Club Europe seating 3-3 on some routes [to help clear storm disruption backlog]
Feb 21, 2022, 10:42 am
#76
Fontaine d'honneur du Flyertalk
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Morbihan, France
Programs: Reine des Muccis de Pucci; Foreign Elitist (according to others)
Posts: 19,179
I've kept my council to see what would happen. I have looked at several flights - tonight's ARN is a case in point.. It is 3x3 tonight and it is full. There are 30 people in C. In the back there are about 13 blocked seats (whatever that signifies) which may still need to be allocated.
It is clear that if I were faced with being left behind or getting home or away - then for the sake of 2-3 hours a middle seat would be better than nothing. If the decision was made to clear backlogs of people caught by cancellations and Y needs to be filled and that to do so every spare seat needs to be used then I see the sense. If BA had actually gone and given letters to be used as vouchers - apologising and offering £100 off their next flight or some such - it would have eased the sting. People may still not be happy, and there will be those who never are, but a gesture, an acknowledgement that this is not as it should be would go a long way. This may have been unavoidable but the PR is appalling. They have managed to make a bad situation worse and whoever allowed that is a fool.
This is a perect storm that the penny pinching has managed to produce. Of course BA can do nothing about the weather - but it could have sorted out the horror story that occurs any time one needs to phone. It has flogged off the staff who worked at the out stations and it has managed to seriously antagonise their customer facing employees. Baggage services are in chaos and the outcome is that they will lose custom. Grief, I bet if I rolled up looking for a job they'd take me back - at my age. They pay peanuts and they expect the earth. People have been leaving in droves and they think that they can manage with what is left and now this has come and bitten them where it hurts. I think that it would take one more IT collapse and they will be in even deeper trouble. People will not want to fly them any more and I do not blame them.
It is clear that if I were faced with being left behind or getting home or away - then for the sake of 2-3 hours a middle seat would be better than nothing. If the decision was made to clear backlogs of people caught by cancellations and Y needs to be filled and that to do so every spare seat needs to be used then I see the sense. If BA had actually gone and given letters to be used as vouchers - apologising and offering £100 off their next flight or some such - it would have eased the sting. People may still not be happy, and there will be those who never are, but a gesture, an acknowledgement that this is not as it should be would go a long way. This may have been unavoidable but the PR is appalling. They have managed to make a bad situation worse and whoever allowed that is a fool.
This is a perect storm that the penny pinching has managed to produce. Of course BA can do nothing about the weather - but it could have sorted out the horror story that occurs any time one needs to phone. It has flogged off the staff who worked at the out stations and it has managed to seriously antagonise their customer facing employees. Baggage services are in chaos and the outcome is that they will lose custom. Grief, I bet if I rolled up looking for a job they'd take me back - at my age. They pay peanuts and they expect the earth. People have been leaving in droves and they think that they can manage with what is left and now this has come and bitten them where it hurts. I think that it would take one more IT collapse and they will be in even deeper trouble. People will not want to fly them any more and I do not blame them.
Feb 21, 2022, 10:43 am
#77
Join Date: Oct 2005
Programs: BA GGL & GfL, AA LTP, Marriott (sigh) Ambassador, Hilton Diamond
Posts: 3,236
You can’t just MCOL it. You have to show sone effort to comply with pre action protocols which includes the use of an alternative dispute resolution scheme.
and unless you are in the middle, you still have you assured aisle or window seat. So only 1/3 passengers are not getting what is promised.
and unless you are in the middle, you still have you assured aisle or window seat. So only 1/3 passengers are not getting what is promised.
Feb 21, 2022, 10:53 am
#78
Join Date: Feb 2022
Location: Kent, UK
Programs: BAEC
Posts: 76
We just got back to the uk on the FNC-LHR route this afternoon. Had no email saying anything had changed, then boarded to find a lovely lady sitting in the seat between my husband and I - her husband had been out in the middle seat of the row in front. When I did seat selection yesterday it was showing seven rows in CE, but there were actually only five rows. Cramped situation compounded by the bloke in front of me slamming his seat into recline with no warning while I had my laptop on the tray - and keeping his seat reclined even through the meal service and landing.
