ksucats

I am a worrier about stuff like that. I would have booked 48 hours in between and planned for a day or two in DC if things went to plan. If things didn't go to plan, I would have been able to drive if not able to find another flight that got me there with 24 hours to spare. That is what I have always done when I booked a cruise that required a flight. (I have never done two flights on different reservations yet, but would do that if I found the right deal. Heck, I may start looking at those options more frequently now that it will just be my wife and I as the kids are about to both be out of the house.) I also would make sure I have good insurance. (Not sure what I will use for insurance going forward now that the AA credit card is losing that benefit.)

svasandani

So if instead of an intl flight out of IAD I was supposed to attend a Superbowl game next day at 6PM in DC and there was no way AA could get me to DC in time and I decided to return home because it would make no sense flying to DC after the Superbowl is over. Are you suggesting AA would have no liability because I could not see the Superbowl in person and lost out on a $1000 ticket. (assuming I was not able to resell the ticket). Alternatively, I bought a ticket on UA for $1000 got to DC on time to enjoy the Superbowl. In both cases AA's only liability would be just refunding the original ticket price and nothing else?

Dave Noble

Correct - AA is not liable for consequential losses

svasandani

Wow. And when they deliberately overbook flights and then ask for volunteers at gate who can take a 2 hour later flight for which they are willing to pay out $400. The volunteers in all likelyhood did not mind at all reaching 2 hours late got compensated $400. Involuntary removal is much worse after David Dao incident.

Dave Noble

If a passenger is involuntarily denied boarding due to oversell, then there is legally defined compensation that the airline is liable to pay - that is the limit of its liability

USFlyerUS

Correct.

svasandani

In other words we should lobby congress for more regulation on airlines or else they would not do anything for the customer. Also, why do they pay $400+ for voluntary deferral is that also governed by law or because they fear that involuntary denied boarding would be more costly because of regulation.

USFlyerUS

Almost every contract typically has some sort of limit of liability. It's not reasonable for an airline to be liable for every downstream impact of a flight delay or cancellation. There has to be a limit. If not, everyone would be filing claims for every little thing that happened, big and small, due to a delay or cancellation, which could easily bankrupt the airline since it would otherwise become uninsurable for liability claims. Hence, the regulations have what I believe are reasonable guidelines clearly defining the liability in such situations.

I'm sorry you feel we're not supporting you. Many here typically do not take AA's side. However, I really think in this case your expectations are not in line with reality. AA (or BA) owe you a refund of the tickets to whatever form of payment was used. And, AA was obligated to get your bags back to you at DFW once you cancelled, which I believe happened unless I misread a post. The fact that in and of itself took a long time also seems reasonable given the operational mess than ensued after the weather and ATC issues. That's really it. Liability for the risk you took by booking separate tickets, choosing alternative means of travel, not being able to wait for your bags in DFW due to your alternate travel, and so forth is not reasonable.

svasandani

I am not saying there have to be no limits on liability. I am not stupid that if I ask for $10k that they would just give it to me but it also dos not mean they have no liability at all. If they can hand out a $400 travel voucher for something as simple as taking a flight 2 hours later I am hoping most would agree that the inconvenience caused here was more than to the person who chose to take a 2 hour later flight.However at the end of the day it does not matter what everybody's opinion is on Flyertalk. It is all in AA's hands.
Also, this is just a friendly discussion to hear other viewpoints and learn from it.
I have already filed my Complaint with AA Customer relations and waiting to hear back. Nobody here will be able to help influence the outcome. of my dialogue with them. Just have to wait and see what happens.

Often1

There is no air carrier which covers consequential damages and there is also no regulatory system which provides for anything other than fixed amounts for certain delays and various forms of denied boarding. That is true no matter the reason for the delay. Certainly not limited to AA.

You used the example of the $1,000 Super Bowl ticket, but I would then ask about a $2,000 ticket, a $10,000 cruise, or a $100,000 sales commission. Given that the cost of compensation is wrapped into expenses, this all plays into ticket cost.

The chances of reinstituting broad-based regulation of this type in the US are somewhat less than zero. The ADA got rid of this back in 1984 and air tickets are now generally cheaper (adjusted for COL) than they were at the time. Be careful what you wish for.

Bottom line here is that it's a risk you bear.

svasandani

I think you took my $1000 ticket example too literally. I also not in favor of too much regulation. I would rather hope that the airlines act fairly and provide some form of structured compensation on their own. They can establish fixed compensation for diff tiers of delays or cancellations. e.g. last year i was flying Qatar and my bag did not reach the final destination but was delivered the following day. They asked me to keep receipts for purchases I make till the bags are delivered but also stated that the max they would reimburse is $150. That sounded fair and reasonable. They want to make sure that people don't abuse the system by buying designer suit. If they can pay $150 for delivering a bag 24 hours later and $400 to take a flight 2 hours later voluntarily then can surely do better than just refunding the ticket. for cancelled flights. The inconvenience caused to the passenger is much greater than the previous 2 examples. What makes it even worse is that almost all airline tickets are non-refundable. So, in other words they can cancel the ticket unilaterally (even if it is their fault) and all they owe you is the cost you paid but if you try to cancel the ticket. then you have to pay a huge penalty. If you remember, there was time when the DOT made them honor all the mistake fares. (now they have relaxed the rules because in some cases it got exploited a bit too much) though many of them still honor it many cases.

rumboj

Mwenenzi

That was the Montreal / Warsaw Conventions in play
--> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Montreal_Convention
--> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warsaw_Convention
The chances of USA adopting a EC261 - 2004 type law are low. Anyway as the OP's problem was weather / ATC related would not apply

svasandani

I have sent them an email today. Will definitely update this thread once I hear back from them.

Often1

My only disagreement with your assessment is that the chances are "low". They are non-existent.

Rather than having the government playing Nanny, the US (as well as almost the rest of the world excepting Turkey and Israel) did not follow EC 261/2004 and a market for travel insurance thrives.