Hand baggage-only fares have turned people into monsters
Nov 20, 2017, 12:21 pm
#31
Join Date: Apr 2017
Programs: AA, DL, Avis, Enterprise, National, IHG, HH, SPG/MR
Posts: 1,852
OK, this is largely a rant, but I'm just venting. Thanks for bearing with.
I flew to Bologna for a weekend away with the other half and had a great time - apart from the flight there and back.
The "gate rage" was palpable both ways with people lining up early and jostling, and some people cutting the priority line, then getting shouted at but not caring, just to get valuable overhead luggage space.
The whole atmosphere boarding on both flights was horrible.
Even in Business (which I don't generally fly within Europe, but sometimes do) you are not guaranteed overhead locker space unless you make sure you're the first to board, which doesn't always happen if you're lolling in the lounge. (First world problems, I know, I know...)
I just don't know what the answer is. I think the airlines (in the US, now here) have created a monster that can't be undone
I know BA are introducing zoned boarding but I don't think that will help - groups 2 & 3 will still mill around the gate and block it, I'm sure. And pity poor group 5 who will be the ones with hand baggage only who get on last and have zero chance of a spot in an overhead locker. You pays your money, I guess.
BA passive-aggressively hands out the "bag must go under the seat in front" label, but then don't seem to follow up any enforcement. Some people ignore the label (either arrogant or don't speak English) and bung two bags (one labeled) in the overhead locker (ie flight home last night - definitely arrogant: challenged by American woman and he just sneered at her). I'm sure cabin crew staff must hate the whole scenario too.
As a Gold-Card holder I'm seriously considering ditching BA on European routes for easyJet...if you go for Speedy Boarding with them there just doesn't seem to be the same vile atmosphere that has developed on BA. Their ground staff seem more empowered to challenge those who are bringing on the kitchen sink.
Sorry, as I said, just venting...
I flew to Bologna for a weekend away with the other half and had a great time - apart from the flight there and back.
The "gate rage" was palpable both ways with people lining up early and jostling, and some people cutting the priority line, then getting shouted at but not caring, just to get valuable overhead luggage space.
The whole atmosphere boarding on both flights was horrible.
Even in Business (which I don't generally fly within Europe, but sometimes do) you are not guaranteed overhead locker space unless you make sure you're the first to board, which doesn't always happen if you're lolling in the lounge. (First world problems, I know, I know...)
I just don't know what the answer is. I think the airlines (in the US, now here) have created a monster that can't be undone
I know BA are introducing zoned boarding but I don't think that will help - groups 2 & 3 will still mill around the gate and block it, I'm sure. And pity poor group 5 who will be the ones with hand baggage only who get on last and have zero chance of a spot in an overhead locker. You pays your money, I guess.
BA passive-aggressively hands out the "bag must go under the seat in front" label, but then don't seem to follow up any enforcement. Some people ignore the label (either arrogant or don't speak English) and bung two bags (one labeled) in the overhead locker (ie flight home last night - definitely arrogant: challenged by American woman and he just sneered at her). I'm sure cabin crew staff must hate the whole scenario too.
As a Gold-Card holder I'm seriously considering ditching BA on European routes for easyJet...if you go for Speedy Boarding with them there just doesn't seem to be the same vile atmosphere that has developed on BA. Their ground staff seem more empowered to challenge those who are bringing on the kitchen sink.
Sorry, as I said, just venting...
Nov 20, 2017, 12:39 pm
#32
Moderator, Iberia Airlines, Airport Lounges, and Ambassador, British Airways Executive Club
Join Date: Feb 2010
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What’s your strategy CWS? At what point in boarding do you rock up? And have you ever struggled to place your bag in an overhead? Does it make a difference where you’re sat on the plane?
I’d love to rock up at the last minute, but get anxious about finding overhead space.
I’d love to rock up at the last minute, but get anxious about finding overhead space.
