-in, which (on a best case scenario) could simply mean they will stop issuing boarding passes for the next leg.
There are many circumstances where you can interline baggage even though you can't through check in (i.e. your bags are tagged through to your final destination, but you have to check in again and pick up your next boarding pass at the intermediate point).
Is there anything in CXAgents which specifically says they won't now interline baggage on separate tickets as well? (which I've done many times even between CX and non-OW airlines).
There are many circumstances where you can interline baggage even though you can't through check in (i.e. your bags are tagged through to your final destination, but you have to check in again and pick up your next boarding pass at the intermediate point).
Is there anything in CXAgents which specifically says they won't now interline baggage on separate tickets as well? (which I've done many times even between CX and non-OW airlines).
#47
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: SYD
Programs: QF Plat, BA GGL, VA Silver, SQ Gold, IHG Gold, HH Diamond, Accor Plat, Hertz Pres Circle
Posts: 406
It's made pretty clear in the CX Agents link that they'll no longer interline bags either, as it makes them liable for loss.
#48
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: Don't know....
Programs: BA LTG, SQ TPPS, CX DMP, AA EXP, Bonvoy LTT, ALL PLT, Hilton DM
Posts: 4,010
A BIG step backwards!!!
I got this last week... (there is also a table showing the example but can't easily copy and paste here)
oneworld Ticketing and Disruption Policy
Separate Ticket Policy - Revised Through Check in Handling
With effect from 01 Jun 2016, all oneworld carriers have agreed that through* check-in will apply ONLY to passengers travelling on an oneworld itinerary ticketed on a single ticket or where segments are ticketed separately but in the same PNR record.
*=Through services are defined as the customer and their baggage being through checked to their final destinations.
To align with the change, disruption policy will also be revised to exclude protection for passengers holding separate tickets that is not booked under the same PNR.
Please remind passengers opting to travel on two tickets that additional connecting time at their transfer point might be required as they will be required to re-check in either after landing or at the transfer point depends on each airport’s set up and facilities. Landing visa for transfer point might also be required.
oneworld Ticketing and Disruption Policy
Separate Ticket Policy - Revised Through Check in Handling
With effect from 01 Jun 2016, all oneworld carriers have agreed that through* check-in will apply ONLY to passengers travelling on an oneworld itinerary ticketed on a single ticket or where segments are ticketed separately but in the same PNR record.
*=Through services are defined as the customer and their baggage being through checked to their final destinations.
To align with the change, disruption policy will also be revised to exclude protection for passengers holding separate tickets that is not booked under the same PNR.
Please remind passengers opting to travel on two tickets that additional connecting time at their transfer point might be required as they will be required to re-check in either after landing or at the transfer point depends on each airport’s set up and facilities. Landing visa for transfer point might also be required.
#49
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: May 2000
Location: Little dot in Asia
Programs: AA-EP, TK-*G, HL-DM, HY-GLO, MR-LTP
Posts: 25,932
Very interesting. But the extract you posted only seems to refer to no through check-in, which (on a best case scenario) could simply mean they will stop issuing boarding passes for the next leg.
There are many circumstances where you can interline baggage even though you can't through check in (i.e. your bags are tagged through to your final destination, but you have to check in again and pick up your next boarding pass at the intermediate point).
Is there anything in CXAgents which specifically says they won't now interline baggage on separate tickets as well? (which I've done many times even between CX and non-OW airlines).
There are many circumstances where you can interline baggage even though you can't through check in (i.e. your bags are tagged through to your final destination, but you have to check in again and pick up your next boarding pass at the intermediate point).
Is there anything in CXAgents which specifically says they won't now interline baggage on separate tickets as well? (which I've done many times even between CX and non-OW airlines).
1. Two tickets for interline journey, segments ticketed separately in a single PNR (regardless of travelling carriers),
e.g.:
HKG-LHR – tkt nbr xxxxx123 on CX
LHR-WAS - tkt nbr xxxxx124 on BA
Single PNR AB12CD - Yes they will interline even on separate tickets or on separate alliances. eg CX-UA
2. Two tickets for the journey in two different PNRs (regardless of travelling carriers), e.g.:
FCO-LHR – tkt nbr xxxxx123 BA
LHR-WAS - tkt nbr xxxxx124 UA
Two separate PNRs : AB12CD and EF34GH (2 separate bookings in separate PNRs - No they will not interline)
The problem is going to be how each airline interprets 'a single PNR'.. since BA/QF/CX/QR uses Amadeus - all of these bookings if booked together in one reservation system will show up together. Whereas AA, LA, JL, MH, S7 use a different system, their reservations may not be together unless the passenger books these bookings on a Sabre / Abacus system.
In any case, its gonna be fun fun fun trying to interline any flights in the future.