Not happy. Lots of empty seats in ET so I don’t understand why CE passengers were compressed but many ET passengers had more space despite paying less.
i don’t really want them to ‘retrospectively downgrade’ and refund me as I want the CE tier points, but I do feel that some compensation would be reasonable. I wouldn’t have minded so much of ET had been full and BA helping people get home because of the number of cancelled flights in Funchal, but there were at least 10 empty seats in ET that I could see. Cabin crew were great but did try to tell someone that CE had never been seven rows - it was when I went in to select our seats!
Not happy. Lots of empty seats in ET so I don’t understand why CE passengers were compressed but many ET passengers had more space despite paying less.
i don’t really want them to ‘retrospectively downgrade’ and refund me as I want the CE tier points, but I do feel that some compensation would be reasonable. I wouldn’t have minded so much of ET had been full and BA helping people get home because of the number of cancelled flights in Funchal, but there were at least 10 empty seats in ET that I could see. Cabin crew were great but did try to tell someone that CE had never been seven rows - it was when I went in to select our seats!
Feb 21, 2022, 10:56 am
#79
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: London
Programs: Sir Ratechaser Seigneur de la Patience d'un Saint (Mucci), BA Silver, Starbucks Gold
Posts: 2,562
I've kept my council to see what would happen. I have looked at several flights - tonight's ARN is a case in point.. It is 3x3 tonight and it is full. There are 30 people in C. In the back there are about 13 blocked seats (whatever that signifies) which may still need to be allocated.
It is clear that if I were faced with being left behind or getting home or away - then for the sake of 2-3 hours a middle seat would be better than nothing. If the decision was made to clear backlogs of people caught by cancellations and Y needs to be filled and that to do so every spare seat needs to be used then I see the sense. If BA had actually gone and given letters to be used as vouchers - apologising and offering £100 off their next flight or some such - it would have eased the sting. People may still not be happy, and there will be those who never are, but a gesture, an acknowledgement that this is not as it should be would go a long way. This may have been unavoidable but the PR is appalling. They have managed to make a bad situation worse and whoever allowed that is a fool.
This is a perect storm that the penny pinching has managed to produce. Of course BA can do nothing about the weather - but it could have sorted out the horror story that occurs any time one needs to phone. It has flogged off the staff who worked at the out stations and it has managed to seriously antagonise their customer facing employees. Baggage services are in chaos and the outcome is that they will lose custom. Grief, I bet if I rolled up looking for a job they'd take me back - at my age. They pay peanuts and they expect the earth. People have been leaving in droves and they think that they can manage with what is left and now this has come and bitten them where it hurts. I think that it would take one more IT collapse and they will be in even deeper trouble. People will not want to fly them any more and I do not blame them.
It is clear that if I were faced with being left behind or getting home or away - then for the sake of 2-3 hours a middle seat would be better than nothing. If the decision was made to clear backlogs of people caught by cancellations and Y needs to be filled and that to do so every spare seat needs to be used then I see the sense. If BA had actually gone and given letters to be used as vouchers - apologising and offering £100 off their next flight or some such - it would have eased the sting. People may still not be happy, and there will be those who never are, but a gesture, an acknowledgement that this is not as it should be would go a long way. This may have been unavoidable but the PR is appalling. They have managed to make a bad situation worse and whoever allowed that is a fool.