Just be polite and gracious to the crew and ground staff, but stay happy. Flying shouldn't cause anxiety!
I have to say on AA I would normally not leave it to the last moment for all sorts of reasons. Using the Priority lane during group 3 or so is a good compromise - those passenger will be on the other side of the tensa and the Priority lane will usually be clear at this point.
Nov 20, 2017, 12:42 pm
#33
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Provincie Antwerpen, Vlaanderen, België
Programs: MUCCI Gold
Posts: 2,512
Ugh, hell no, baggage issues are bad enough as it is. You realize that people are going to a destination and need clothing for when they arrive, right? I never understood that about those LCC fares that only include under-seat storage. And all it does it increase fees as people now have to pay for hold or overhead bin space.
In my opinion, the answer to easier boarding is to give everyone one roller bag - either in the hold (any allowable size) OR overhead (standard size). Of course the tracking logistics of that are complicated, and the airlines would rather gate-check the bags when the bins run out, than give up those hold fees.
In my opinion, the answer to easier boarding is to give everyone one roller bag - either in the hold (any allowable size) OR overhead (standard size). Of course the tracking logistics of that are complicated, and the airlines would rather gate-check the bags when the bins run out, than give up those hold fees.
I'd turn it around as all those airport fees paid as part of the ticket ought to cover you for the cost of handling one bag. You get one hold bag free (the airline can comp more for higher status tiers), and whatever you take on board goes under the seat period. Overhead locker storage is the most in demand and limited commodity, so charge it per piece for people that insist on using it if they're too important to wait for the carousel like everybody else. The airline knows exactly how much overhead space is allocated - once it's gone it's gone, and no faffing on departure trying to stow excess bags in every spare corner of the aircraft. Job's a carrot.
Nov 20, 2017, 1:22 pm
#34
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Perth WA/ UK
Programs: BA Gold, Priority Club Gold, Accor Silver, Virgin Australia Gold
Posts: 1,752
I think the point really is why should anyone have to put hand luggage under the seat in front? There is little enough room. Is there a further discount for this inconvenience? Of course not! It's been said before and I agree, the hand baggage only fare turned BA into a cattle pen at the gates, at least the more modern aircraft are now introducing additional overhead bin space and also the BA crew should be stopped from putting their bags overhead. Also have you seen the size of them sometimes? Pop them in the hold lovies..
Nov 20, 2017, 2:23 pm
#35
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Scotland
Programs: # Neodymium #
Posts: 968
Yup.
I choose to travel with a small hand baggage item, that always fits under the seat.
I sacrifice my leg room, in return for zero stress, and the ability to board late/last with zero stress.
Pros and cons.
I choose to travel with a small hand baggage item, that always fits under the seat.
I sacrifice my leg room, in return for zero stress, and the ability to board late/last with zero stress.
Pros and cons.
Nov 20, 2017, 3:51 pm
#36
Suspended
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 1,271
The whole issue is a result of airlines caving in to the public's demand for lower fares. If the fares were double what they are today and as they should be compared to fares in the past, the problem would go away. https://www.theatlantic.com/business...oticed/273506/
Instead, the airlines have caved in and as a result, you get all these issues like HBO fares and fees for a bag of peanuts, etc. which the public in their ignorance of being the victims of their own demands, complain about.
If I had my way, overhead bins would be removed completely from all planes. Nothing to argue about then.
Instead, the airlines have caved in and as a result, you get all these issues like HBO fares and fees for a bag of peanuts, etc. which the public in their ignorance of being the victims of their own demands, complain about.
If I had my way, overhead bins would be removed completely from all planes. Nothing to argue about then.
