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AAdvantage program changes rumored Oct 2021

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AAdvantage program changes rumored Oct 2021

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Old Sep 30, 2021 | 12:31 pm
  #46  
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Originally Posted by Mr. BoH
Who caps earnings? Other earning-based programs that I am very familiar with (Southwest, Amtrak) do not cap. I didn't think UA did either, but I am not certain of that.
UA caps at 75,000 miles per ticket. At 11 miles per dollar for a 1K/EXP, you earn nothing once fare goes past $6,818.

Originally Posted by Mr. BoH
In theory, they shouldn't need a cap - they are just allocating x% of their revenue back to the awards program.
A common misconception. These devaluations are not about giving the customer a fair return, they're about driving marginal revenue while cutting benefits. It's a win/win for the airline, a lose/lose for the customer.
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Old Sep 30, 2021 | 12:35 pm
  #47  
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Originally Posted by PresRDC
Could be good for me depending on how they handle flights purchased on partner airlines. With AA offering an inferior in-flight product at the moment, flying partners is more appealing than ever. As long as someone buying at least 4-5 international J tickets per year can earn EXP, it will be fine for me.
UA can be pretty punitive with the elite qualifying dollar caps they put on partners, though I'll note AA has always been more generous on elite qualification on most oneworld partners compared to UA and Star. (I.E. United didn't count non-UA flights toward million mile status and until the change to revenue based elite qualification, you didn't even get premier qualifying dollars on partners flights not ticketed by UA.)
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Old Sep 30, 2021 | 12:36 pm
  #48  
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Originally Posted by Kacee
A common misconception. These devaluations are not about giving the customer a fair return, they're about driving marginal revenue while cutting benefits. It's a win/win for the airline, a lose/lose for the customer.
As are most of the changes to these programs. Until it causes a true dip in the value of the FF program, I expect these types of changes to continue.
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Old Sep 30, 2021 | 12:37 pm
  #49  
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Originally Posted by olouie
Yeah AA started some limited dynamic pricing but if you dont like it now you arent going to like it in the future. At least partner flights still have charts but that will likely go away. The system is designed to make it as hard as possible for flyers to get value out of their miles. 1 cpm is the maximum value they want to give but would love to give much less.

WN has the easiest earring and redemption model, closest to true revenue base Ive seen.
I must be missing something -- I don't know what you look for in award searches, but for domestic coach awards, it is by all means full dynamic pricing, with award prices ranging far in excess of cash prices.

Pull up mid November SWO-SEA for Wed November 17th. AA3881 and 2394 (12 hours travel time, late night 12:57 AM arrival) is the cheapest points fare at 6K points. Cash price is $123. There is an option using AA3881 and 1241 that trims 3 hours from the travel time and has a more reasonable arrive time. Cash price is $118 -- obviously the better choice on cash. Awards price is 10.5K miles though, because obviously when it comes to points we should pay 66% MORE for a slightly more convenient flightpath, nevermind that the revenue department priced it about exactly the same.

Let's say, I would rather travel that Friday. Cash prices for that day range from $173 and up, the afternoon flights are $454 largely because that afternoon SWO-DFW flight is quite full due to it being right before the Fall/Thanksgiving university holiday. The cheapest awards flight that day though is 29K points (ONE WAY) for one of the early flight. (All afternoon flights are 50K points). So, the value per mile is less than a cent per mile no matter what you do that day -- even if you take a cheap morning flight that doesn't cost a lot in cash they want 29K points + for it.

And I spent zero time 'searching' for this data, it was just the first random flight/date I came up with. Aadvantage miles are just as (or more) worthless as skypesos on domestic coach flights unless you find that one day and odd flight that you are willing to take. 1 cent per mile redemptions and following the same demand/supply dynamics that governs cash prices is at least honest about the value of the miles and allows you to use them for the flights you actually are wanting to take.