This is a perect storm that the penny pinching has managed to produce. Of course BA can do nothing about the weather - but it could have sorted out the horror story that occurs any time one needs to phone. It has flogged off the staff who worked at the out stations and it has managed to seriously antagonise their customer facing employees. Baggage services are in chaos and the outcome is that they will lose custom. Grief, I bet if I rolled up looking for a job they'd take me back - at my age. They pay peanuts and they expect the earth. People have been leaving in droves and they think that they can manage with what is left and now this has come and bitten them where it hurts. I think that it would take one more IT collapse and they will be in even deeper trouble. People will not want to fly them any more and I do not blame them.
if you find that the position is currently filled, then trial by combat could be a legitimate selection criteria... you'd be a shoo in
Feb 21, 2022, 11:32 am
#80
Join Date: Nov 2004
Programs: BA GGL, LH FTL
Posts: 3,578
This falls in the category of "careful what you wish for". Her hairbrush is famous for a reason, and while some may enjoy this "enhanced" service, many may not fully appreciate it.
Feb 21, 2022, 11:37 am
#81
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: London
Programs: Sir Ratechaser Seigneur de la Patience d'un Saint (Mucci), BA Silver, Starbucks Gold
Posts: 2,562
I think the current BA management would have far more to fear than me as a mere customer. Provided of course there are no wild notions to ban silvers from the lounge...
Feb 21, 2022, 11:55 am
#82
Ambassador: Emirates Airlines
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Manchester, UK
Posts: 18,613
Because BA realised they can make money out of this. Compress CE, and then charge a fortune for the remaining middle seats.
Feb 21, 2022, 12:27 pm
#83
Join Date: Oct 2021
Location: London (née Melbourne)
Programs: Qantas Platinum (Oneworld Emerald)
Posts: 979
Just landed at LHR, I was allocated 2B but got moved to 1E upon boarding. Not given an explanation but noticed the table that goes across the middle seat in Club was still there on rows 2 and 3. Overheard some others had been moved to row 7, not sure if they still got the Club food and drinks service there, the curtain was up behind row 3.
About 5 minutes before scheduled departure time I received the “difficult decision” email from BA. Better late than never I suppose.
Cabin manager apologised to us all in row 1 and said it was due to weather disruptions and to accommodate people from cancelled flights. She appeared quite stressed, she announced “cabin crew seats for landing” just before takeoff.
I cheekily asked if BA would be offering any compensation and was dryly told to contact customer relations. Service was good otherwise and we were proactively offered many drinks.
About 5 minutes before scheduled departure time I received the “difficult decision” email from BA. Better late than never I suppose.
Cabin manager apologised to us all in row 1 and said it was due to weather disruptions and to accommodate people from cancelled flights. She appeared quite stressed, she announced “cabin crew seats for landing” just before takeoff.
I cheekily asked if BA would be offering any compensation and was dryly told to contact customer relations. Service was good otherwise and we were proactively offered many drinks.
Feb 21, 2022, 1:06 pm
#84
Suspended
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Watchlisted by the prejudiced, en route to purgatory
Programs: Just Say No to Fleecing and Blacklisting
Posts: 102,095
Even some rather regular SK business class flyers still don't realize that their business class tickets may not spare them from having a packed 3x3 economy class-type seating arrangement at the front of their SK short/mid-haul flights.
Feb 21, 2022, 1:08 pm
#85
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: London, UK
Programs: BAEC Gold-GGL
Posts: 1,185
I'm currently at GLA awaiting the delayed 1950 to LHR. I received the email about 3+3 in club too.
On Weds last week my flight up to GLA was brought forward and I received multiple texts, calls and emails to confirm I had noticed the change and could be at LHR two hours earlier.
At least clotted cream was back to go with the scone.
On Weds last week my flight up to GLA was brought forward and I received multiple texts, calls and emails to confirm I had noticed the change and could be at LHR two hours earlier.
At least clotted cream was back to go with the scone.
Feb 21, 2022, 1:44 pm
#86
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Munich, Algarve, Sussex or S.F Bay Area
Programs: Mucci, BA Gold, A3*Gold, AA Plat, HH Gold, IHG Plat Amb, Marriott Plat
Posts: 4,163
I wonder what Mr Banner Q.C. might think of BA opening CE middle seats when it is convenient for them to do so.