#50
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: May 2000
Location: Little dot in Asia
Programs: AA-EP, TK-*G, HL-DM, HY-GLO, MR-LTP
Posts: 25,932
I got this last week... (there is also a table showing the example but can't easily copy and paste here)
oneworld Ticketing and Disruption Policy
Separate Ticket Policy - Revised Through Check in Handling
With effect from 01 Jun 2016, all oneworld carriers have agreed that through* check-in will apply ONLY to passengers travelling on an oneworld itinerary ticketed on a single ticket or where segments are ticketed separately but in the same PNR record.
*=Through services are defined as the customer and their baggage being through checked to their final destinations.
To align with the change, disruption policy will also be revised to exclude protection for passengers holding separate tickets that is not booked under the same PNR.
Please remind passengers opting to travel on two tickets that additional connecting time at their transfer point might be required as they will be required to re-check in either after landing or at the transfer point depends on each airport’s set up and facilities. Landing visa for transfer point might also be required.
oneworld Ticketing and Disruption Policy
Separate Ticket Policy - Revised Through Check in Handling
With effect from 01 Jun 2016, all oneworld carriers have agreed that through* check-in will apply ONLY to passengers travelling on an oneworld itinerary ticketed on a single ticket or where segments are ticketed separately but in the same PNR record.
*=Through services are defined as the customer and their baggage being through checked to their final destinations.
To align with the change, disruption policy will also be revised to exclude protection for passengers holding separate tickets that is not booked under the same PNR.
Please remind passengers opting to travel on two tickets that additional connecting time at their transfer point might be required as they will be required to re-check in either after landing or at the transfer point depends on each airport’s set up and facilities. Landing visa for transfer point might also be required.
But TAs can book all reservations together in one main PNR which will show up on the respective airlines' PNRs.
#52
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: SYD
Programs: QF Plat, BA GGL, VA Silver, SQ Gold, IHG Gold, HH Diamond, Accor Plat, Hertz Pres Circle
Posts: 406
The problem is going to be how each airline interprets 'a single PNR'.. since BA/QF/CX/QR uses Amadeus - all of these bookings if booked together in one reservation system will show up together. Whereas AA, LA, JL, MH, S7 use a different system, their reservations may not be together unless the passenger books these bookings on a Sabre / Abacus system.
In any case, its gonna be fun fun fun trying to interline any flights in the future.
In any case, its gonna be fun fun fun trying to interline any flights in the future.
For example: SYD QF X/SIN CX HKG (open jaw/stopover) KUL MH X/SIN QR X/DOH QR X/JNB BA CPT (stopover) CPT BA X/LHR AY HEL
Master PNR is created by a TA in Amadeus.
QF/CX/QR/BA/AY all use Amadeus and so they will see the complete itinerary.
MH uses SITA. The SITA copy of the PNR will contain the MH KUL/SIN, QR SIN/DOH, QR DOH/JNB and BA JNB/CPT flights only.
Given this behaviour in all the major GDSes, there isn't really any other way to interpret 'single PNR'.
If you booked an AA connecting to LA itinerary (eg. MIA AA X/LIM LA SCL) using Sabre as an agent you usually get 3 different record locators. Sabre creates copies of the PNR for each carrier involved. For all intents the AA and LA copies would be basically identical.
It's still one PNR though which is what matters.
#53
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: NYC/SIN
Programs: CX DM, SQ KF
Posts: 2,171
Thanks for cxagents the link, sxc!
now let me go find a rock to curl up under...
At least CX-CX is allright- that takes care of about 60-70% of my cross ticket interline needs. I just hope that AA continues to interline to CX, that would be another 20% odd..BA, and others - well i'll just kiss them goodbye now if they refuse to interline - stuck with oneworld carriers more for things like these, than status earn.
btw, interesting language on the cxagents page ('disruption policy will also be revised to exclude protection') - seems to suggest that there was a cross-booking protection in the past (the old thread on the oneworld forum that I had started) - let me claim a Pyrrhic victory on that.
now let me go find a rock to curl up under...
At least CX-CX is allright- that takes care of about 60-70% of my cross ticket interline needs. I just hope that AA continues to interline to CX, that would be another 20% odd..BA, and others - well i'll just kiss them goodbye now if they refuse to interline - stuck with oneworld carriers more for things like these, than status earn.
btw, interesting language on the cxagents page ('disruption policy will also be revised to exclude protection') - seems to suggest that there was a cross-booking protection in the past (the old thread on the oneworld forum that I had started) - let me claim a Pyrrhic victory on that.