I work in a unversity town. I wonder how many parents have a million miles saved over years thinking they will use them to fly their kid home on Thanksgiving break, only to find that the value of the miles to fly them at those specific times are devalued to 0.6 cents per mile (or worse).
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Old Sep 30, 2021 | 1:08 pm
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Originally Posted by Hipplewm
As a second data point - when I qualified EXP, I had to spend 36,312 on AA to get enough EQM to make EXP - that is plain stupid and it is why I gave up on AA and stayed with UA (GS doesn't hurt either )
AA should be sending a limo to your house. You might be AAs most profitable customer.
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Old Sep 30, 2021 | 1:37 pm
  #51  
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I think AA will move to a general rule where each mile will be worth .8 cents for general members, 1 cent per mile for credit card holders and gold members, 1.2 cents per mile for platinum members, 1.4 cents per mile for platinum pro, 1.6 cents per mile for Executive Platinum and 2 cents per mile for concierge key.

I think they might move to a fixed spending amount for status:

$250,000 per year for Concierge Key
$25,000 per year for EXP
$20,000 per year for Platinum Pro
$15,000 per year for Platinum
$10,000 per year for Gold
I bet you'd be able to get $10k EQDs by spending $100k in a year on the Barclays Silver card

I also think they could further reduce the number of SWUs for EXP down to 2, but you will get an additional 2 for every $5k you spend over $25k

I think if this happens I'll probably switch to Delta
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Old Sep 30, 2021 | 1:38 pm
  #52  
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Originally Posted by MarkOK
I must be missing something -- I don't know what you look for in award searches, but for domestic coach awards, it is by all means full dynamic pricing, with award prices ranging far in excess of cash prices.

Pull up mid November SWO-SEA for Wed November 17th. AA3881 and 2394 (12 hours travel time, late night 12:57 AM arrival) is the cheapest points fare at 6K points. Cash price is $123. There is an option using AA3881 and 1241 that trims 3 hours from the travel time and has a more reasonable arrive time. Cash price is $118 -- obviously the better choice on cash. Awards price is 10.5K miles though, because obviously when it comes to points we should pay 66% MORE for a slightly more convenient flightpath, nevermind that the revenue department priced it about exactly the same.

Let's say, I would rather travel that Friday. Cash prices for that day range from $173 and up, the afternoon flights are $454 largely because that afternoon SWO-DFW flight is quite full due to it being right before the Fall/Thanksgiving university holiday. The cheapest awards flight that day though is 29K points (ONE WAY) for one of the early flight. (All afternoon flights are 50K points). So, the value per mile is less than a cent per mile no matter what you do that day -- even if you take a cheap morning flight that doesn't cost a lot in cash they want 29K points + for it.

And I spent zero time 'searching' for this data, it was just the first random flight/date I came up with. Aadvantage miles are just as (or more) worthless as skypesos on domestic coach flights unless you find that one day and odd flight that you are willing to take. 1 cent per mile redemptions and following the same demand/supply dynamics that governs cash prices is at least honest about the value of the miles and allows you to use them for the flights you actually are wanting to take.

I work in a unversity town. I wonder how many parents have a million miles saved over years thinking they will use them to fly their kid home on Thanksgiving break, only to find that the value of the miles to fly them at those specific times are devalued to 0.6 cents per mile (or worse).
This is very much a YMMV situation. I retired to a university town, and on November 17, I can fly from ITH to SEA for 10,000 miles on the fastest (single-connection) itinerary, or 6,000 miles for the slower, double-connection itinerary. The cash price for each is just over $200, so you'd get 2/mile on the fast connection, and 3.3/mile on the slower one. But on November 19, both cash and mileage fares on that route are much higher, and you'd get poor value with a mileage redemption.
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Old Sep 30, 2021 | 1:50 pm
  #53  
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Originally Posted by donotblink
I think AA will move to a general rule where each mile will be worth .8 cents for general members, 1 cent per mile for credit card holders and gold members, 1.2 cents per mile for platinum members, 1.4 cents per mile for platinum pro, 1.6 cents per mile for Executive Platinum and 2 cents per mile for concierge key.

