BA to cut up to 12,000 jobs in "restructuring and redundancy programme"
Apr 29, 2020, 4:27 am
#121
Join Date: Jul 2014
Programs: BAEC, VS Flying Club
Posts: 797
If you’re finding enough time to pay your bills or cook a fry-up during a Zoom call, I’d humbly suggest that’s a failure of management - not of the concept of video calls which, when run correctly, can be perfectly productive.
Apr 29, 2020, 4:28 am
#122
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 2,345
My thoughts too, even once in-country restrictions are eased, such as those in Italy, Germany and Belgium recently it will be a long time before travel resumes. Once a country believes it is even slightly on top of Covid-19 the last thing it will want is plane loads of people coming in whose status is unknown.
For airlines this is going to be a long, long process to get back to anything remotely resembling normality, maybe not until a vaccination is developed and proof of vaccination will be a condition of travel.
For airlines this is going to be a long, long process to get back to anything remotely resembling normality, maybe not until a vaccination is developed and proof of vaccination will be a condition of travel.
Apr 29, 2020, 4:43 am
#123
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Vale of Glamorgan
Programs: BAEC Gold
Posts: 2,992
Not least of the concerns is that immunity passports would potentially punish those people who have behaved responsibly and tried their best to reduce their own risk of exposure and that of transmission within their communities, while rewarding those who ignored the rules and contracted the disease.
But, back on topic... it looks very likely that aviation will take years to recover, and in the meantime airlines are going to have to make very tough decisions including redundancies. Their fixed costs are such that even a relatively small drop in revenue makes them unviable. I see other airlines having to make similar decisions very soon.
Apr 29, 2020, 4:46 am
#124
Join Date: Apr 2020
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 232
Most of the talk is of how dangerous and ineffective covid-19 passports would be.
Not least of the concerns is that immunity passports would potentially punish those people who have behaved responsibly and tried their best to reduce their own risk of exposure and that of transmission within their communities, while rewarding those who ignored the rules and contracted the disease.
But, back on topic... it looks very likely that aviation will take years to recover, and in the meantime airlines are going to have to make very tough decisions including redundancies. Their fixed costs are such that even a relatively small drop in revenue makes them unviable.
Not least of the concerns is that immunity passports would potentially punish those people who have behaved responsibly and tried their best to reduce their own risk of exposure and that of transmission within their communities, while rewarding those who ignored the rules and contracted the disease.
But, back on topic... it looks very likely that aviation will take years to recover, and in the meantime airlines are going to have to make very tough decisions including redundancies. Their fixed costs are such that even a relatively small drop in revenue makes them unviable.
Apr 29, 2020, 4:49 am
#125
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: UK
Programs: IC Hotels Spire, BA Gold
Posts: 8,668
But surely the flaw in this is that it only states at the point in time you had the test that you are free from the virus? Unless it is done for all pax on entering the plane and a result instantly available then what would be the point? Because if you have the test a few weeks / days before travel, anything could then happen in terms of exposure to the virus in the days then before travel. Or am I missing something here?
Apr 29, 2020, 4:56 am
#126
Join Date: Apr 2020
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 232
But surely the flaw in this is that it only states at the point in time you had the test that you are free from the virus? Unless it is done for all pax on entering the plane and a result instantly available then what would be the point? Because if you have the test a few weeks / days before travel, anything could then happen in terms of exposure to the virus in the days then before travel. Or am I missing something here?
Apr 29, 2020, 4:56 am
#127
Join Date: Oct 2019
Location: clue is in the nym
Programs: BA Gold, TP Gold, VS Gold, Hilton Diamond, IHG Diamond, Hyatt Globalist, Marriott Platinum
Posts: 833
The Job Retention Scheme, unless extended, ends on 30th June, at which point everyone's back on payroll fully at the airline's expense. Consultation with the unions on the scale and apportionment any redundancies requires 45 days, followed by any notice periods that will need to be given to those individuals affected. Now is exactly the time to be starting to plan for what the operating environment is going to look like, needs and can support in the future.
Last edited by southlondonphil; Apr 29, 2020 at 5:17 am
Apr 29, 2020, 4:58 am
#128
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: The Blackwater Valley (Berkshire/Hampshire/Surrey border area)
Programs: BAEC Silver, Hilton Gold, Bonvoy Gold, IHG Diamond, etc etc
Posts: 199
A friend owns several international businesses, one of which has 4 board meetings a year across the globe, each meeting costs around $100k excluding the salaries of the directors. They’ve held a zoom board meeting during the shutdown and he sees no reason why 3 of the 4 meetings each year cannot be done remotely, they save $300k and staff are not spending two days per meeting travelling.
Not least of which is trying to find meeting times that suit a majority... eg what time do you schedule a meeting involving UK, Japan and USA (doesn't matter which coast!). Equally, there is a sanity factor - anything beyond two hours (or so) is unrealistic online.
