RG1X

I can't speak for how others feel, but in my opinion the middle seat gap is the only aspect of Club Europe that's meaningful for the price increase.

Status gets me lounge access, and increased baggage allowance as long as I'm not buying a basic economy fare. For the difference in price (assuming no discounts), you'd be able to buy a far better meal than anything they provide as part of Club Europe.

ratechaser

...and I thought that BA has previously argued that the food is complimentary anyway, at least when compensation for lack of catering has been requested...

So yes, I'd personally look at this as an involuntary downgrade, although I know certain venerable members on here disagree.

KARFA

If this is really the case, why don't you book economy and also a comfort seat to start with? Why waste your money on CE if you don't want any of the other benefits, and you can get the only thing you want as an add on to your economy fare?

See here under "Booking an extra seat for additional personal space"

https://www.britishairways.com/en-gb...ving-your-seat

flygod

Great idea.........

Except you have to do it by phone!

KARFA

Ah of course

RG1X

Tier points tend to be the only reason I ever book Club Europe (it's a garbage service, lets be honest).

As for booking an extra seat... BA would fill it in a heartbeat, and worry about it less than they would stealing away the middle seat on a Club Europe booking.

KARFA

Well so it is TPs and avios as well as the free middle seat.

If BA resold your bought comfort seat you would have a clear case of breach of contract, much easier to win than arguing that removal of a middle seat in times of disruption represented a downgrade in the sense that a ec261 downgrade refund was due. Tbh I don't recall any reports of comfort seats being resold, so perhaps it is rare.

I am sorry to sound cynical, but I don't buy the argument that the only thing some people apparently value is the middle seat, and nothing else for the CE product is of any value to them at all. If that was remotely true they could have saved thousands over the years buying ET, bringing a sandwich and drink onboard with them, and relying on status blocked seats or paying for a comfort seats. If you think CE is rubbish, there really is no need for you to waste anymore money on it and you can get what you want at much lower cost.

RG1X

People aren't exactly rational animals most of the time.

That said, 95% of the time I don't fly Club Europe, so I like to think I try to be. I'm only ever in Club Europe as part of a tier point run... for the reasons I already stated.

LCY8737

A little tongue in cheek: Let's try and value that seat according to what BA thinks it is worth: During the current disruption BA is selling club fares in J (with C/D/R/I) zeroed out. Taking LHR-LIS as an example, that would cost £886.07 one way.

Of course BA is not pocketing the full £886, the actual fare is only £832, plus £6 YQ, £48.07 are taxes and fees. BA also has genuine cost included here, assume an average person sips a miniature champagne (£3.50) eats a ready meal (£5) and burns extra fuel (£35).

So BA has made £794.50 by selling a ticket to person 1B and not delivering the product they promised to person 1A and 1C. It seems fair to deprive BA of the profit they made in this situation, so I think £397.25 for each 1A and 1C seems fair compensation.

scottishpoet

LCY8737 its an interesting idea. I think the price paid by the peopel in 1A and 1C should have a bearing

It seems everyone agrees the service being offered when someone is sat in the middle seat is not ful J, the debate really centres around if it is Y or not

Maybe in these circumstances it would be easier for everyone if BA just removed ALL the J benefits on the affected flights, not just the middle seat, and comped everyone affected for a J to Y downgrade. That would be much clearer.

JD1905

Club Europe is advertised and sold as having the middle seat free.


If you have paid for Club Europe and the middle seat is occupied, the product has not been sold as advertised and I would look to claim money back from BA. I would say the reasonable amount to claim would be the difference between a CE and ET fare at the time of booking.

I completely understand that some people feel it’s not a big deal, it wouldn’t be for me either to be honest. But as long as BA continue to advertise the middle seat being free as part of the CE offering, they are misleading customers.

(If you want to add some weight behind your claim you could say you booked CE for extra space due to covid etc.)

AJA_

It might be cleaner and simpler, as you say, to remove ALL the J benefits but then BA would definitely be on the hook for downgrade reimbursement for every J passenger including the poor sods who get allocated the middle seats.

As it is they can still argue that they are offering a J service and avoid compensating all except those who complain. I suspect that figure is a much lower number which is why they do it.



The only way BA will change tack is if every single J passenger on an affected flight collectively sued BA for breach of contract.

I think it would be interesting if those here who defend BA and say that it is still essentially offering a J service were to actually suffer being disrupted this way and be forced to sit in the middle seat and not get any food (on the basis that BA only loaded meals for the original number of passengers) and then get their views.

They argue that despite suffering a disruption, caused by BA, the passengers are still essentially getting a J service, except they forget that those passengers in A and C seats have not suffered an IRROPS, they are booked on the original service which "guaranteed" an empty seat.

NickB

But that would not get you very far as the contractual action would be pre-empted by the Montreal Convention.

Seeking a legal remedy is not going to be particularly fruitful in this situation. Customer relations and PR are the avenues to follow. And if that does not get you what you want, then voting with your feet and fly a carrier that you prefer remains the ultimate solution to the problem.

JD1905

It’s quite a clear and obvious breach of CRA in my view. Product not delivered as advertised.

scottishpoet

Thats what i said

This seems like an over reaction to me. If people complain then based on previous times this has occurred a level of comp is given. It may take time and in my opinion it should be done proactively.

As far as I am aware, in the current set up meals are being loaded for everyone, i have not seen any suggestion people in middle seats or at the back of the cabin are not being offered meals. Additionally, based on the above, with so many people not using the other CE benefits than the empty seats so many people will say no thank you to the food snd drink offered so there will be plenty for everyone that does enjoy those benefits.