Nov 20, 2017, 3:56 pm
#37
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: UK
Programs: MUCCI du gingembre cinquant, CAMRA
Posts: 1,278
Nov 20, 2017, 3:56 pm
#38
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: The North
Posts: 1,848
Not yet had occasion to use it as carry on but it is quite cavernous and when not in use folds up inside itself with the aid of zippers to something about the size of a large paperback. I’ll have to dig out the thread and leave a proper review!I agree, a lot of stress in boarding is caused by people being inconsiderate around others. In my case, my usual medium backpack (North Face Borealis) can go under the seat in front at a push, but unless it’s almost empty I much prefer it in the overhead so that I have some room for my feet. There is almost always enough room for it sitting on top of others’ suitcases, and still leave space for jackets etc on top. What is frustrating is when people take up all of the space with their bags without placing them sensibly, eg putting smalll bags end on, or putting smaller plastic bags in a space that would be better used for a suitcass - leaving lots of space available but in small pockets.
Nov 20, 2017, 4:10 pm
#39
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: London
Programs: BAEC Gold, *A Gold, Hertz President's Circle, HHonors Diamond
Posts: 529
Ideally I like to be among the final dozen or so passengers, or even the very last one, I'd normally arrive at the gate about 22 minutes or so before departure time, and if they are still boarding or there is a scrum of people trying to board I just leave everyone to it for a few minutes, perhaps go off to get a coffee or something. The scrum tends to dissipate after 5 minutes or so, in my experience. I am always HBO and have one large bag, within dimensions, with everything in it. It isn't a rollaboard, more of a duffle bag, so squidgy, which is a crucial help. No second bag. It has never gone in the hold, and usually I find a spot somewhere close to where I'm sat. I'm not too bothered if it ends up a few rows behind me. Worst case scenario - you have to wait a minute or two on departure but quite frequently kind people pass it forward (doubtless so they can get to their own bag!). The bag can just about squeeze under the seat in front, and I've probably done that perhaps twice in the last 5 years or so on shorter hops, so that's below the 1% materiality threshold for me.
Just be polite and gracious to the crew and ground staff, but stay happy. Flying shouldn't cause anxiety!
I have to say on AA I would normally not leave it to the last moment for all sorts of reasons. Using the Priority lane during group 3 or so is a good compromise - those passenger will be on the other side of the tensa and the Priority lane will usually be clear at this point.
Just be polite and gracious to the crew and ground staff, but stay happy. Flying shouldn't cause anxiety!
I have to say on AA I would normally not leave it to the last moment for all sorts of reasons. Using the Priority lane during group 3 or so is a good compromise - those passenger will be on the other side of the tensa and the Priority lane will usually be clear at this point.
Nov 20, 2017, 4:20 pm
#40
Moderator, Iberia Airlines, Airport Lounges, and Ambassador, British Airways Executive Club
Join Date: Feb 2010
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The 43 litre Skypak. Here is one of many suppliers
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Skypak-53cm.../dp/B00EHG1C82
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Skypak-53cm.../dp/B00EHG1C82
Nov 20, 2017, 4:43 pm
#41
Join Date: Oct 2016
Posts: 698
The whole issue is a result of airlines caving in to the public's demand for lower fares. If the fares were double what they are today and as they should be compared to fares in the past, the problem would go away. https://www.theatlantic.com/business...oticed/273506/
Instead, the airlines have caved in and as a result, you get all these issues like HBO fares and fees for a bag of peanuts, etc. which the public in their ignorance of being the victims of their own demands, complain about.
If I had my way, overhead bins would be removed completely from all planes. Nothing to argue about then.
Instead, the airlines have caved in and as a result, you get all these issues like HBO fares and fees for a bag of peanuts, etc. which the public in their ignorance of being the victims of their own demands, complain about.
If I had my way, overhead bins would be removed completely from all planes. Nothing to argue about then.