I think they might move to a fixed spending amount for status:

$250,000 per year for Concierge Key
$25,000 per year for EXP
$20,000 per year for Platinum Pro
$15,000 per year for Platinum
$10,000 per year for Gold
I bet you'd be able to get $10k EQDs by spending $100k in a year on the Barclays Silver card

I also think they could further reduce the number of SWUs for EXP down to 2, but you will get an additional 2 for every $5k you spend over $25k

I think if this happens I'll probably switch to Delta
No chance whatsoever it would be anywhere close to those numbers. Those numbers are pure craziness.
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Old Sep 30, 2021 | 1:55 pm
  #54  
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Originally Posted by js1993
No chance whatsoever it would be anywhere close to those numbers.
While I agree AA may well move to EQDs only (which isn't any major change) I think those numbers a bit steep for now. With International business travel really still down with no end in sight and some companies still not traveling/doing in person events the number of elites qualifying normally has to be significantly down.

Now if business travel returns to 2019 levels I'd wager money EQDs will go up but (hopefully) not that level. $250K for CK? How many people actually spend that kind of money in a year and couldn't they just fly private?
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Old Sep 30, 2021 | 1:59 pm
  #55  
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Originally Posted by js1993
No chance whatsoever it would be anywhere close to those numbers. Those numbers are pure craziness.
$250K for CK is way out of line w/ reality. At my old employer, our highest spending travelers - folks out of the country for half the year or more - were spending around $150K max, and that was inclusive of hotel, air fare, meals, etc.
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Old Sep 30, 2021 | 1:59 pm
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Originally Posted by MiamiAirport Formerly NY George
While I agree AA may well move to EQDs only (which isn't any major change) I think those numbers a bit steep for now. With International business travel really still down with no end in sight and some companies still not traveling/doing in person events the number of elites qualifying normally has to be significantly down.

Now if business travel returns to 2019 levels I'd wager money EQDs will go up but (hopefully) not that level. $250K for CK? How many people actually spend that kind of money in a year and couldn't they just fly private?
Almost nobody.

The current EXP EQD is $12,000, or $9,000 to re-qualify. Now Gold is going to be $10,000? No chance. Business travel would not only have to recover to 2019 levels, it would have to double 2019 for the numbers above to make sense. AA might have to show some tough love in 2022, but it does not have an elite-overpopulation problem right now and it won’t have one a year from now.
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Old Sep 30, 2021 | 2:04 pm
  #57  
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Originally Posted by PresRDC
$250K for CK is way out of line w/ reality. At my old employer, our highest spending travelers - folks out of the country for half the year or more - were spending around $150K max, and that was inclusive of hotel, air fare, meals, etc.
Doesn't Delta have some asinine $250K for their highest tier?
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Old Sep 30, 2021 | 2:07 pm
  #58  
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Originally Posted by js1993
Almost nobody.

The current EXP EQD is $12,000, or $9,000 to re-qualify. Now Gold is going to be $10,000? No chance. Business travel would not only have to recover to 2019 levels, it would have to double 2019 for the numbers above to make sense. AA might have to show some tough love in 2022, but it does not have an elite-overpopulation problem right now and it wont have one a year from now.
EXP is $15,000 going forward so I expect to see $18-20,000 EQD with mixed with min flights or $24,000 EQD alone to match United. They might do temp lower levels as long as covid drags out but it wont last.
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Old Sep 30, 2021 | 2:11 pm
  #59  
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Originally Posted by enviroian
Doesn't Delta have some asinine $250K for their highest tier?
They'll waive the EQD requirement for Diamond if you spend $250,000 on one of their credit cards. (For lower tiers, the waiver requirement is $25,000.)
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Old Sep 30, 2021 | 2:20 pm
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Originally Posted by olouie
EXP is $15,000 going forward so I expect to see $18-20,000 EQD with mixed with min flights or $24,000 EQD alone to match United. They might do temp lower levels as long as covid drags out but it won’t last.
No chance. AA wouldn’t be letting people re-qualify at $9,000 if spending was this strong. AA might reduce EXP benefits, but there’s no way AA is going to increase EXP EQD from $9,000 this year to $18,000+ next year.
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