Seriously though, I think this is a cheap move. If BA compensated CE passengers for the downgrade, or made some gesture and offered free rebooking or cancellation then perhaps arguable. These days of Covid and Social Distancing, I reserve CE for the extra space on board ,since all the other extras I have with my shiny card anyway. I would be none too amused to find the middle seat allocated and would indeed consider this a downgrade and pursue it as one, since the free middle seat and the $10 "meal" is the only difference to Economy.
Seriously though, I think this is a cheap move. If BA compensated CE passengers for the downgrade, or made some gesture and offered free rebooking or cancellation then perhaps arguable. These days of Covid and Social Distancing, I reserve CE for the extra space on board ,since all the other extras I have with my shiny card anyway. I would be none too amused to find the middle seat allocated and would indeed consider this a downgrade and pursue it as one, since the free middle seat and the $10 "meal" is the only difference to Economy.
Feb 21, 2022, 2:29 pm
#87
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: M4, T5, DME, DXB, CAI, SDF among many others
Programs: BAEC GfL/GGL/CCR, BA Amex, Quidco, IHG Spire, Hotels.com Reinstated Gold)
Posts: 272
8/16 middle seats were in use which would have needed the curtain to move 2 rows back where there was plenty of space. Madness.
Feb 21, 2022, 3:07 pm
#88
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: London, UK
Programs: BAEC Gold-GGL
Posts: 1,185
Crew Lead on this evening's GLA-LHR flight apologised to CE customers and mentioned that Customer Services will be in touch in the next few days. So will see what they offer.
Only 4 crew serving what was a pretty full flight and I think they did well. Even called me by name! Felt sorry for the person put in the middle seat but they were just happy to be delayed any further.
Only 4 crew serving what was a pretty full flight and I think they did well. Even called me by name! Felt sorry for the person put in the middle seat but they were just happy to be delayed any further.
Feb 21, 2022, 3:22 pm
#89
Suspended
Join Date: Jan 2022
Posts: 8
So BA are selling last minute seats in 'club europe' at a grand a pop, with no mention the advertised service won't be provided, while knowingly planning to operate 3x3? And they are claiming this is for IIROPs to clear a backlog, while still selling tickets for routes that weren't affected, that are departing with plenty of empty seats and clearly have no reason for a backlog? Aren't flights normally zeroed out in true IIROPs when needed to clear backlogs?
And this is legal? Seems like something a regulator should be looking at.
As for that email, it's so insulting that they ask for people's understanding, while offering nothing in return. Yes I'm sure most of us are perfectly happy that stranded people get home where that in necessary and willing to accept a bit of discomfort to facilitate that. But it has to be a two way street, customers do their bit, while BA is apparently taking advantage to take in an unexpected windfall.
If you don't provide a service as advertised I think the law is fairly clear you have to offer some form of recompense to offset that. It is such contempt that they openly tell people they'll not receive what they paid for, and that's that the end of the matter. Appealing to people good nature is some cheek too. Where is BAs good nature? They really genuinely are asking people to just deal with it? It's so brazen.
And this is legal? Seems like something a regulator should be looking at.
As for that email, it's so insulting that they ask for people's understanding, while offering nothing in return. Yes I'm sure most of us are perfectly happy that stranded people get home where that in necessary and willing to accept a bit of discomfort to facilitate that. But it has to be a two way street, customers do their bit, while BA is apparently taking advantage to take in an unexpected windfall.
If you don't provide a service as advertised I think the law is fairly clear you have to offer some form of recompense to offset that. It is such contempt that they openly tell people they'll not receive what they paid for, and that's that the end of the matter. Appealing to people good nature is some cheek too. Where is BAs good nature? They really genuinely are asking people to just deal with it? It's so brazen.