Nov 20, 2017, 4:50 pm
#42
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: London
Programs: BAEC Gold, *A Gold, Hertz President's Circle, HHonors Diamond
Posts: 529
Ideally I like to be among the final dozen or so passengers, or even the very last one, I'd normally arrive at the gate about 22 minutes or so before departure time, and if they are still boarding or there is a scrum of people trying to board I just leave everyone to it for a few minutes, perhaps go off to get a coffee or something. The scrum tends to dissipate after 5 minutes or so, in my experience. I am always HBO and have one large bag, within dimensions, with everything in it. It isn't a
rollaboard, more of a duffle bag, so squidgy, which is a crucial help. No second bag. It has never gone in the hold, and usually I find a spot somewhere close to where I'm sat. I'm not too bothered if it ends up a few rows behind me. Worst case scenario - you have to wait a minute or two on departure but quite frequently kind people pass it forward (doubtless so they can get to their own bag!). The bag can just about squeeze under the seat in front, and I've probably done that perhaps twice in the last 5 years or so on shorter hops, so that's below the 1% materiality threshold for me.
Just be polite and gracious to the crew and ground staff, but stay happy. Flying shouldn't cause anxiety!
I have to say on AA I would normally not leave it to the last moment for all sorts of reasons. Using the Priority lane during group 3 or so is a good compromise - those passenger will be on the other side of the tensa and the Priority lane will usually be clear at this point.
rollaboard, more of a duffle bag, so squidgy, which is a crucial help. No second bag. It has never gone in the hold, and usually I find a spot somewhere close to where I'm sat. I'm not too bothered if it ends up a few rows behind me. Worst case scenario - you have to wait a minute or two on departure but quite frequently kind people pass it forward (doubtless so they can get to their own bag!). The bag can just about squeeze under the seat in front, and I've probably done that perhaps twice in the last 5 years or so on shorter hops, so that's below the 1% materiality threshold for me.
Just be polite and gracious to the crew and ground staff, but stay happy. Flying shouldn't cause anxiety!
I have to say on AA I would normally not leave it to the last moment for all sorts of reasons. Using the Priority lane during group 3 or so is a good compromise - those passenger will be on the other side of the tensa and the Priority lane will usually be clear at this point.
The 43 litre Skypak. Here is one of many suppliers
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Skypak-53cm.../dp/B00EHG1C82
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Skypak-53cm.../dp/B00EHG1C82
Nov 20, 2017, 4:55 pm
#43
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: In the air
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I have to say on AA I would normally not leave it to the last moment for all sorts of reasons. Using the Priority lane during group 3 or so is a good compromise - those passenger will be on the other side of the tensa and the Priority lane will usually be clear at this point.
Nov 20, 2017, 5:25 pm
#44
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Oxfordshire, UK
Programs: BAEC Silver, IHG & Accor Plat...
Posts: 734
These issues raised by the OP predate HBO, particularly at winter time with bulky coats, and I was glad my travel requirements were much less when HBO came out ....I really wondered at the time if the policy and process wonks at Waterside had ever actually been on their own flights. In fact, I still do!
Last edited by LostAntipod; Nov 20, 2017 at 5:26 pm Reason: Carousel
Nov 20, 2017, 5:59 pm
#45
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Amsterdam, Asia, UK
Programs: IHG RA (Spire), HH Diamond, MR Platinum, SQ Gold, KLM Gold, BAEC Gold
Posts: 5,072
My pet hate is different but similar, again related to selfish self-centered fliers
How many times have I entered the cabin via elite Prtyboarding a little late as sauntered down from the airline lounge, boarding at same time as the usual last 10rows of economy passengers are let onboard, AND see an economy passenger/(couples) for say ROW-60 place rolla-case and hand-lugage-bag in overhead bin of first Y rows eg ROW 21 or ROW 31.
How many times have I entered the cabin via elite Prtyboarding a little late as sauntered down from the airline lounge, boarding at same time as the usual last 10rows of economy passengers are let onboard, AND see an economy passenger/(couples) for say ROW-60 place rolla-case and hand-lugage-bag in overhead bin of first Y rows eg ROW 21 or ROW 31.