#54
Ambassador, Hong Kong and Macau
Join Date: May 2009
Location: HKG
Programs: Non-top tier Asia Miles member
Posts: 19,800
#55
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: HKG
Programs: CX DM, SPG Pt, Le Club Accor GO, Shangri-La GC Jade
Posts: 1,327
From the comment section, I saw a reference to *A's FAQ
http://www.staralliance.com/en/faqs
Flights and Baggage
Q. If I have connecting flights on other Star Alliance member carriers, can I expect that my baggage will be checked to the final destination?
A. To have baggage checked-in on flights that are operated by Star Alliance member carriers, the flights must be included in the same booking record. Baggage cannot be checked-through, regardless of booking on the same record, if government restrictions are in effect or it the passenger is changing airports within their connection point (e.g. arriving into New York John F. Kennedy airport and departing from New York LaGuardia airport).
Q. If I have connecting flights on other Star Alliance member carriers, can I expect that my baggage will be checked to the final destination?
A. To have baggage checked-in on flights that are operated by Star Alliance member carriers, the flights must be included in the same booking record. Baggage cannot be checked-through, regardless of booking on the same record, if government restrictions are in effect or it the passenger is changing airports within their connection point (e.g. arriving into New York John F. Kennedy airport and departing from New York LaGuardia airport).
#56
Ambassador, Hong Kong and Macau
Join Date: May 2009
Location: HKG
Programs: Non-top tier Asia Miles member
Posts: 19,800
There's a saying in HK that "Comments section is always the most interesting section"....
From the comment section, I saw a reference to *A's FAQ
http://www.staralliance.com/en/faqs
So actually OW is "catching down" (reversed catch up) with *A in terms of service
From the comment section, I saw a reference to *A's FAQ
http://www.staralliance.com/en/faqs
So actually OW is "catching down" (reversed catch up) with *A in terms of service
#57
Join Date: Jan 2014
Programs: EBD, BAEC GGL/CCR, Alitalia AlataPlus, Club Carlson Gold, SPG Plat100, HHD
Posts: 654
Regarding the Star Alliance system I have many experiences in interlining there. The policy is that to be guaranteed through check of baggage it needs to be one PNR - but there is nothing stopping them to interline on separate PNRs. I have done it numerous times, usually with SK as the first carrier, but also UA that I can recall.
It is a terrible move by OW to remove the obligation to through check over separate PNRs, and more importantly it seems as if they are effectively saying that separate PNRs should not be interlined, rather than saying that it is not compulsory.
I understand that there may have been a compensation issue of whom is to blame for a lost/delayed interlined bag - but surely the reasonable thing to do is to work out a compensation structure that all member airlines think is reasonable, rather than removing one of the stronger benefits of OW for passengers???
It is a terrible move by OW to remove the obligation to through check over separate PNRs, and more importantly it seems as if they are effectively saying that separate PNRs should not be interlined, rather than saying that it is not compulsory.
I understand that there may have been a compensation issue of whom is to blame for a lost/delayed interlined bag - but surely the reasonable thing to do is to work out a compensation structure that all member airlines think is reasonable, rather than removing one of the stronger benefits of OW for passengers???
#58
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: EWR
Programs: CX Green | UA Silver | Marriott Lifetime Platinum | Hyatt Globalist | Hilton Gold | AA EXP
Posts: 813
I understand that there may have been a compensation issue of whom is to blame for a lost/delayed interlined bag - but surely the reasonable thing to do is to work out a compensation structure that all member airlines think is reasonable, rather than removing one of the stronger benefits of OW for passengers???
Even if airlines were willing to share the revenue (as if it is a single PNR) then there's another problem: revenue forecasting. On a single PNR each airline knows its share of revenue. On two separate PNRs, each get to keep their own revenue. If airlines were to do the above, that means on a separate PNR, an airline won't know whether it has to split the revenue until a passenger checks-in. That's a nightmare for revenue forecasting purposes.
I think it's a case of passenger wanting to have the cake and eat it too. On one hand we want the ability to make multiple bookings on multiple airlines (presumably, not all the time obviously, because it is cheaper or to maximise redemption). On the other hand, we want the convenience of check-through (and naturally compensation when things go awry). People seem to think an 'alliance' is a solution to all (which is how airlines sell it) but in this case i can see why airlines can't make it work.
(And in case people are wondering, no, i don't work for an airline ... )
Btw, I read various forums and the focus is on lost/delayed baggage but I find the timing interesting that OW updates the policy just before EC clarifies that under EC 261, a compensation is due if a passenger miss the second flight because of late arrival of the first flight. Personally i think that is a bigger issue. I raised this issue in the AY forum. People over there say two separate PNRs are two separate PNRs for EC 261 purposes even if an airlines checks you through but i wonder if EC agrees with that. I mean airlines check you through previously and I cannot believe cost associated with lost/delayed baggage alone is enough to scrap this benefit (when one has two PNRs on two different airlines). There has to be more to it ...
Last edited by Rivarix; Jun 17, 2016 at 5:59 pm