Apr 29, 2020, 4:58 am
#129
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 1,106
Having consulted at a large business last year that needed to shed around 100 staff out of 500, the selection criteria they generally used were those with less than 2 years employment and those with <3 years to usual retirement. The former group were low cost / low risk to shed because of the UK <2 year rule and the latter group were offered a voluntary scheme. Pretty much everyone with < 1 year to go immediately volunteered and about half of the <2-3 years to retire group so the 100 number was easily met.
Maybe not the most scientific approach but it was the most economical way to do it for the company and virtually no resentment from the remaining staff who saw it as very fair......last in / first out and at the upper end it was voluntary.
Maybe not the most scientific approach but it was the most economical way to do it for the company and virtually no resentment from the remaining staff who saw it as very fair......last in / first out and at the upper end it was voluntary.
LIFO is a risky strategy if not used alongside other objective criteria to determine who will be dismissed through redundancy.
It's sad when employers look at the cheapest option to reduce their headcount by selecting the low hanging fruit for easy dismissal. I have seen the 'price of everything - value of nothing' option resulting in staff who were productive, conscientious, loyal and definitely an asset to the business, being sold down the river to save a few bob in redundancy payments while the dead wood is retained.
Hopefully BA don't adopt this short- termism option.
Apr 29, 2020, 4:59 am
#130
Join Date: Feb 2009
Programs: Mucci, BA, Hilton.
Posts: 1,158
My thoughts are with all the people that will be made redundant. A very unpleasant experience.
Inevitably in a company the size of BA there will be a range of people that this will appeal to, a la CIHY. I hope they can find away to find the people that "want" to go first. I wonder if they would consider re-employing a group of the experienced people to improve service and standards and help training in the years to come, if those people want to do it. Perhaps not the time to think about that.
It will be a tough time for a number of years despite most major governments doing an excellent job of keeping people relatively well funded in the hope of a V recession.
It is terrible to say but it can only be the tip of the iceberg in terms of the aviation industries in general.
Inevitably in a company the size of BA there will be a range of people that this will appeal to, a la CIHY. I hope they can find away to find the people that "want" to go first. I wonder if they would consider re-employing a group of the experienced people to improve service and standards and help training in the years to come, if those people want to do it. Perhaps not the time to think about that.
It will be a tough time for a number of years despite most major governments doing an excellent job of keeping people relatively well funded in the hope of a V recession.
It is terrible to say but it can only be the tip of the iceberg in terms of the aviation industries in general.
Apr 29, 2020, 5:09 am
#131
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: UK
Programs: IC Hotels Spire, BA Gold
Posts: 8,668
I bet they did!
LIFO is a risky strategy if not used alongside other objective criteria to determine who will be dismissed through redundancy.
It's sad when employers look at the cheapest option to reduce their headcount by selecting the low hanging fruit for easy dismissal. I have seen the 'price of everything - value of nothing' option resulting in staff who were productive, conscientious, loyal and definitely an asset to the business, being sold down the river to save a few bob in redundancy payments while the dead wood is retained.
Hopefully BA don't adopt this short- termism option.
LIFO is a risky strategy if not used alongside other objective criteria to determine who will be dismissed through redundancy.
It's sad when employers look at the cheapest option to reduce their headcount by selecting the low hanging fruit for easy dismissal. I have seen the 'price of everything - value of nothing' option resulting in staff who were productive, conscientious, loyal and definitely an asset to the business, being sold down the river to save a few bob in redundancy payments while the dead wood is retained.
Hopefully BA don't adopt this short- termism option.
Apr 29, 2020, 5:19 am
#132
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Henley-On-Thames
Programs: BAEC Silver (but only temporarily) AVIS Presidents Club, Starbucks Gold
Posts: 486
ML
Apr 29, 2020, 5:26 am
#133
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: London, UK
Programs: BAEC
Posts: 3,440
This was from LondonSpotter:
1. The three fleets will be closed to create a single, London Heathrow based team. This means that cabin crew will no longer be placed in fleets such as mixed fleet or euro fleet but all be in one team together.
2. To increase ‘operational flexibility’ all crew will fly both short- and long-haul.
3. There will be a new ‘simplified onboard supervisory structure’
1. The three fleets will be closed to create a single, London Heathrow based team. This means that cabin crew will no longer be placed in fleets such as mixed fleet or euro fleet but all be in one team together.
2. To increase ‘operational flexibility’ all crew will fly both short- and long-haul.
3. There will be a new ‘simplified onboard supervisory structure’
Apr 29, 2020, 5:27 am
#134
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: London, UK
Programs: BAEC
Posts: 3,440
I can’t see all that many EuroFleet crew wanting to go from a daytrip to Dublin to a weeks trip to Sydney, especially if they have a family. I guess that’s what BA want to encourage VR.
Apr 29, 2020, 5:33 am
#135
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 1,106
I wasn't suggesting anything other than Irrespective of the 'differences' of each organisation - or indeed the need to 'conserve cash' (which is usually a key factor in any redundancy situation anyway), those 'differences' or other 'needs' should not disregard the requirement to adhere to UK employment law by failing to implement a fair redundancy procedure that should be established in an organisations existing policies and procedures and used when required.